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Propostion 32 will silence middle-class Californians

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Posted: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 12:00 am | Updated: 6:46 am, Wed Sep 19, 2012.

In a letter to the editor on Wednesday, Sept. 12, Phyllis Roche attacks the California Teachers Association and other labor unions as leading problems in California politics. In her letter she states that Proposition 32 would "deal with how the beast is fed."

In reality, Proposition 32 will do nothing to reform California politics, but will open the door for super-PACs and the uber-wealthy to rewrite California politics to suit themselves while completely silencing middle-class Californians from having any voice in decisions that affect their working conditions, safety and education of our children.

Propostion 32 will prohibit all unions from using payroll deductions to collect dues, as well as using any dues for political action. The irony of this is that corporations do not use employee payroll deductions to fund political action, they use their profits. Already, corporations outspend unions 15 to 1!

Sponsored by the Lincoln Club of Orange County (the same people who brought the Citizens United lawsuit creating Super PACs to the Supreme Court), Proposition 32 exempts oil companies, and other Limited Liability Corporations (LLCs). "... That would just expand unaccountable independent expenditure committees, the super-PACs." — Los Angeles Times, George Skelton, April 26.

Proposition 32 is completely unfair — it eliminates a constitutional right to free speech for most middle-class Californians in a thinly veiled attempt at political reform which exempts the biggest contributors of campaign finance.

Labor unions stand up for the middle class, and always have. Your local firefighters, teachers, police officers, nurses, city, county and state workers have long fought for rights that benefit us all. Proposition 32 takes away the ability of these everyday heroes to speak out on issues that matter to us all — like cuts to our schools and colleges, police and fire response times, workplace safety, consumer protections, homeowner rights and unfair corporate tax giveaways.

Proposition 32 is unrealistic and unfair. We urge you to vote "No" on Proposition 32!

Jeff Johnston

President

Lodi Education Association

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Welcome to the discussion.

64 comments:

  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 11:52 am on Tue, Sep 25, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms Bobin stated...what idiocy. Believe me, he gladly paid his union dues when he was "forced" to also.

    Besides, this comment was in reply to Mr. Scott who contends that teachers WOULDN'T PAY if given the choice. Wrong.


    Clearly Ms Bobin, many teachers would still join the union because they have been brain washed. Others, who are independent, think for themselves and are quality teachers, can and would get rid of their union membership. Again, it is amazing that some are pro choice when it comes to giving the right to woman to kill their unborn baby, but “anti-choice” when it comes to a person's right to join or not join a union. Inexplicable!

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 2:57 pm on Sat, Sep 22, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405


    Robert. Great point!

    Existing laws, regulations and mandates as well as government oversight departments exist no matter if unions exist or not.

    You normally bring substance to the discussion. I assume it is a result of developing wisdom over the years from running your own business and having to work in the system.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 12:26 pm on Sat, Sep 22, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2830

    Let's look at #28 Ms. Bobin. Are you saying you are opposed to this?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 12:18 pm on Sat, Sep 22, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2830

    I don't think even Ms. Bobin could say none of these goals have been met. Given there are different forms of Communism. The general interpretation of Cummunism is it's negative effects on a society. Not that i'm a proponent of communism. I think Darrell could confer with me there is a time and a place for everything. Within moderation, of course. Much of my statement above puts Ms. Bobin in a situation where if she ridicules me she is, in turn, also ridiculing Pres. Obama. and his administration.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 10:43 am on Sat, Sep 22, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2830

    -Watch out Ms. Bobin. I'm a Communist at heart. :~


    The Communist Takeover Of
    America - 45 Declared Goals
    From Greg Swank
    12-4-2

    You are about to read a list of 45 goals that found their way down the halls of our great Capitol back in 1963. As you read this, 39 years later, you should be shocked by the events that have played themselves out. I first ran across this list 3 years ago but was unable to attain a copy and it has bothered me ever since. Recently, Jeff Rense posted it on his site and I would like to thank him for doing so. http://www.rense.com

    Communist Goals (1963) Congressional Record--Appendix, pp. A34-A35 January 10, 1963

    Current Communist Goals EXTENSION OF REMARKS OF HON. A. S. HERLONG, JR. OF FLORIDA IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES Thursday, January 10, 1963 .

