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Only some of the facts are present in letter

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Posted: Saturday, February 26, 2011 12:00 am | Updated: 6:52 am, Sat Feb 26, 2011.

This is in response to Heinz Lehrach's letter to the editor published on Monday, Feb. 21. In typical liberal Democrat fashion, only some of the facts are present.

Why is Obama's birthplace still an issue? First, he will not release his birth certificate — or his college records — in accordance with the law. Second, he spent more than $2 million fighting it. I was born in San Francisco and I have my birth certificate in the file along with my passport, mother and father's birth certificate, as well as death certificate.

Next you question John McCain's birthplace. His grandfather was in charge of the submarine base in Panama, and his father was in charge of a submarine. He was born to two parents of the United States who were serving their country. When John McCain was in the Hanoi Hilton, his father had risen high in the ranks and was Admiral of the operations. He could have obtained John's release, but John refused to go before others. He was a true hero, loyal and serving to his country.

I don't believe Obama served his country, nor did he produce a valid birth certificate, and both of his parents were not born in the United States. His father was a very radical person, just like his son.

Dennis Vetica

Lodi

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15 comments:

  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 4:23 pm on Mon, Feb 28, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms Bobin stated...Mr. Baumbach, I am sorry if you feel that my "Yawn" comment was childish.

    I do not think you are sorry mis Bobin... in fact, I think you are rather proud of it. You may think his point has no consequence ( Vetica), and you may be right... however, your "yawn" was intended as a put down... look in the mirror Ms Bobin.. you are what you accuse others of... denigrating ... over and over again.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 4:17 pm on Mon, Feb 28, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms Bobin stated...Childish is when a poster continuously uses quotes from prior postings over a series of months to belittle another poster proving that that person has not progressed from the playground to the adult world.

    I agree with Ms bobin that if a poster (me), did what she described, would be childish. What Ms Bobin is mistaken about is the motivation... the intent is not to belittle... Ms Bobin may be embarrassed as I point out her motivations and intents… I’m sure she does not enjoy the truth… which is her intent and motivation. I seek truth and I post past comments she posts only to illustrate the absurdity of Ms Bobin’s positions and contradictions. I think Ms Bobin should be ashamed of herself, unfortunately, I do not think it possible.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 3:08 pm on Mon, Feb 28, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Mr. Baumbach stated: "You can rationalize "rebuke" all you want... it is childish to me."

    Childish is when a poster continuously uses quotes from prior postings over a series of months to belittle another poster proving that that person has not progressed from the playground to the adult world.

    Mr. Baumbach, I am sorry if you feel that my "Yawn" comment was childish. People like Mr. Vetica continually bring up points that are of no consequence and/or have been settled satisfactorily by the courts, i.e., President Obama's birth place and his lawful right to be president. That is what I call childish, irrelevant, and a desperate attempt to further social discord, especially among the large population in Lodi in particular, who would relish nothing more than to have their fantasies proved reality. The birther movement is nothing more than a facade for deeper social issues that continue to prevail in the US.


     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 11:45 pm on Sun, Feb 27, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Manuel stated...My response addresses your concern.. that is your opinion... In my opinion, not even close... You can rationalize "rebuke" all you want... it is childish to me.

     
  • Manuel Martinez posted at 10:54 pm on Sun, Feb 27, 2011.

