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Letter: Facts about Obamacare’s Class II Implantable Device

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Posted: Thursday, September 6, 2012 12:00 am

I'm concerned that some Americans are calling parts of Obamacare (HR 4872) a myth, or rumor. So, I decided to research the truth for Class II Implantable (RFID tag) device. There will be a "Unique Device Identification System" which includes Class II Implantable devices; verifiable references below:

[1] CLASS II IMPLANTABLE DEVICE: Page 2057 of the bill lines 3, a Class II Implantable device

[2] FEDERAL FOOD, DRUG AND COMETIC ACT (21 U.S.C. 360i(f)): Page 2063 lines 1-3, a reference to the "Federal Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act" (aka the "Unique Device Identification System")

For reference to the Cosmetic Act see www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-111hr4872rh/pdf/BILLS-111hr4872rh.pdf

For reference to the "Unique Device Identification System" (aka the Cosmetic Act) see Title 21 Food and Drugs, www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2010-title21/pdf/USCODE-2010-title21-chap9-subchapV-partA-sec360i.pdf

[3] UNIQUE DEVICE IDENTIFICATION SYSTEM: Computer page 4/6 of Title 21 Food and Drugs for the "Unique Device Identification System" (aka the "Federal Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act (21 U.S.C. 360i(f))"), see www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2010-title21/pdf/USCODE-2010-title21-chap9-subchapV-partA-sec360i.pdf

[4] PROPOSED RULE: Pages 34 and 36 of the bill describes the Federal Register website. Page 2057 says the Secretary consulted with the Commissioner of Food and Drugs developing the Registry. Because the Commissioner of Food and Drugs is the head of the Food and Drugs Administration is the reason the "Proposed Rule" (aka "Unique Device Identification System") was posted by the FDA on July 10, 2012. For pages 34 and 36 see www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-111hr4872rh/pdf/BILLS-111hr4872rh.pdf. For the Proposed Rule see www.federalregister.gov/articles/2012/07/10/2012-16621/unique-device-identification-system#p-463

[5] THE PROPOSED RULE DEFINES (RFID and RFID tag) AS A FACT:

RFID: See Table of Contents section II.B.1 for Definitions, in the Proposed Rule, page 17/67

RFID tag: See Table of Contents section IX.B for UDI Labeling Requirements, page 40/67; and section IX.B for Form of a Unique Device Identifier on page 43/67

Let's stop this administration by voting them out. We're losing our privacy and freedom.

Jim White

Morada

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Welcome to the discussion.

75 comments:

  • Susan Burkhardt posted at 4:15 pm on Fri, Feb 15, 2013.

    sjburkie Posts: 2

    OMG - how on EARTH did this article get published in the paper?? Go to snopes
    http://www.snopes.com/politics/medical/microchip.asp - this is a bunch a baloney!!!!

     
  • Kim Parigoris posted at 7:13 am on Mon, Feb 11, 2013.

    Kim Parigoris Posts: 470

    When backed in to a corner, and there are no more viable observations to be made, the left has to resort to non-issues like Romney..Maybe I am mistaken but I believe he didn't win the election? Which Alinsky rule is that.. I believe it fits under RULE 5: “Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating. It also works as a key pressure point to force the enemy into concessions."
    But you really should heed #RULE 7: “A tactic that drags on too long becomes a drag.” Don’t become old news".So listen to Uncle Sal and quit bringing up the GOP, Romney and Bush..it is all old news.

     
  • daniel hutchins posted at 9:20 pm on Mon, Sep 10, 2012.

    daniel hutchins Posts: 1338

    Jim White: Was this website fed to you by a certain membership organization? I wouldn't put it past the one that I have in mind.

     
  • daniel hutchins posted at 9:17 pm on Mon, Sep 10, 2012.

    daniel hutchins Posts: 1338

    Jim White: I know there are websites around that are saying that ObamaCare requires an RFID. These might have been posted in 2009 (?), when HR 3200 was the current version, and nobody took it down when it expired. The one I saw referenced a section number which was later renumbered and moved. Didn't matter. It wasn't printed into law anyway.