    Mr. HERLONG. Mr. Speaker, Mrs. Patricia Nordman of De Land, Fla., is an ardent and articulate opponent of communism, and until recently published the De Land Courier, which she dedicated to the purpose of alerting the public to the dangers of communism in America.

    At Mrs. Nordman's request, I include in the RECORD, under unanimous consent, the following "Current Communist Goals," which she identifies as an excerpt from "The Naked Communist," by Cleon Skousen:

    [From "The Naked Communist," by Cleon Skousen]

    1. U.S. acceptance of coexistence as the only alternative to atomic war.

    2. U.S. willingness to capitulate in preference to engaging in atomic war.

    3. Develop the illusion that total disarmament [by] the United States would be a demonstration of moral strength.

    4. Permit free trade between all nations regardless of Communist affiliation and regardless of whether or not items could be used for war.

    5. Extension of long-term loans to Russia and Soviet satellites.

    6. Provide American aid to all nations regardless of Communist domination.

    7. Grant recognition of Red China. Admission of Red China to the U.N.

    8. Set up East and West Germany as separate states in spite of Khrushchev's promise in 1955 to settle the German question by free elections under supervision of the U.N.

    9. Prolong the conferences to ban atomic tests because the United States has agreed to suspend tests as long as negotiations are in progress.

    10. Allow all Soviet satellites individual representation in the U.N.

    11. Promote the U.N. as the only hope for mankind. If its charter is rewritten, demand that it be set up as a one-world government with its own independent armed forces. (Some Communist leaders believe the world can be taken over as easily by the U.N. as by Moscow. Sometimes these two centers compete with each other as they are now doing in the Congo.)

    12. Resist any attempt to outlaw the Communist Party.

    13. Do away with all loyalty oaths.

    14. Continue giving Russia access to the U.S. Patent Office.

    15. Capture one or both of the political parties in the United States.

    16. Use technical decisions of the courts to weaken basic American institutions by claiming their activities violate civil rights.

    17. Get control of the schools. Use them as transmission belts for socialism and current Communist propaganda. Soften the curriculum. Get control of teachers' associations. Put the party line in textbooks.

    18. Gain control of all student newspapers.

    19. Use student riots to foment public protests against programs or organizations which are under Communist attack.

    20. Infiltrate the press. Get control of book-review assignments, editorial writing, policy-making positions.

    21. Gain control of key positions in radio, TV, and motion pictures.

    22. Continue discrediting American culture by degrading all forms of artistic expression. An American Communist cell was told to "eliminate all good sculpture from parks and buildings, substitute shapeless, awkward and meaningless forms."

    23. Control art critics and directors of art museums. "Our plan is to promote ugliness, repulsive, meaningless art."

    24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them "censorship" and a violation of free speech and free press.

    25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.

    26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as "normal, natural, healthy."

    27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with "social" religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity, which does not need a "religious crutch."

    28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of "separation of church and state."

    29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.

    30. Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the "common man."

    31. Belittle all forms of American culture and discourage the teaching of American history on the ground that it was only a minor part of the "big picture." Give more emphasis to Russian history since the Communists took over.

    32. Support any socialist movement to give centralized control over any part of the culture--education, social agencies, welfare programs, mental health clinics, etc.

    33. Eliminate all laws or procedures which interfere with the operation of the Communist apparatus.

    34. Eliminate the House Committee on Un-American Activities.

    35. Discredit and eventually dismantle the FBI.

    36. Infiltrate and gain control of more unions.

    37. Infiltrate and gain control of big business.

    38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat].

    39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals.

    40. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce.

    41. Emphasize the need to raise children away from the negative influence of parents. Attribute prejudices, mental blocks and retarding of children to suppressive influence of parents.

    42. Create the impression that violence and insurrection are legitimate aspects of the American tradition; that students and special-interest groups should rise up and use ["]united force["] to solve economic, political or social problems.

