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Revolutions in Muslim world are dangerous

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Posted: Thursday, December 8, 2011 12:00 am | Updated: 6:28 am, Thu Dec 8, 2011.

The unrest and revolutions throughout the Muslim world are covered with the DNA of the Muslim brotherhood, and it looks like we're witnessing the birth and growing pains of an Islamic caliphate.

It all lends a certain understanding to the term "Arab Spring," which itself conjures up other such terms as "Towers Fall," "Shariah Summer" and "Nuclear Winter."

My wise old dad used to say, "danger is just anger with a 'd' in front of it."

William Van Amber Fields

Morada

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46 comments:

  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 6:00 pm on Thu, Dec 15, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    exactly klee.... you saying that no religion is innocent is just as insignifcant as discovering if water or Darrell is all wet... great point!

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 11:13 pm on Wed, Dec 14, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Or that Darrell is...

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 1:34 pm on Wed, Dec 14, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Klee stated... "No religion is innocent." That's for sure, Steve....

    That has just as much significance as discovering water is wet...

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 9:48 am on Wed, Dec 14, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Steve Schmidt wrote, "No religion is innocent."

    That's for sure, Steve.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 1:49 pm on Tue, Dec 13, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    Saudi Arabia just beheaded a woman convicted of "sorcery and witchcraft" a punishment completely justified under Sharia Law. Yeah, let's let this practice go unchallenged in America.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:00 am on Mon, Dec 12, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2850

    Joe,

    You took the words right out of my mouth. And the Islamists have been very successful in turning other countries into Islamic states. Frankly, I don't think they will
    succeed here. But the Libs will give them every chance they can.

     
  • Joe Baxter posted at 7:25 pm on Sun, Dec 11, 2011.

    Joe Baxter Posts: 1889

    I am wondering how America would be today if we allowed the Hitler's party, prior to America entering WWll, to immigrate to America and afforded them all the rights of American Citizens, allowed them to establish their own rules and courts and operate autonomously from the American Constitution. Seem absurd? You bet, but that is exactly what the Islamics are attempting. The bleeding heart liberals are campaigning to allow them to accomplish their goals, and IMO our White House Occupant couldn't be more thrilled.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 11:21 am on Sun, Dec 11, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2850


    Steve wrote:


    Mr Fields reminds me of those Americans who supported Hitler because he was tough on the communists.

    -Many of those were unaware of the atrocities Hitler was committing. Stalin did not do nearly as good of job covering up the atrocities he was committing. Steve reminds me of the people supporting Islamic governments because they refuse to acknowledge the atrocities committed by these regimes.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:37 am on Sun, Dec 11, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2850

    Just like Islam, Hitler had a political agenda.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:34 am on Sun, Dec 11, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2850

    Hitler's strategy in order to conquer was through intimidation and oppression. It's no coincidence he used this strategy given his alliance with the Radical Muslims of the time.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:29 am on Sun, Dec 11, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2850

    If it wasn't for Islam's political agenda it would have withered at the vine long ago. Most religions have a political agenda. However, except for Islam,it is their religious agenda that has kept them afloat.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:24 am on Sun, Dec 11, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2850

    Hitler did not have nearly as many followers of his 3rd Reich compared to those who want Global Islamic Domination.Yet he still managed to expand his area of influence. I doubt Joanne would have been critical to anyone protesting what Hitler was up to. Yet she is critical to anyone protesting the much more existential threat of Global Islamic Domination.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:56 am on Sun, Dec 11, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2850

    Joanne wrote:

    Actually, Mr. Baumbach, I do not champion Sharia Law. I only mock the individuals who believe that the US government and the Constitution is so weak that Sharia Law could be instituted in this country. I mock the states and cities that have passed bills outlawing Sharia Law.

    -This statement seems to be some type of admittance how liberalism is to be avoided at all costs since it is liberalism that is most likely to weaken our government and Constitution. However, I'm not going to hold my breath Joanne is veering towards a more conservative point of view because I doubt she even realizes the content of her statement above.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:47 am on Sun, Dec 11, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2850

    Joanne wrote:

    I also mock any individual who propagandizes the possibility of the establishment of Sharia Law in this country to frighten citizens and voters. Who are those who are susceptable to this propaganda? The bigoted and the uninformed.

    - Many Muslims here in America have fled Islamic Countries because of the oppressive nature of Sharia Law. Not only are they well aware of how Sharia Law works they are also the ones who are most likely to protest and inform the general public. Brigette Gabrielle and Noni Darwish are two people who come to mind.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 5:21 pm on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    JOANNE, by the way, just what is a "polical" leader? Perhaps you should take a remedial spelling and comprehension class to bring you up to adult standards.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 5:05 pm on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    JOANNE, thanks again for proving my theory about you making illogical conclusions. Like I said, you are very good at it and it shows in most all of your posts. Must be some kind of disorder hardwired into your brain. Perhaps you should seek professional help.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 4:16 pm on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    Ah, JOANNE, once again you prove to everyone your ability to debate/discuss a topic is juvenile, at best. I think I will go discuss this matter with my 9 year old grandson, I am sure his comprehension skills are far superior to yours. And most likely his knowledge of world history exceeds yours also.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 2:37 pm on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Obviously, dule systems evolved in these countries to to migration of Sharia Law to their countries... take off your blinders Ms Bobin.

    Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia - A Christian lawyer in Malaysia has failed in her attempt to be allowed to practise in the Muslim Shariah courts. A judge in Kuala Lumpur dismissed her challenge to the decision of a religious council that all lawyers in Islamic courts must be Muslim.

    Malaysia runs two parallel legal systems.
    The civil courts cater to its non-Muslim citizens while the Islamic system decides issues affecting the fate of the country's Muslim majority.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 2:30 pm on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    continued

    Muslim tribunal courts started passing sharia judgments in August 2007. They have dealt with more than 100 cases that range from Muslim divorce and inheritance to nuisance neighbours.
    In July, Lord Phillips of Worth Matravers, the Lord Chief Justice agreed that Muslims in Britain should be able to live according to Islamic law to decide financial and marital disputes.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 2:27 pm on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms Bobin stated...I only mock the individuals who believe that the US government and the Constitution is so weak that Sharia Law could be instituted in this country.
    S Bobin...you display your ignorance and look foolish... complete idiocy on your part.

    It has nothing to do with the constitution... it has to do with the legal system and how it evolves through consensus and precedent. The main concern is duel legal systems, just as it has recently been set up in Britain.

    Five sharia courts have been set up in London, Birmingham, Bradford and Manchester and Nuneaton, Warwickshire. The government has quietly sanctioned that their rulings are enforceable with the full power of the judicial system, through the county courts or High Court. Previously, the rulings were not binding and depended on voluntary compliance among Muslims.
    Lawyers in Britain have issued grave warnings about the dangers of a dual legal system and the disclosure drew criticism from Opposition leaders.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 1:24 pm on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Sorry my sarcasm (tee-hee) exceeded your ability for comprehension, Mr. Chapman.

    The more you talk, the bigger the hole you are digging into the chasm of your ignorance. So now it is OK for a "polical" leader like Milosevic to emulate Hitler as long as they do not claim to persecute others as a representative of a particular religion?

    From Mr. Baumbach's favorite reference tool: "The charges on which Milošević was indicted were: genocide; complicity in genocide; deportation; murder; persecutions on political, racial or religious grounds..." Just to name a few.

    At least he didn't commit any of these actions in the name of religion, right?

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 12:56 pm on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Actually, Mr. Baumbach, I do not champion Sharia Law. I only mock the individuals who believe that the US government and the Constitution is so weak that Sharia Law could be instituted in this country. I mock the states and cities that have passed bills outlawing Sharia Law.

    I also mock any individual who propagandizes the possibility of the establishment of Sharia Law in this country to frighten citizens and voters. Who are those who are susceptable to this propaganda? The bigoted and the uninformed.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:52 am on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms Bobin stated... he seems to make illogical connections between what someone says and what he "thinks" they believe ...

    Actually Ms Bobin, I was complimenting your intelligence by my post... I assumed that someone with your sophistication and intellect couldn’t possibly think I was championing an extreme right-wing religious leader … no... I was assuming you must have participated in excessive celebration and become inebriated.
    As far as you supporting Sharia Law... of course a reasonable person would conclude that you support it as over a long period of time, you have criticized people who fear it incessantly. In fact, you have referred to people who fear Sharia Law as bigots. Since you never criticize Muslims who embrace Sharia law one can conclude you are anti homosexual since homosexuality is a crime in that legal system.

    Ms Bobin should apologize to the many people she refers to as bigots. She should also quit inventing a false reality.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 8:47 am on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    Joanne giggles like a grammar school girl in the post using "Tee-Hee!" and she chastises me for using the computer abbreviation LOL? That's funny but sad.
    Also she told Darrell "he seems to make illogical connections between what someone says and what he "thinks" they believe."
    How dare you Darrell. Joanne has exclusive rights to making those kind of illogical connections. And, I might add, she is darn good at it too!

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 5:31 am on Sat, Dec 10, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    Oh brother, another NO-ANSWER answer from Joanne, I figured as much. For your information, Slobodan Milosevic, the president of Yugoslavia ultimately accountable for the atrocities, was not aligned with any religious faction. He despised Muslims much as Hitler despised Jews. See, JOANNE, easy to back up your statements when you know the facts, You should try it sometime.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:12 pm on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Mr. Baumbach wrote: "It is so unfortunate that Ms Bobin admires Sharia law and its followers who think an appropriate punishment for simply being a “g a y” person is death... Why she is so harsh and wishes people to die just for who they are is scary... shame on you Ms Bobin."

