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Letter: Capitalism proves wealth redistribution works

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Posted: Saturday, January 11, 2014 8:04 am

This is in response to Jerry Osgood’s Letter to the Editor, “Redistribution of wealth has never worked,” on Jan. 17. I would like to ask him, since he hates communism and socialism so much, has he ever fought against it?

I fought against it in Vietnam in the late ’60s. As a matter of fact, the American military (Army, Navy, Air Force and Marines) provided a form of “socialism” for the Southeast Asian peasants in the areas they served known as “civic action” programs. But how dare we provide that for our own working poor!

And as far as “redistribution of wealth has never worked,” it has been working in our own country for decades under the guise of “free enterprise capitalism.” What do you call it when the working class, particularly working poor, create the wealth by their labor while the bosses (CEOs) rake in the profits and the workers are barely able to feed themselves or their families on minimum wage? A recent case in point is the fast food workers such as McDonald’s employees.

In reality the wealth created by the working class is redistributed to the bosses (corporate headquarters) who reap most of it. Oh, isn’t capitalism just wonderful! And let’s just outsource more American jobs for even more corporate profits and less corporate taxes.

The rich provide jobs? Want to tell me another fairy tale? Jobs? Where? Mexico, China, Bangladesh or some other poor country where the workers are paid less than poverty wages and are not provided with safe and healthful working conditions? This is why we have OSHA in this country.

If the super-rich in America paid an equitable share of taxes (which they do not), they would still live much better than the rest of us.

And as far as trusting the rich to help the poor through trickle-down economics, that’s like letting the fox guard the henhouse. For every dollar trickled down, hundreds more are sucked right back up to the rich through their vacuum cleaners of greed, inflation and excessive profits!

John Cooper

Lodi

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32 comments:

  • Andrew Liebich posted at 1:50 pm on Tue, Jan 14, 2014.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    You were the one who said, "They never paid 91%." Get a clue will ya!
    [sleeping]

     
  • John Lucas posted at 10:57 am on Tue, Jan 14, 2014.

    John Lucas Posts: 2730

    Who has not a clue? I would say the person who does not understand the definition of "effective tax rate". I will help you. 55% was the average rate they ended up paying after their tax lawyers got finished with their return. 91% was the top marginal rate when applied to the adjusted gross income. Get a clue will ya!

     
  • Joe Baxter posted at 8:19 am on Tue, Jan 14, 2014.

    Joe Baxter Posts: 1846

    Cop out? You mean like when you are asked about something and come back with I have already addressed that many times over? Or is it "cop out" if I do it, but not when you do? Hypocisy at its finest.

     
  • Joe Baxter posted at 8:14 am on Tue, Jan 14, 2014.

    Joe Baxter Posts: 1846

    The president had/has a “jobs plan” that the Republicans refused to pass? Please let us in on this “jobs plan” that the Republicans didn’t like so we can tell you exactly WHY they didn’t like it, and I assure you it nothing to do with “jobs”.

     
  • Mike Adams posted at 6:19 am on Tue, Jan 14, 2014.

    Mike Adams Posts: 1385

    Joanne: As if you didn't know what the expected result would be.

    To the CTs....anyone saying something makes it a fact.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 9:13 pm on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2830

    John!!!!!!!!!!

    Duh!!!!!!!!!Of course it's greater now than then. You libs keep on threatening to raise taxes and the rich keep on responding by parking their money in offshore accounts. Hello!!!!!!!!!

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 7:36 pm on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    In the 1950s incomes in the top bracket faced a marginal tax rate of 91%.
    Paul Krugman calls for a return to the top marginal tax rate of 91%.

    As usual, you haven't a clue. [sleeping]

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 7:28 pm on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    Thank you for proving my point. You can't offer one scintilla of divergence.[sleeping]

    p.s. http://youtu.be/MMzd40i8TfA

     
  • John Kindseth posted at 1:05 pm on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    John Kindseth Posts: 243

    for those who only read daily kos and huffington post, here is stossels article featured in Jewish World Review

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 1:02 pm on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Why don't YOU enlighten US, Mr. Liebich?

    You are the one who wants to draw parallels, so YOU do it.

    Another individual who wants someone else to do the work for him!

    And please, if you choose to "accept this mission," do not reference any youtube videos. Try to state it in your OWN words.

    Chuckle....waiting!!!