    43. Overthrow all colonial governments before native populations are ready for self-government.

    44. Internationalize the Panama Canal.

    45. Repeal the Connally reservation so the United States cannot prevent the World Court from seizing jurisdiction [over domestic problems. Give the World Court jurisdiction] over nations and individuals alike.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 10:36 am on Sat, Sep 22, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2830

    Ms.Bobin wrote:

    Have you been living under a rock down there in the desert? Every single anti-Obama letter to this paper includes "communist, socialist, Marxist, Stalinist, and on and on.

    -Chuckle,
    if the shoe fits. It's hard to overlook his many MO's. The many people who are going to vote for B.O. are only interested in his curb appeal. Not the foundation. Also, Many American Indians have an entitlement attitude. Are you saying none, if any Union workers don't?

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 10:07 am on Sat, Sep 22, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Mr. Docktor wrote: "And now the new word, Communist."

    Have you been living under a rock down there in the desert? Every single anti-Obama letter to this paper includes "communist, socialist, Marxist, Stalinist, and on and on.

    Mr. Docktor wrote: "This really isn't much different than the checks American Indians living on reservations receive from the government."

    OH JOY!! If only I could be an "American Indian" living on some p iss-poor reservation just waiting for my monthly check. Can't imagine any better way to live.

    That comment perfectly illustrates the mentality of people like Mr. Docktor.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:53 am on Sat, Sep 22, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    what idiocy. Believe me, he gladly paid his union dues when he was "forced" to also.

    Besides, this comment was in reply to Mr. Scott who contends that teachers WOULDN'T PAY if given the choice. Wrong.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 9:31 am on Sat, Sep 22, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2830

    Ms. Bobin wrote:

    Are you a communist at heart, Mr. Docktor? How far into people's pockets are YOU will to reach in order to control their incomes, their behavior, every aspect of their lives?

    -Actually, If Ms. Bobin had any sense she would be addressing these questions to Mr. Lucas or Pres. Obama. Nonetheless, we all know the typical liberal replies in order to end the conversation. Bigot, Racist, Homophobe, Xenophobe, etc. And now the new word, Communist. Frankly, I don't know why. After all, It is one of the unions
    beliefs that one should receive equal pay as others regardless of merit or ability. This really isn't much different than the checks American Indians living on reservations receive from the government. They are pretty much all the same amount. Reparations comes to mind., This is curiosly similar to how unions work.
    But how the reparations come into play is something to be pondered.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 5:45 am on Sat, Sep 22, 2012.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    Mr. Heuer, I have made no disparaging remarks about teachers or public employees. If you have perceived the fact that I have made disparaging remarks about UNIONS, you would be correct.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 5:43 am on Sat, Sep 22, 2012.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    I wonder why it is that some people feel obligated to drag up ancient history to justify present day arguments. There are plenty of labor laws on the books to keep employers from "abusing" employees. Ever heard of the Department of Labor? I suggest you look it up, study their purpose and then get back to me on why you think we still need Unions to make American workplace better than the DOL already does.
    I have been involved with lots of non-profits in my lifetime, but none that condone corruption, extortion and thuggery to survive.

     
  • Thomas Heuer posted at 11:55 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    nth degree wise Posts: 1459

    In my above post where it says "white color" should be "white collar". my bad.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 11:19 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mr Heuer, you live in La La land... nobody but nobody advocates what you are suggesting...

    Absurdity in motion is Mr Heuer in this instance.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 11:17 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    sounds like a freudian slip

     
  • Thomas Heuer posted at 10:06 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    nth degree wise Posts: 1459

    You obviously don't understand noprofits among other things..

     
  • Thomas Heuer posted at 10:03 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    nth degree wise Posts: 1459

    In the good ole days of Andrew Carnegie there was the notion that the employees of a company were owned by the company. Is this where we want to go back to?

     
  • Thomas Heuer posted at 9:50 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    nth degree wise Posts: 1459

    The following post where it says "white color" should be "white collar". my bad.