    I think Mr. Baumbach needs to brush up on his communication skills since he seems to make illogical connections between what someone says and what he "thinks" they believe (is he capable of logical thought?). I think that you have made several ill-conceived accusations about me for which you really should apologize, i.e.:

    inebriated
    supports Sharia law
    wishes death to homosexuals

    You have obviously not progressed beyond a first grade level of social interaction.

    I believe it was YOU, Mr. Baumbach, who felt it necessary to expose the view of the Ugandan religious "leader" who wishes to condemn homosexuals to death. You even went to the trouble of looking up a name and MO. Mr. Schmidt never even pinpointed ANY individual. And you spoke in a manner that ANYONE could interpret as support for that extreme position, rather than a purely expository way.

    Perhaps you should reconsider the manner in which you post comments. Anyone here would believe you are a supporter of that monster. If not a supporter, then you certainly have the belief that an individual of this type has every right to wreak havoc on his fellow human beings.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 8:55 pm on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Tee-Hee! It was Mr. Chapman who disputed Mr. Schmidt's post of 5:24AM claiming there were no religious implications. Now he wants ME to provide the proof?

    YOU provide support for your statement and we'll go from there...if you actually have any proof to support your claims, which I doubt.

    Typical right-wing response...make a statement, then dare the opposing view to "prove" you were wrong. It doesn't work that way, "Mr." Chapman.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 5:21 pm on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    Joanne posted, "And isn't is strange that the so-called "political ideology" was drawn around religious factions. Coincidence, of course, right Mr. Chapman?"
    Want to enlighten us with proof of that statement? What religion and where do you get the information that makes your statement fact? Or, as usual, it is your opinion so it must be so.

     
  • Alex Kennedy posted at 2:06 pm on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Alex Posts: 215

    So what do you recommend Mr. Van Amber Fields? That our country should support perpetual dictators who commit unspeakable acts of persecution on their citizens according to their own whims while we hypocritically preach our freedom loving values around the world? That is not the Christian thing to do.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 1:20 pm on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Once again, when pinned down, both Mr. Chapman and Mr. Baumbach play the "that wasn't the issue" card. Apparently only THEY are allowed to cite instances from history when it suits their argument.

    Embarassing - especially when Mr. Baumbach seems to be championing an extreme right-wing religious leader who still believes that AIDS is a disease that is caused and spread solely by homosexuals. Are you a secret member of the 700 Club, Mr. Baumbach? I wouldn't be surprised.

    Mr. Chapman wrote: "These people were murdered, raped and brutalized because of political ideology."

    And isn't is strange that the so-called "political ideology" was drawn around religious factions. Coincidence, of course, right Mr. Chapman?

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 10:37 am on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    The atrocities commited against Muslim women and others in Yugoslavia weren't done under the color of any religion. Blaming Orthodox Christians for the crimes is just dumb. These people were murdered, raped and brutalized because of political ideology. Much like Hitler's atrocities against the Jewish population. Just what was Hitler's religion? None, unless you consider Nazism a religion.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:12 am on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    From Wikipedia...
    Martin Ssempa (born 1968) is an Ugandan pastor and activist, founder of the Makerere Community Church. He rejects separation of church and state, opposes the usage of condoms to prevent HIV contraction and supports abstinence plus fidelity education in the fight against sexual diseases.[3][4] Ssempa claims to be leading a crusade to "kick sodomy out of Uganda, endorsing proposed legislation in Uganda that makes certain homosexual acts punishable by life in prison or even, in some cases, death

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:12 am on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Steve... I thought this conversation was serious... you want to compare the religion of Islam that has 100's of millions of followers who practice Sharia Law as their belief system with one minister in Uganda .. This man, Martin Ssempa is living in an environment of an epidemic of HIV and AIDS cases that is ravishing the population. He along with many politicians there are concerned about the people dying. The population thinks AIDS is a non g a y disease and the problem is a disaster.

    You want to compare this situation with a person on death row because he wants to be a Christian???
    Wow... maybe you would also compare a nuke to a BB gun... unbelievable. One minister thinks this way. A vast majority that support this law are politicians that want to prevent AIDS.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 8:11 am on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    I was counting on the usual liberal posters to drag up ancient history about violence associated with religious conflicts and I was not disappointed. I am suprised they didn't mention the Crusades.The optimal word in my post was, STILL. Evidently liberal reading skills aren't as sharp as they should be. The Israelites were fighting for POLITICAL independence, not because the British were trying to force religion they didn't want. If you are going to cite history, get your facts straight first.