    You also referred to page numbers such as Page 2057, and 2063. These can only refer to pages within the bill. You probably just cut and pasted these out of whatever website you got this from. In the Library of Congress, or in the Statutes at large, it is easier to search by paragraph numbers, which are hyperlinked, whereas counting pages is not a convenient means to search and to locate the referenced text.

    I think this should have been researched a little better before being committed to print.

     
  • daniel hutchins posted at 9:09 pm on Mon, Sep 10, 2012.

    daniel hutchins Posts: 1338

    Joanne,
    A pacemaker is a class III device, as defined within the FDA, whereas this letter is mostly about class II devices which could be implanted for data gathering purposes only.

    I previously studied this text, and what I think they are saying is that a system of gathering data from these chips shall be established. It doesn't say that people have to take a chip, but this can be established later.

     
  • daniel hutchins posted at 8:56 pm on Mon, Sep 10, 2012.

    daniel hutchins Posts: 1338

    Jim White:

    Below, Linda Reichert got it first. She wanted to know if you were quoting HR 3200 which was referred to committee and died there, or HR 3962, etc....

    You got it from HR 3200, which is now dead.

    First clue that your letter did not become law is that it requires a modification of US Code, Title 21, section 360i (f). Why did you not go there and check if the amendment has been made. It is not!

    Othewise, in the Library of Congress, I did not find any evidence that the text of your letter has become law.

     
  • daniel hutchins posted at 8:45 pm on Mon, Sep 10, 2012.

    daniel hutchins Posts: 1338

    Linda, You are on top of this. The author got this from HR 3200.

    When LNS publishes my letter, you will see that HR 3200 did not become law. (It went into committee and did not come out.)

    In the final version that became law, I did not find any evidence of an RFID.

     
  • daniel hutchins posted at 8:42 pm on Mon, Sep 10, 2012.

    daniel hutchins Posts: 1338


    DARRELL: I'm a day late. I was going to write a letter about the Death Boards. Did you do that already?

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 7:40 pm on Mon, Sep 10, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    0 for 13. [sleeping]

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 4:13 pm on Sun, Sep 9, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    Andrew, do you think that you have a Class II Implantable Device in your head?

    Seriously dude, you need professional help.

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 11:05 pm on Sat, Sep 8, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    We're well aware you are asleep Walter...

    What I would like to know is... Do you ever plan on awakening from your slumber?

    Honestly, how hard is it for you to read one page of legislation? [sleeping] wakey wakey Walter

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 10:57 pm on Sat, Sep 8, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    Steve,
    Will you at any point be addressing the topic of Mr. White's letter?

    You are currently 0 for 12. [sleeping]

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 2:37 pm on Sat, Sep 8, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    Andrew, please get professional help before you hurt yourself or someone else.

     
  • Walter Chang posted at 10:36 am on Sat, Sep 8, 2012.

    Walt Posts: 1111

    [sleeping][yawn][sleeping]

    ZZZZZzzzzz.....

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 8:55 am on Sat, Sep 8, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    [lol]

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:32 am on Sat, Sep 8, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2821

    Steve wrote:

    What a crazy upside down world we live in where the GOP presidential candidate is funding his campaign with dirty money from communist Chinese casinos!

    -Chuckle,

    And Steve can assure us not one cent of the loan the Feds got from the Chinese to fund the 800 billion dollar stimulus package, that didn't doing a darn thing, wasn't generated by Communist Chinese casinos

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:27 am on Sat, Sep 8, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2821


    Darrell wrote:

    Mr Chang...did you get a new job at CalTrans? You must be excited since they do so much to prevent disasters like landslides.