     
  • Thomas Heuer posted at 9:44 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    nth degree wise Posts: 1459

    Mr Chapman what is it you don't understand about a constitutional republic. The constitution lays out our form of government which has a legislature we elected which passes laws which would be worthless without the means of enforcing them. Our elected legilature puts up the money to hire the enforcement people and other general business people.These are the people we hired via the representatives we elected. If you are going to hire employees they need some form of representation. There was a time before unions that if the legislature gave itself a raise the workforce got a raise. When the legislature said state employees will have collective bargaining all of a sudden there weren't as many pay raises howeve the legisature continued to give itself raises without benefit to the employees. Bargaining units were able to address the specific working needs of the different classes of workers. Now the unions give to both parties. It is not patisan per se. It will give to whomever will benefit the workers. That is usually the democrats but not always. There is not enough space here to cover the nuances. Republicans have tried to make a wedge issue that people are forced to join. Member participation is decided on by the membership. They vote and realizing why should some pay dues while others not paying get the benefits. Representation costs money. Now even a republican can understand this logic. Even the mandate in Obama care was a republican idea. Democrats do not negotiate benefits the unions do. Even unions themselves can be voted out if the membership chooses. This has occured many times. Most pay negotiations are compared to the private sector and what gets negotiated reflects it. Now the comparable sectors are usually white color or other professional. When nurses are hired the private sector is used to determine State nurse pay. If you are going to hire you can't expect less than the going rate. So where you think there is forced compliance is actually a democratic decision via our vote of our elected officials and the workers themelves.
    PS my daughter is a special ed teacher works long hours and spends her own money for class materials since all budgets are cut so I really dislike disparaging remarks by conservatives about teachers and state workers in general.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 7:53 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    MMr Heuer stated... Proposition 32 is about the greed

    Couldn't agree more. Unions are very greedy and by force take money from union members. This bill is a bill that favors the working man and deals with union greed.

    Vote yes on 32

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 7:50 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    [offtopic][thumbdown]

     
  • Walter Chang posted at 7:37 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Walt Posts: 1117

    "fund the Democratic Party at the same time"

    [lol]

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 7:35 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mr Lucas stated....How people miss the freedom to work 80 hour weeks without overtime pay. The freedom to haves one's wages so low one cannot have a middle class lifestyle. The freedom to enjoy the thrill of taking chances in an unsafe work environment. You are right it is a freedom issue

    I am not in a union and worked 16 hour days for decades. I have never received overtime pay. I do not feel bad, I got what I earned. Only union people expect, demand and foam at the mouth if they do not get more that they deserve.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 7:28 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms Bobin stated...When my husband became an administrator he insisted on continuing his CTA membership which is entirely VOLUNTARY for administrators

    Oh my, Ms Bobin sees nothing wrong in forcing teachers to be unon members yet her husband enjoyed the freedom to decide if he wanted to join or not.

    hummmmm...

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 4:53 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    If Unions are truly non-profit, they should only collect what they need for their overhead and members benefits. They seem to have MULTI MILLIONS to donate to politicians.,I believe it would be fair to force the Unions to send rebate checks for the money the Unions FORCED their members to pay and didn't use for member benefits and expenses. It should be ILLEGAL for any collective bargaining unit, especially ones representing public employees, to donate anything to any political affiliation.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 4:20 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    It is an inherent conflict of interest for public employees to form unions and bargain collectively and here’s why:
    Tax payers pay public employees; public employees “MUST” pay union dues; unions donate 92%+ to the Democratic Party and union members have “NO” say about it; Democratic Party returns favor by enacting favorable legislation to unions; elected Democrats negotiate benefits with public employees; public employees receive better benefits then the average taxpayer; the taxpayer is “FORCED” to pay taxes by the state/federal government’s policing power and hence forced to pay for those benefits and in effect forced to donate to the Democratic Party.

    To the public sector union member employees who argue that “I am also a taxpayer” — yes you are, but you do not pay yourself. Let’s say you are the State and your spouse is your Employee. You, the State, earn $3,000 a week and you pay your spouse, your Employee, $1,000 a week, and you also tax her/his income 30% ($300) which is payable back to you, the State. Is your family making $4,300 per week? No, your family still has only $3,000. See the problem here? You union-member public employees do not pay yourself. We, “non public sector employee” taxpayers, pay your salary + benefits (i.e. healthcare, pension, etc.), and we are getting taxed to death and most are working until we are 70 so you can retire at 55 with all your benefits. You work for us, and it is a travesty that we have to pay for the exorbitant benefits you receive and fund the Democratic Party at the same time.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 1:22 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Are you a communist at heart, Mr. Docktor? How far into people's pockets are YOU will to reach in order to control their incomes, their behavior, every aspect of their lives? Union members also pay taxes. They are not tax exempt, but for some reason people think public employees should have the permission of all of the other "tax payers" before they spend of dime of their earnings.