     
  • Kevin Paglia posted at 6:58 am on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Kevin Paglia Posts: 2050

    I think what the past few comments clearly demonstrates is that ANY religious group that tries to gain political POWER is dangerous. Religious groups involved in politics is one thing but when they want the power of politics things get very dangerous and usually bloody.

    The question then becomes WHY? Why do religions that should be about love and moral behavior become tools of death and destruction? I think the reason is very simple. It is the POWER aspect. People who demand power will look to two places, politics and religion. Not that every one in leadership of politics and religion are demanding power, but a small minority are there to gain said power. The more power they get the more they demand. And then these power-mongers will do ANYTHING to keep that power, including creating an "evil" group to consolidate forces against.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 5:59 am on Fri, Dec 9, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2574

    Mr Baumbach, since you are cataloging atrocities, perhaps you would like to comment on the law currently under consideration in Uganda(and supported by many American evangelical groups) that would mandate the extermination of homosexuals. If that doesn't tickle your fancies you could always tell us about the rape camps the Orthodox Christians operated in Bosnia to punish Muslims for their religion.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:21 pm on Thu, Dec 8, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mr Chapman stated...I am tryiing to come up with another religion besides Islam that still believe people should convert to their faith or they shouldn't be allowed to live....
    Interesting point... in addition, I wonder how many religions supported executions in the last 30 years...

    1. Washington (CNN)  ...The White House Thursday condemned the conviction of an Iranian pastor, who may be executed in Tehran for refusing to recant his religious beliefs and convert from Christianity to Islam.

    2. Iranian Regime Set to Execute Two G a y Men By Stoning... Posted by Jim Hoft on Tuesday, January 18, 2011, 4:39 AM

    3. Muslim cleric 'backs execution of gays' Don Frame October 26, 2006... A ROW has blown up over a claim a prominent Manchester Muslim has defended the execution of sexually-active g a y people as "justified". 

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 7:09 pm on Thu, Dec 8, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Good comments, Mr. Schmidt.

    Mr. Chapman seems to have a very narrow world view. He must have been asleep while the IRA was raising and laundering money in the US through the Knights of Columbus in order bomb Protestants in Northern Ireland and throughout London, to include Parliament and its members.

    Why, Mr. Chapman, do you think that the British finally decided to abandon the Holy Land, i.e., present-day Israel. They became tired of being blown-up by Jewish dissidents.

    And who are the individuals who blow-up abortion clinics and shoot doctors under the guise of killing "infidels?"

    I could go on, but you probably would still stick to your misguided belief that Muslims (all Muslims to you, not just radical Muslims) are the only violent religious group on the planet.

    Once again, try going beyond FOX News and expand your horizons so the people around you will stop talking behind your back about your narrow-mindedness.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 5:24 pm on Thu, Dec 8, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2574

    Bob Chapman, with all the TV coverage, I would think that you surely would have heard of the crimes committed by Serbian Orthodox Christians against various "infidel" groups in the 1990s.

    Take your blinders off, man. There may well be a God out there but, if there is, I sincerely doubt they have anything to do with the countless social organizations that men have come up with over the centuries in order to rape, murder and generally oppress each other.

    No religion is innocent.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 4:38 pm on Thu, Dec 8, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    I am tryiing to come up with another religion besides Islam that still believe people should convert to their faith or they shouldn't be allowed to live. Another religion that routinely stones people to death, beheads "infidels" and treat women with horrific mental and physical torture. Another religion that condones sex with animals (men only). Nope, can't think of one at all. Islam, religion of peace? The facts say otherwise.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 2:20 pm on Thu, Dec 8, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2574

    All evangelical religions have plans for world domination.

     
  • Robert Chapman posted at 1:58 pm on Thu, Dec 8, 2011.

    Bob Chapman Posts: 997

    If you think Islamics don't have plans for world domination, you are as naive as they come. They make no secret of their goals. Read their own websites and publications.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 9:48 am on Thu, Dec 8, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2574

    Mr Fields reminds me of those Americans who supported Hitler because he was tough on the communists. The irony of this letter, of course, lies in the fact that Mr Fields has steadfastly campaigned for a Christian caliphate in the US for decades.

    Hypocrisy: Its the glue that holds the right together.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:24 am on Thu, Dec 8, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    I truly think that Mr. Fields has missed his century. He should have been born in the 11th century so he could have participated in The Crusades under the auspices of the Pope.

    For a person who claims to be a Catholic and a man of God, he certainly has mounted a continual campaign of anti-Muslim rhetoric and hate speech in this publication.

    Shameful.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:42 am on Thu, Dec 8, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2850

    With the fall of the Ottomans came the creation of the Muslim Brotherhood. Like a wounded beast, they yearn to go back to the days of the Ottomans.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:40 am on Thu, Dec 8, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2850

    Many Muslims do not perceive the Caliphate as something negative. It's quite the contrary to them even though it is the antthesis of freedom from oppression.

     

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