    Manuel Martinez Posts: 641

    Do not imply that I am not being truthful, we have everything on record. My response addresses your concern. "If you fail to do so (provide credible evidence in defense of your position) however, I will characterize you as a crackpot because you have failed to back up your assertion." It is not child like to reject a person's statements immediately after concluding that they have no evidence with which to back up their claims and are therefore classified as irrelevant at best and pathetic at worst. A writer that does not provide a foundation for his position has wasted the time of his audience in entertaining his proposal, attempting to verify the claim, and compelling audience members to present the data that refutes the intent of the author to their peers. Rebuke is therefore justified.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:27 pm on Sun, Feb 27, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Manuel... you are not being truthful to yourself or me...My comments here are not in reference to your positions and I agree, when you take positions you articulate them very well and are not child like(but not accurate). When you preface you position with statements like… “ The tin hat business must be doing well”… or “sigh”,,, and the many other comments that paint a picture that the person you are refuting is off his rocker… like … here we go again… another “birther”… that is child like… to denigrate others to make your weak evidence seem substantial is intentional and planned. Manuel… that is just my opinion… maybe I’m wrong… it’s the conclusion I draw based on this and other statements you make.

     
  • Manuel Martinez posted at 10:07 pm on Sun, Feb 27, 2011.

    Manuel Martinez Posts: 641

    Taking a position is not childlike. In fact, when I present evidence, I show you how I have come to a conclusion with the intended corollary that a counterargument with sufficient evidence has the power to compel me to reevaluate my own argument and in effect, my position. If you fail to do so however, I will characterize you as a crackpot because you have failed to back up your assertion.

    I listen to those that do not agree with me (in fact, I seek out opposing views), with the hope that they will present credible evidence that will add to my pool of knowledge. "We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own"...

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 9:12 pm on Sun, Feb 27, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    You are attempting to change history Manuel… I was not responding to what you consider “valid evidence”, which in my view is very light… and refuting Mr Vetica,,,
    I was responding to the extra information that has nothing to do with refuting evidence…
    Manuel stated…We seriously have a 'birther' letter?*sigh* “Sink back into obscurity”…as if he was a kook. I am not saying you do not have reasonable points as far as your evidence (though it does not mean you are right)… I’m saying there are two sides to a coin… in your world, its your way or it isn’t true.. hence… anti-thinker…
    This is my opinion Manuel… You have consistently tried t paint others as kooks and crackpots simply because they do not agree with what you consider truth based on the evidence you “think” is real… in my opinion, that is child like behavior.

     
  • Manuel Martinez posted at 8:23 pm on Sun, Feb 27, 2011.

    Manuel Martinez Posts: 641

    Are you sure you read what I wrote? I did not refer to you as a 'birther'. I do acknowledge that you couldn't care less about the origin of the president. What I did do however, was counter your presentation of information that individuals like Mr. Vetica would find relevant to maintaining their unfounded position by highlighting an article that addressed such concerns thoroughly. Further, I did not state that you rebuked "the Bobin/Martinez tag team" (...would make for a good campaign poster), I wrote "did you really characterize THE (capitalized for emphasis) rebuke of a man who refuses to accept the rather direct and obvious evidence rebutting his claim as "anti-intellectual"?". It directly addressed your 3:37 pm post, "Response… double yawn… typical anti-intellectual, anti thinking, anti curious Bobin/Martinex tag teem who for some reason are threatened critically whenever someone questions what they consider obvious and factual..."

    In short, Joanne and I have a habit of addressing specific points more so than our detractors, who generally post vacuous responses that express the ignorance of the poster (not to mention issues with reading comprehension.)

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 6:28 pm on Sun, Feb 27, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405


    Manuel... I think you need to read what I say,,, sometimes I think you see my name and start frothing at the mouth and lose your ability to focus. To answer your question, which was already answered if you had read what I posted, I did not rebuke anyone... what I said was...
    "Mr Vetica was simply stating why the birth controversy fails to die… to this tag teem, that makes him a kook. I could care less if Obama was from Mars… but it is reasonable for those concerned to question this… there are considerations”
    In other words… I was not taking a position one or the other. I stated I could care less if Obama was born on Mars… it is a non issue for me. I was however addressing how you and mis bobin consistently attempt to make someone look “stupid or moronic”, at the very least, unreasonable, for questioning what you perceive as truth. That is why I provided information that “others” think is pertinent to the issue. The concerns are/were not unreasonable and these people do not deserve the “labels” you and Bobin attempt to stick on them. In my view, you and Bobin are what I describe given your behavior. Hopefully, someday you and Bobin will behave like adults and address specific points you disagree with and eliminate the labels to justify your comments.