    It would be like the public voting on what kind of car you could drive because tax payer money goes toward building roads and highways. Just how far does it go?

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 1:15 pm on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Mr. Jackson Scott wrote: "This is the meat of the proposition and is what scares the unions to death. Why? Because the vast majority of union members will not pay dues if they had their choice, ESPECIALLY your neighbors & friends... TEACHERS!"

    Really? Do you truly believe this to be true, Mr. Scott? If so, you have no idea of the multitude of benefits that union membership affords, especially for educators.

    When my husband became an administrator he insisted on continuing his CTA membership which is entirely VOLUNTARY for administrators. Since it meant writing a check in the full amount of the annual dues each year (at that time around $600-$700), I thought it was unnecessary and a strain on our budget. Fortunately, he insisted.

    Surprise, surprise - 6 months into the school year a student accused him of "smacking" him in the arm with his walkie-talkie during the passing period between classes. As I'm sure you are probably NOT aware, an accusation of this type involves a police investigation and the DA's office, i.e., potential criminal charges.

    Thanks to his union membership, he was able to obtain legal assistance - an attorney of his choosing.

    Months later - after the student finally confessed that he made the whole thing up and that his mother had encouraged him to keep up the lie because she was upset that her little boy had received a one-day suspension from my husband immediately prior to the "incident," (the boy also confessed that his mom wanted to collect a big check for civil damages) the total legal bill amounted to over $50,000, of which we still had to pay about $5,000.

    Never again did I complain about union dues.

    Any teacher will tell you that at any moment they can be accused of wrong-doing by a student or parent. No teacher would dare to be in a classroom with the door closed with only one student present Without that particular "benefit" my husband could have lost everything - been stripped of his teacher and administrative credentials - lost his entire career and our home.

    You can scoff all you like about unions - especially teacher unions, but I doubt that you would find few teachers who would abandon their memberships.

     
  • John Lucas posted at 3:44 am on Fri, Sep 21, 2012.

    John Lucas Posts: 2730

    Darrell said:
    Thats because people who appreciate the freedom to decide one's destiny
    reject unions as they force people to join and pay dues... its a freedom issue.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------
    How true. How people miss the freedom to work 80 hour weeks without overtime pay. The freedom to haves one's wages so low one cannot have a middle class lifestyle. The freedom to enjoy the thrill of taking chances in an unsafe work environment. You are right it is a freedom issue

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:02 pm on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Is that what you think? may I suggest a strong cup of french roast to wake you up.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:00 pm on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mr Heuer stated...Labor unions represented working people intimidated by their bosses from speaking out about their working conditions

    No wonder you "perceive" unions have merit... someday, you will grow out of your childhood fantasies and fables then stop believing in the Easter Bunny as well.

    Unions do not represent anyone... they force people to let them steel their money in the form of dues...

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 9:50 pm on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    bizarre comments Ms Bobin...I was right, your imagination is fertile.

    vidio tape? Baumbach name... Police...

    You forgot the bigots Ms Bobin... Im sure they are all there[lol][beam]

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 9:44 pm on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Thats because people who appreciate the freedom to decide one's destiny
    reject unions as they force people to join and pay dues... its a freedom issue.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 5:46 pm on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2830


    Ms. Bobin wrote:

    FYI, UNIONS are non-profit organizations.

    -Yep,

    And this bolsters the fact that unions rely heavily on government subsidies. In other words, when union workers get a pay raise it is taxpayer funded. And the tax free muncipal bonds people buy when the municipalities sell them only increase the size of government.

     
  • Walter Chang posted at 3:56 pm on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Walt Posts: 1117

    Darrell, I think you got your mirror from a carnival fun house!!!

    [tongue]

     
  • Thomas Heuer posted at 12:51 pm on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    nth degree wise Posts: 1459

    If the word union shows up anywhere you will get the Pavlovian response from Kim Paragolis demonizing unions without knowing that much about them. So Scott is correct in knowing what to expect from her.