    -I hear Cal-Trans is cutting back on hiring. Word has it they have a new device to hold up shovels on the roadside that doesn't require a human. [beam]

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:21 am on Sat, Sep 8, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2821

    http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/fashion-shows/

    Laundry list of Obama lies.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 7:28 am on Sat, Sep 8, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms Bobin stated…of China and its wonderful people who are happy to live in poverty and be self-sufficient with vegetable gardens and chickens, has suddenly found China to be the EVIL backer of the Obama campaign

    I see Ms. Bobin needs help again. English must be her third language. I will clarify so she can develop a real sense of reality.

    People in China and Thailand are not happy to live in poverty as you perceive I stated. In reality, they, like all others strive to improve their lives and work hard to get out of poverty when they can. What I admire about these people is that they are a happy people in spite of poverty. It is refreshing to see people look to themselves and not the government as the solution to their problem.
    In contrast, Bobin type people expect and demand government be their nanny.
    Lastly, I did not say these communist countries were backing Obama. Only that they were hoping he would win simply because they are familiar with Communism.

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 7:27 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    Schmidt, Read page 1013. [sleeping]

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 7:24 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    All politicians get donations from China by way of the corporations who do business there. Get off the fluoride and smell the roses. [sleeping]

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 7:20 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    Bobin,
    I asked that you provide one comment to substantiate the ridiculous comment you made, "those who think the government is out to kill them."

    If such references are so "numerous" don't you find it a bit odd that you are unable to come up with ONE?

    I'm still waiting... [yawn]

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 5:28 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    Get help now Andrew.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 5:27 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    Get professional help NOW.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 5:23 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Does anyone else find it strange that Darrell Baumbach, who has touted the wonderful economy of China and its wonderful people who are happy to live in poverty and be self-sufficient with vegetable gardens and chickens, has suddenly found China to be the EVIL backer of the Obama campaign because he saw it in a propaganda movie, every bit of which he has swallowed lock, stock and barrel solely because he hates Obama so much and wants so badly for this swill to be true.

    It's a wonder that your clients can trust you to give them the right advice when you sell them those insurance and benefit plans.

    Best to check with Andrew and find out what meds he's on or SHOULD be on. You need help now, Mr. Baumbach.

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 5:16 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    All politicians get donations from China by way of the corporations who do business there. Wake up and smell the roses. [sleeping]

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 5:14 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    .Andrew wrote: ".. I'm still waiting for Bobin to provide the date, time and quote where I said anything of the sort."

    Andrew, the references would be too numerous. You have so many conspiracy theories tumbling around in your empty head that the sound of them colliding infinitely drowns out any thought of reason.

    Best to fortify your bunker in your Mom's basement, keep current on your meds, and make sure your therapist is on speed dial. And you might invest in a really good pair of ear plugs, too, in order keep those voices at bay.

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 5:03 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    I'm not the one who can't read a poll. [sleeping]

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 4:54 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    The Communist Party USA endorses President Obama. [sleeping]

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 3:31 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    Andrew, get professional help today!

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 3:30 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    What a crazy upside down world we live in where the GOP presidential candidate is funding his campaign with dirty money from communist Chinese casinos!

    Republicans from Dwight Eisenhower to Ronald Reagan must be spinning in their graves.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 3:23 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    Seriously, you know the GOP is in real trouble when they have to focus their infomercials on their own cadres.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 3:22 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    DB, I think you have been inhaling a bit too much of your party's rhetorical flatulence. The Chinese Communist Party has poured millions of dollars into the Romney campaign via their proxy Sheldon Adelson.

    The communists have chosen their candidate and it is most certainly not Barack Obama.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 3:09 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    I wouldn't disagree

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 3:06 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Steve is right, poll after poll favors Obama…unfortunately these polls were originated in and taken in the following countries… After watching the movie 2016, I can see why these communist countries are hoping Obama is elected…

    01.People's Republic of China 1 October 1949 Communist Party of China Hu Jintao

    02. Republic of Cuba 1 May 1961 Communist Party of Cuba Raúl Castro

    03. Lao People's Democratic Republic 2 December 1975 Lao People's Revolutionary Party Choummaly Sayasone

    04.Socialist Republic of Vietnam

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 2:50 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    "(although I haven't seen any polls given Romney a lead)"

    Are you blind?