     
  • Manuel Martinez posted at 4:36 pm on Sun, Feb 27, 2011.

    Manuel Martinez Posts: 641

    Darrell...did you really characterize the rebuke of a man who refuses to accept the rather direct and obvious evidence rebutting his claim as "anti-intellectual"?

    Remember your position Darrell, its those "liberals" that are intellectual "to a fault". Stay consistent my friend...

    In case you've neglected to read the article I provided, there are 2 newspaper articles that verify the date, location and hospital of the president's birth.

    Why do I even bother.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 3:37 pm on Sun, Feb 27, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Manuel Martinez posted at 8:… We seriously have a 'birther' letter?*sigh* The president's birth certificate has been verified
    Then…Ms Bonin posted…Yawn.....Unfortunately, Mr. Vetica would still not believe Obama was born is the US even if he could be transported in time to witness the event in person.
    Response… double yawn… typical anti-intellectual, anti thinking, anti curious Bobin/Martinex tag teem who for some reason are threatened critically whenever someone questions what they consider obvious and factual...

    Mr Vetica was simply stating why the birth controversy fails to die… to this tag teem, that makes him a kook. I could care less if Obama was from Mars… but it is reasonable for those concerned to question this… there are considerations… for example… according to the American Thinker…
    A. From Hawaii's official Department of Health, Vital Records webpage: "Amended certificates of birth may be prepared and filed with the Department of Health, as provided by law, for 1) a person born in Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health or 2) a person born in a foreign country" (applies to adopted children).

    B. A parent may register an in-state birth in lieu of certification by a hospital of birth under HRS 338-5.

    C. Hawaiian law expressly provides for registration of out-of-state births under HRS 338-17.8. A foreign birth presumably would have been recorded by the American consular of the country of birth, and presumably that would be reflected on the Hawaiian birth certificate.

    D. Hawaiian law, however, expressly acknowledges that its system is subject to error. See, for example, HRS 338-17.

    E. Hawaiian law expressly provides for verification in lieu of certified copy of a birth certificate under HRS 338-14.3.

    F. Even the Hawaii Department of Home Lands does not accept a certified copy of a birth certificate as conclusive evidence for its homestead program. From its web site: "In order to process your application, DHHL utilizes information that is found only on the original Certificate of Live Birth, which is either black or green. This is a more complete record of your birth than the Certification of Live Birth (a computer-generated printout). Submitting the original Certificate of Live Birth will save you time and money since the computer-generated Certification requires additional verification by DHHL."

    In addition…The document that the Obama campaign released to the public is a certified copy of Obama's birth record, which is not the best evidence since, even under Hawaiian law, the original vault copy is the better evidence. Presumably, the vault record would show whether his birth was registered by a hospital in Hawaii.
    Obama has refused to disclose the vault copy of his Hawaiian birth certificate…why?

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:21 am on Sun, Feb 27, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Yawn.....

    Unfortunately, Mr. Vetica would still not believe Obama was born is the US even if he could be transported in time to witness the event in person.

    Just goes to show that some people have little else of importance in their lives to think about.

     
  • Betty Dean posted at 8:49 pm on Sat, Feb 26, 2011.

    Betty Dean Posts: 144

    Too the left , too the left........................

     
  • Manuel Martinez posted at 8:11 pm on Sat, Feb 26, 2011.

    Manuel Martinez Posts: 641

    We seriously have a 'birther' letter?

    *sigh* The president's birth certificate has been verified. Seriously, this is pathetic. If you want a personal copy of Obama's birth certificate, then wait till HB1116 passes in Hawaii, and then you can buy it for $100.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/27/hawaii-birther-bill_n_815183.html

    Sink back into obscurity -.-

     

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