     
  • Thomas Heuer posted at 12:41 pm on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    nth degree wise Posts: 1459

    Please don't be complicite in taking away any last vestiges of the peoples political voice and give it all up to a wealthy few.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 12:00 pm on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mr Scott writes...We all know what Joanne, Kim, Kevin & Darrell are going to write.

    Mr Scott must be reading my mind, he articulated his position which mirrors my position exactly... good job!

     
  • Jackson Scott posted at 10:46 am on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Jackson Scott Posts: 386

    Sigh... the comments on this LTE are so predictable. Same blowhards, same opinions, etc. We all know what Joanne, Kim, Kevin & Darrell are going to write. If Doug were still around he'd be trying to blame this on the Lodi City Council somehow, lol. With that said...

    Jeff Johnston writes, "Propostion 32 will prohibit all unions from using payroll deductions to collect dues, as well as using any dues for political action."

    This is the meat of the proposition and is what scares the unions to death. Why? Because the vast majority of union members will not pay dues if they had their choice, ESPECIALLY your neighbors & friends... TEACHERS!

    No dues = No money = No power.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:09 am on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Mr. Paglia wrote: "Anyone else a little unnerved that someone as venomous as Ms Bobin would stalk someone she so strongly disagrees with to the point of knowing WHERE they work?"

    If you were paying attention, Mr. Paglia - sorry to divert your attention from cycling, motorcycling and whatever else you do when not working, Ms. Parigoris has been listed as a political contributor to local campaigns and her OCCUPATION AND COMPANY were disclosed in those articles. I have not stalked her - she has put herself out in the public forum and, as such, is subject to commentary, as would you if there was an article about unemployed individuals in Lodi who like to cycle and motorcycle.

     
  • Kim Parigoris posted at 8:13 am on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Kim Parigoris Posts: 470

    Public employee unions have now contributed over 32 MILLION dollars of our Tax dollars against Prop 32..
    Thomas Hedge has contributed 500,000 Thomas Steyer is the founder and co-senior managing partner of Farallon Capital Management. CNN has described him as "California's hedge fund king."[1] Wonder what he is getting out of this..I thought it was just the poor little civil servants that were giving to the NO vote.. Nasty big business giving too?

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 12:09 am on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    Kevin,
    I'm a little more concerned that she believes entering the United States illegally isn't illegal... [rolleyes]

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 12:07 am on Thu, Sep 20, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    I hope the next time you are at a post office Ms.Bobin you decide to go inside and educate and inform yourself about the SDR's to dollar conversion tables you like to pretend don't exist...[lol]

     
  • Thomas Heuer posted at 11:53 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    nth degree wise Posts: 1459

    Proposition 32 is about the greed of a few to rob California. It deserves a resounding NO vote. Its about greed not politics. Another middle class attack by " the same people who brought the Citizens United lawsuit creating Super PACs to the Supreme Court."

    Labor unions represented working people intimidated by their bosses from speaking out about their working conditions and fair share of the fruits of their labor. The conntinued attacks on Unions is one of the many reasons the rich are getting richer and the middle class is slipping more and more into poverty.

     
  • Thomas Heuer posted at 11:14 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    nth degree wise Posts: 1459

    Kevin I don't know if you are drawing a wrong conclusion or making an accusation?

     
  • Kevin Paglia posted at 6:42 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Kevin Paglia Posts: 2014

    [scared]

    Anyone else a little unnerved that someone as venomous as Ms Bobin would stalk someone she so strongly disagrees with to the point of knowing WHERE they work?

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 6:42 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Mr. Baumbach wrote: "Then Ms Bobin is a better actor than president Obama and Reagan... That is very impressive!"

    So, Mr. Baumbach, you ADMIT that Ronald Reagan ACTED his way through 8 years as president. And I only thought he SLEPT through those 8 years!

    Mr. Baumbach wrote: "In my opinion, I think Ms Bobin has a very fertile imagination and must have learned her etiquette and manners from "Lucas World Finishing School, Inc.”. My imagination however is very limited unfortunately as I cannot imagine how Ms Bobin can change so drastic from one minute to the next.
    But then again, there is the Jekyll and Hyde fable to consider."