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2012/president/us/general_election_romney_vs_obama-1171.html

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 2:47 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    Darrell,
    These 126 electoral votes are all that matters.

    Colorado (9), Florida (29), Iowa (6),
    Michigan (16), Nevada (6), New Hampshire (4), North Carolina (15), Ohio (18), Virginia (13), Wisconsin (10).

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 2:46 pm on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    There was an interesting poll recently that showed that Willard "Mittens" Romney is the least likeable presidential candidate in 50 years.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 10:57 am on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    Of course, with a apparently infinite supply of Red Chinese yens being poured into the campaign, anything is possible. Given Sheldon Adelson's connections to the Chinese Ministry of State Security, I wouldn't be surprised to see any number of dirty tricks played between now and November.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 10:54 am on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    DB, the popular vote may be close (although I haven't seen any polls given Romney a lead) but Obama is doing much better in the Electoral College with significant leads in several key swing states.

    That said, the really significant factor here is time. Poll after poll has shown that the more people get to know Mitt Romney, the less they like him. Now the man has two whole months with no place to hide and nothing to do but expose himself to the people. The way I see it, if Obama can just avoid being caught in bed with a dead boy between now and November, he's got the whole thing pretty much in the bag.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:25 am on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mr Schmidt stated...it is pretty hard to see how Romney is going to pull a November victory

    Actually, I cannot imagine being so blinded that one could not see that Obama or Romney both could easily win.

    The presidential debates and economic results between now and November could easily tip it one way or the other.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 6:02 am on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    I don't want to discount what can be done with a billion dollars of dirty offshore money or the power of the League of Chinese Casino Owners but, with the conventions behind us, it is pretty hard to see how Romney is going to pull a November victory out of his arsenal.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 5:59 am on Fri, Sep 7, 2012.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2280

    Andrew, get professional help.

    NOW!

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:42 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mr Chang stated...Darrell, I got one word for you: Landslide!!!

    Mr Chang...did you get a new job at CalTrans? You must be excited since they do so much to prevent disasters like landslides.

     
  • Walter Chang posted at 8:18 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Walt Posts: 1111

    Darrell, I got one word for you:

    Landslide!!!

    [beam]

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 4:19 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored... [sleeping]

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 4:14 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    page 1013... [sleeping][sleeping][sleeping]

    http://housedocs.house.gov/rules/hr4872/111_hr4872_reported

     
  • Eric Barrow posted at 3:45 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Eric Barrow Posts: 1479

    debunked past participle, past tense of de·bunk (Verb)Verb: 1.Expose the falseness or hollowness of (a myth, idea, or belief).


     
  • Eric Barrow posted at 3:42 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Eric Barrow Posts: 1479

    Darrell your being a bit self centered I was refering to the ridiculous letter not to your ridiculous post about England.

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 3:20 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    "The myth has been debunked" is an assinine statement.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 3:08 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    darrell stated...All the below is happening in England already in their national health care system

    eric then stated... This myth has been repeatedly debunked, get a hobby.

    darrell responded... Really? I am excited. I sincerely hope you are right. I would love to be wrong about this. Can you please post your evidence or are you pulling a typical left wing distortion?

    eric responds...I would refer you to Linda's post.( at 8:13 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012)

    Eric, if this is your idea of "repeatedly debunked" as it relates to rationing healthcare in single payer systems, I think conversation with you is completely meaninglesss...

    [whistling][lol][lol][lol][lol][sleeping]zzzzzzzzzz

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 2:52 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    [sleeping]... HR 3200 WAS SIMPLY CHANGED TO HR 4872.

    The RFID section is located on page 1013.

    http://housedocs.house.gov/rules/hr4872/111_hr4872_reported.pdf

     
  • Jeff Tillett posted at 1:22 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Jeff Tillett Posts: 541

    which legislation? the one that went nowhere, or the one the became law? you've erroneously cited the former.

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 1:21 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    [sleeping][sleeping][sleeping]... The Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act states: "A class II implantable device is an “implantable radio frequency transponder system for patient identification and health information.”