    As YOU somehow "convince" your clients to invest in the plans that you recommend, others are able to conduct business in a manner separate from their political beliefs. You are not one of them.

    "Change so drastic?" And you criticize the public education system? You must be one that was unable to keep up with the rest of the class.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 6:35 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Mr. Baumbach wrote: "I was not aware that terrorist organizations were union... "

    I hope the next time you are confronted outside the Woodbridge post office for video taping the building, the officers who question you are non-union members. Or they don't recognize the Baumbach name for your sake.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 5:39 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Yes Mr Chang, the quality of your posts indicates that you have been asleep at the wheel for quite sometime... it is a little redundant don't you think?
    [whistling]

     
  • Walter Chang posted at 4:53 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Walt Posts: 1117

    [sleeping][yawn][sleeping]

    ZZZZZZzzzzzz......

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 1:38 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    [sleeping]

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 1:34 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    should have been, I did not realize terrorist organizations were considered non profits

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 1:33 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    I was not aware that terrorist organizations were union...

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 1:32 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms Bobin stated...they are my customers and I treat every single one with respect, confidentiality, and the utmost "customer service."

    Then Ms Bobin is a better actor than president Obama and Reagan... That is very impressive!

    In my opinion, I think Ms Bobin has a very fertile imagination and must have learned her etiquette and manners from "Lucas World Finishing School, Inc.”. My imagination however is very limited unfortunately as I cannot imagine how Ms Bobin can change so drastic from one minute to the next.
    But then again, there is the Jekyll and Hyde fable to consider.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 12:30 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    I would predict that I would be much more successful than the person you mention (since I don't want to be accused of making personal attacks - which I DID NOT - I only asked 2 questions).

    Since Ms. Parigoris is quite known in this forum for being judgmental toward certain segments of society, I would likely increase the amount of business her company receives.

    Most of my work experience is working FOR the employees of the various companies I have where I have been employed - they are my customers and I treat every single one with respect, confidentiality, and the utmost "customer service."

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 12:23 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    FYI, UNIONS are non-profit organizations.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 12:21 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    ....using YOUR TAXPAYER DOLLARS to purchase birth control! What do you think Public Employees have taken out of their paychecks? TAX DOLLARS. In essence, they are helping to fund their own paychecks.

    I'd be willing to bet that Ms. Parigoris's company, a major supplier of concrete products, receives contracts from public agencies. That makes HER PAYCHECK TAXPAYER FUNDED.

    The ignorance that is displayed by the TEA Party and its representatives, particulary here in Lodi, is astounding!

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 12:16 pm on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Sadly, Ms. Parigoris, if you were "sitting on a beach in Maui, I would then mock you for taking time out from a wonderful vacation to post nonsense here.

    Ms. Parigoris wrote: "To your second question, my tax dollars pay public employees, public employee dues are extracted from that pay to fund the unions.. Without my tax dollars there would be no salaries to pay the union dues- it is actually rather simple, but many people who have always been on the public sector payroll see their salaries as manna from Heaven, or it just comes off the government money tree. That government money tree is tax dollars as the government does not have any revenue other than tax dollars."

    This is particulary hilarious! How far into a Public Employee's business do YOU want to get. Do YOU (and Mr. Baumbach, who is just as ignorant as you), want to dictate HOW Public Employees use their "taxpayer funded salaries?"

    Do you DEMAND that you check their pantries to make sure they are buying the foods that you approve? Do you want to go into their bedrooms to make sure they are not purchasing the birth control that you disapprove? Oh, that's right, you do want to make sure they are not using YOUR TAXPAYER DOLLARS

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:13 am on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Kim stated...Without my tax dollars there would be no salaries to pay the union dues- it is actually rather simple

    Exactly... employers are leaving California and taking jobs with them to states and countries that are more business friendly. The tax revenue California was enjoying is going with them... Organizations that depend on tax revenue to fund there business opperations and pay salaries, are now laying off employs since we are in such bad shape since tax revenues are diminishing daily.