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 1:18 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    [lol]... I'm still waiting for Bobin to provide the date, time and quote where I said anything of the sort. [lol]

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 1:14 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    Dave and Barbara Mikkelson said so doesn't make it so...[sleeping]

    One can READ THE LEGISLATION or one can live in denial.

     
  • Jeff Tillett posted at 12:02 pm on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Jeff Tillett Posts: 541

    http://www.snopes.com/politics/medical/microchip.asp

    wrong again.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:47 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Hummm ...Ms Bobin has a point... maybe it would be a good idea to force her to have this implant...

    She definitely needs to be monitored for the safety of the public. Who knows what behavior a person who sees bigots around every corner would engage in if left on her own .

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:42 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms Bobin... there are 100's of HMO's that approve and deny claims based on the contract between the IPA and the insurance carrier.

    The death panel in Obamacare has 15 unelected appointees by the president that decide what is and is not covered nationwide by all insurance carriers. Congress cannot overturn these panels decisions without a supermajorty.

    If you can not comprehend the difference once and for all, it would not be a surprise. No one can be that dumb... so you must be putting on an act.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 10:30 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Sounds like a pretty efficient system, except for those who think the government is out to kill them.

    That most likely eliminates any danger to Andrew Liebich, who will most likely be considered inconsequential.

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 9:41 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    Denial continues to offer comforts many find appealing. It's as sad as it is pathetic. Honestly, how dumbed down, willfully ignorant and mentally oblivious has the average fluoride ingesting American has become?

    NEWSFLASH!!! RFID chips ARE mandatory under Obamacare... [sleeping]

    H.R. 3200 section 2521, Pg. 1001, paragraph 1

    “The Secretary shall establish a national medical device registry (in this subsection referred to as the ‘registry’) to facilitate analysis of post-market safety and outcomes data on each device that— ‘‘is or has been used in or on a patient; ‘‘and is— ‘‘a class III device; or ‘‘a class II device that is implantable, life-supporting, or life-sustaining.”

    The Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act states:

    "A class II implantable device is an “implantable radio frequency transponder system for patient identification and health information.” The purpose of a class II device is to collect data in medical patients such as “claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary.”

    Now lets look at section 163 of H.R. 3200, which gives the government a direct electronic access to your bank account which will work in conjunction with your MANDATORY implanted chip.

    Page 58 Lines 5 through 15 reads:

    "(D) enable the real-time (or near real time) determination of an individual’s financial responsibility at the point of service and, to the extent possible,prior to service, including whether the individual is eligible for a specific service with a specific physician at a specific facility, which may include utilization of a machine-readable health plan beneficiary identity detection card; (E) enable, where feasible, near real-time adjudication of claims."

    What does this mean? It means that the government will give everybody a health ID card that contains a machine readable device (magnetic strip or RFID chip) similar to a credit card. Embedded in this chip or strip is your Health Identification Number. When you visit a medical provider, the medical claims will be processed while you are still in the office. The medical providers will be paid in real time. The portion that you owe will be deducted from your bank account, in real time, according to H.R. 3200.

    and for those of you who can't read... http://youtu.be/eob532iEpqk


     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:08 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488


    “The Board could deny payment for certain care or medications, change the service options doctors have, and drive expensive, life-saving treatments out. Instead of discussing the options with your doctor, IPAB will be sitting at the controls in Washington making health decisions for you,” Perkins explained."

    Once and for all, Mr. Baumbach, your HMO or other health insurance provider already does this. Have done for decades. My own physician complained 30 years ago that insurance companies were becoming more and more powerful because they were able to dictate treatment options.

    How many times have you read stories about patients who were denied treatment by their insurance companies because of cost, risk, or because it was a "experimental" treatment?

    None apparently, but as Mr. Chang rightly defines, some people are just desperate to frighten people so they can elect a man who:

    1. Wants to erase 40 years of progress in relation to women's health issues.
    2. Wants government, i.e., Congress, to dictate what healthcare women get.
    3. Suddenly has become "pro-life with no exceptions for rape or incest, anti-his own healthcare legislation, anti-Planned parenthood" and more.
    4. Give himself more money in the form of tax breaks while simultaneously making up the difference from the poor and middle class.

    Link

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:59 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Continued... re Rationing of Healthcare through Government

    Dr Jonathan Richardson, a consultant pain specialist from Bradford Hospitals Trust, is among more than 50 medics who have written to NICE urging the body to reconsider its decision, which was taken in May.

    He said: "The consequences of the NICE decision will be devastating for thousands of patients. It will mean more people on opiates, which are addictive, and kill 2,000 a year. It will mean more people having spinal surgery, which is incredibly risky, and has a 50 per cent failure rate."

    One in three people are estimated to suffer from lower back pain every year, while one in 15 consult their GP about it. Specialists say therapeutic injections using steroids to reduce inflammation and other injections which can deaden nerve endings, can provide months or even years of respite from pain.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:57 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    England has their Obamacare already...and they have panels called NICE
    This is an example of rationing that we soon will experience in America...

    Patients forced to live in agony after NHS refuses to pay for painkilling injections
    Tens of thousands with chronic back pain will be forced to live in agony after a decision to slash the number of painkilling injections issued on the NHS, doctors have warned

    By Laura Donnelly, Health Correspondent
    7:45AM BST 02 Aug 2009


    The Government's drug rationing watchdog says "therapeutic" injections of steroids, such as cortisone, which are used to reduce inflammation, should no longer be offered to patients suffering from persistent lower back pain when the cause is not known.
    Instead the National Institute of Health and Clinical Excellence (NICE) is ordering doctors to offer patients remedies like acupuncture and osteopathy.
    Specialists fear tens of thousands of people, mainly the elderly and frail, will be left to suffer excruciating levels of pain or pay as much as £500 each for private treatment.
    The NHS currently issues more than 60,000 treatments of steroid injections every year. NICE said in its guidance it wants to cut this to just 3,000 treatments a year, a move which would save the NHS £33 million

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 8:53 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Why this letter has been designated "informative" by Mr. Baumbach, I have no idea.

    Does Mr. White not know that every single piece of "hardware" placed in the human body has an ID number? From the tiniest screw to pacemakers, as Ms. Reichert mentioned.

    Anyone who watches any of the numerous "procedural" detective shows on TV knows that - it's not a secret or a government plot to track our movements.

    After his quadruple bypass, my husband had an implanted defibrillator placed in his chest that corrects any irregular heart rhythm. It has an ID number and he has an ID card that he carries with him so emergency medical professionals will know what make and model he has. Whenever he has a surgery, the surgical team is required to notify St. Jude's that the device will be disabled so they know that it is not a malfunction or worse. He sees his cardiologist regulary so they can get a read-out from the device, using the ID, to see if he has experienced any "episodes" that might be cause for concern.

    Not for one second has he worried that the government or his health insurance provider is following him or using information from the device to schedule him for a death panel.

    Not going to happen no matter how much Mr. White and Mr. Baumbach proclaim that to be the truth.

     
  • Eric Barrow posted at 8:51 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Eric Barrow Posts: 1479

    I would refer you to Linda's post.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:48 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    More comedy from Mr Chang... please articulate specifics just once. You pretend to have knowledge to base your mocking... but never provide evidence or substantiation.

    How about it Mr Chang? Care to offer something of substance? Or do you prefer to simply remain superficial.

    If I am wrong, how? If this letter is wrong, why?

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:44 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Eric stated... This myth has been repeatedly debunked, get a hobby.

    Really? I am excited. I sincerely hope you are right. I would love to be wrong about this.
    Can you please post your evidence or are you pulling a typical left wing distortion?