    Unfortunately, non profit organizations that are important to California are suffering because of this. Very unfortunate Brown, who has no business ideas, was elected governor.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:06 am on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Kim stated......I will now sign off this site as I refuse to be pulled in to an absurd discussion with someone who is going to start posting ugly and personal comments. Argue with yourself, Ms Bobin.

    Kim, does your employer know how classy you are. Obviously, he must.

    I just had a nightmarish thought... imagine if Ms Bobin was hired and you were fired ...and she became the customer service rep of your company that greeted them on the phone. Imagine the shocked faces of your customers after Ms Bobin “man” handled their concerns and blamed them for any problem that came up.
    I think your boss would beg you to return and double your salary... no..triple...

    Now that I think of it, it may be in your best interest to encourage your boss to hire Ms Bobin fast.

     
  • Kim Parigoris posted at 8:50 am on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Kim Parigoris Posts: 470

    I will now sign off this site as I refuse to be pulled in to an absurd discussion with someone who is going to start posting ugly and personal comments. Argue with yourself, Ms Bobin.

     
  • Kim Parigoris posted at 8:47 am on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Kim Parigoris Posts: 470

    I will ignore your first question as it is totally irrelevant to the topic at hand, is none of your business, and how do you know I am not sitting on a beach in maui.
    To your second question, my tax dollars pay public employees, public employee dues are extracted from that pay to fund the unions.. Without my tax dollars there would be no salaries to pay the union dues- it is actually rather simple, but many people who have always been on the public sector payroll see their salaries as manna from Heaven, or it just comes off the government money tree. That government money tree is tax dollars as the government does not have any revenue other than tax dollars.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 8:18 am on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Two questions:

    Does your employer know that you are stealing money from him by posting comments here on company time as you often do?

    How do you figure that YOUR TAX DOLLARS are being used to fund the NO on 32 campaign?

     
  • Kim Parigoris posted at 8:07 am on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Kim Parigoris Posts: 470

    Some facts about Walker's reforms in Wisconsin.."The manner in which the public unions ran the campaigns was telling. Because they realized that public-sector collective bargaining wasn’t the wedge issue that they’d expected, not a single union-backed ad mentioned it— even though it was the reason that the unions had mobilized for the recall elections in the first place. Instead, the union ads cried that Scott Walker had “cut $800 million from the state’s schools.” This was true, but the ads neglected to mention that the governor’s increased health-care and pension-contribution requirements made up for those funds, just as Walker had planned. That the unions poured nearly $20 million into the races, by the way, validated another argument of Walker’s: that mandatory dues are a conduit through which taxpayer money gets transferred to public-sector unions, which use it to elect Democrats, who then negotiate favorable contracts with the unions. In this case, the newly strapped Wisconsin unions had to rely heavily on contributions from unions in other states." Read the whole article here..very interesting http://www.city-journal.org/2012/22_1_scott-walker.html

     
  • Kim Parigoris posted at 7:59 am on Wed, Sep 19, 2012.

    Kim Parigoris Posts: 470

    Funny how the No on 32 campaign vilifies the private sector (using THEIR profits) for givingto the the YES on 32 campaign. The Koch Brothers have contributed 4 million dollars to the Yes side (using THEIR PRIVATE money) while it is OK for the Teachers Unions to give 16 million dollars (4 times as much) using MY TAX DOLLARS. Living proof that we need to vote YES on 32! 32 isn't perfect but it is a step in the right direction of taking this albatross of the unions off the necks of this once great state. Labor unions may have USED to stand up for the middle class, but we now have enough labor laws and watchdogs, that they have turned their focus on to more of an anti-business, anti-management role. Public policy expert David Denholm writes this about PUBLIC employee unions. "By making the union a full and equal partner at the bargaining table, compulsory public-sector bargaining laws deprive the public of its right to participate in policy making"
    I am so weary of the Union people pitting the PEOPLE of the unions against the general public. We have no gripe against the MEMBERS, but the union official that sits in the corner at legislative Committee hearings shaking their head at the Committeemembers (coercing them to vote no) if a law is proposed that might possible hurt the unions, even if that law is for the good of the students or the general public. And believe me, that does happen on a regular basis in Sacramento.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5wgPnKw_sw

     

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