     
  • Walter Chang posted at 8:15 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Walt Posts: 1111

    Darrell, desperate is the term I would use to describe your most recent postings. [scared]

    Definition of DESPERATE

    1a: having lost hope 1b: giving no ground for hope

    2a: moved by despair 2b : involving or employing extreme measures in an attempt to escape defeat or frustration

    3: suffering extreme need or anxiety

    4: involving extreme danger or possible disaster

     
  • Linda W Reichert posted at 8:13 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    lwreichert Posts: 1

    What claptrap! I wonder about the research on this. First off, HR 4872 is the Healthcare and Education Reconciliation Act, which is not a complete bill but just changes to bring the House versions and Senate versions inline. HR 3200 is the original Affordable Healthcare Act-the one with the public option still in it; HR 3962 is the Affordable Healthcare Act. So which one are you talking about? I can't tell really.
    But I soldiered on. In the online version of your letter, I was able to click on the link which sent me to HR 4872 and to pg 2057. That section requires unique device identifiers for any medical devices that are implantable, like a pacemaker, so they track outcomes electronically. You're opposed to that! Why?
    I'm giving up at this point. You make no sense at all.

     
  • Walter Chang posted at 8:13 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Walt Posts: 1111

    Darrell, desperate is the term I would use to describe your most recent postings. [scared]

    Definition of DESPERATE

    1a: having lost hope 1b: giving no ground for hope

    2a: moved by despair 2b : involving or employing extreme measures in an attempt to escape defeat or frustration

    3: suffering extreme need or anxiety

    4: involving extreme danger or possible disaster

    5: of extreme intensity

    http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/desperate

     
  • Eric Barrow posted at 7:39 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Eric Barrow Posts: 1479

    This myth has been repeatedly debunked, get a hobby.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 5:20 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    All the below is happening in England already in their national health care system.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 5:19 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    CONTINUED...

    “Simply put, the IPAB is bad medicine,” added Balch. “It is outrageous that a government entity would be allowed to dictate and limit what Americans could spend – of their own money – to save their own lives.”

    “This Board, made up of 15 unelected members of the President’s choosing, will be the sole authority over what kind of care–if any–we receive,” he explained. “Starting in 2015, IPAB will be tasked with bringing down medical costs–and unless Congress can find a super-majority to oppose them, IPAB’s recommendations will carry the force of law.”

    “The Board could deny payment for certain care or medications, change the service options doctors have, and drive expensive, life-saving treatments out. Instead of discussing the options with your doctor, IPAB will be sitting at the controls in Washington making health decisions for you,” Perkins explained.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 5:17 am on Thu, Sep 6, 2012.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    In addition to this informative letter, I would like to clarify what is meant exactly when someone talks about Obamacare and "DEATH PANELS"


    “Integral to the Obama Administration’s stated mission to drive down what Americans choose to spend for life-saving and health-preserving health care, the IPAB is charged with a key role in suppressing health care spending by limiting what treatment doctors are allowed to give their patients,” she says. “While the focus throughout this debate has been on the IPAB’s authority to cut Medicare with very limited Congressional authority to override or alter those cuts, National Right to Life has been emphasizing a still graver concern – one at the core of rationing in ObamaCare.”

    “The health care law instructs the IPAB to make recommendations to limit what all Americans are legally allowed to spend for their health care to hold it below the rate of medical inflation. The health care law then empowers the federal Department of Health and Human Services to implement these recommendations by imposing so-called “quality” and “efficiency” measures on health care providers,” Popik continues. “What happens to doctors who violate a “quality” standard by prescribing more lifesaving medical treatment than it permits? They will be disqualified from contracting with any of the health insurance plans that individual Americans, under the Obama Health Care Law, will be mandated to purchase. Few doctors would be able to remain in practice if subjected to that penalty.”

    “This means that treatment a doctor and patient deem advisable to save that patient’s life or preserve or improve the patient’s health–but which exceeds the standard imposed by the government–will be denied even if the patient is willing and able to pay for it. Repeal of IPAB is critically important to prevent this rationing of life-saving medical treatment,” she adds.

    http://www.lifenews.com/2012/03/22/house-votes-to-repeal-ipab-obamacare-death-panels/

     

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