     
  • John Lucas posted at 11:58 am on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    John Lucas Posts: 2730

    They never paid 91%. The effective rate was about 55% for them. I doubt the rich transferring their money overseas was greater than it is now.

     
  • John Lucas posted at 11:56 am on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    John Lucas Posts: 2730

    Not true. They vote for a tax code to redistribute to the top of the income scale.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:08 am on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Dum-de-dee-dum-dum.....

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:08 am on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    As usual - a cop out for NEVER writing ANYTHING in this forum except insults and personal attacks.

    Why DO you bother, Baxxter?

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:06 am on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    No, Mr Dockter. Obviously, you have a lack of comprehension and/or wish to turn my comment into something it is not.

    Your usual MO.

     
  • Andrew Liebich posted at 8:50 am on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Andrew Liebich Posts: 2999

    If you are confused about the ultimate goals of the CPUSA Ms. Bobin, they have been kind enough to post online their “Program Of The Communist Party USA.”

    Can you offer one scintilla of divergence between what the CPUSA wants and what Obama and the rest of the Democrats want?

    Of course you can't... [sleeping]

     
  • John Kindseth posted at 8:29 am on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    John Kindseth Posts: 243

    still simple and easy reading:

    http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2014/01/08/so-what-if-rich-people-have-more-money-than-poor-people-in-2014/?intcmp=obinsite

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:43 am on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2830

    Ms. Bobbin stated,

    Quit whining and griping about people who want something for nothing and get back to the business of getting this country's economy back on track.

    -In other words, don't worry about those people who want something for nothing and are a burden on the economy. Is that what you are saying, Ms. Bobbin?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:39 am on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2830

    John,

    You're partially right. Actually, Conservatives aren't opposed to redistribution of wealth. As long as people have more control over their money and not so muich government intrusion.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 6:57 am on Mon, Jan 13, 2014.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2830

    John,

    Speaking of history. Let's look at this from another perspective. The 91% tax rate you spoke of in another thread led to a lot of the rich transferring their money into offshore accounts away from the tax burden of the IRS. Today, there's still billions and billions of dollars sitting in these accounts. Reagan tried to give an incentive to get this money back into circulation here. It was too little too late. subsequently, the middle class has suffered. You can't blame Reagan for trying to reverse something that shouldn't have been done anyway. There's plenty of money out there, John. The problem is. the Feds have gotten so many people conditioned to sit on their butts. Or complain why that minimum wage job isn't enough to raise a family. How about that. A minumum wage job ISN'T nearly enough to raise a family.

     
  • Ed Walters posted at 12:55 pm on Sun, Jan 12, 2014.

    the old dog Posts: 526

    Lucas, while it bothers me somewhat to agree with you about the average age of a fast food worker, I don`t eat that grease anymore so I wouldn`t know. That evidently means that if the worker started in his or her teens and still at it at 29 years old, I don`t doubt they will retire asking, " would you like cheese with that", and go home after their shift smelling like a cheese burger. At the present wage of $7.20 and a new miminum wage of $10.00, due the math, not all that much on a monthy basis after taxes. Lucas, you seem to forget that all of the super wealthy didn`t start that way, Gates, Buffett and even Opara didn`t. Thanks to the rich they buy all the most expensive items, things people in this floundering economy can`t touch, look at the million dollar homes in Miami beach and Blackhawk. As I recall, Barry said when running for President the second time, if I can`t get the nations rate under 5%, I won`t run. Well. Nothing from the WH on Bengasi, however one day after that bridge mess, a congressional committee was formed to look into why this happened. Strange on how fast or slow certain parts of government move when it is in their favor, or slow if not. One more interesting bit of information for you, when I was growing up there were no fast food joints. Now there is a fast food place on every corner, the population has been super-sized, and stage two diabetes will be more common than a heart attack.

     
  • Joe Baxter posted at 12:41 pm on Sun, Jan 12, 2014.

    Joe Baxter Posts: 1846

    What's the point? All of the BS in this letter have been written and re-written by John Lucas and beat to death many, many times. Same old yadda, yadda from the liberal sheep.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 12:04 pm on Sun, Jan 12, 2014.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    "Not in MY America we don't!"

    Cracks me up when any discussion of tax reform or income inequality is brought up the cons immediately go to the "threat of socialism/communism" tack.

    No one here is advocating that we turn the US into a socialist or communist government or economy (no matter how much Mr. Liebich claims that the Communist Party USA is growing by leaps and bounds - "according to their website" he states - but actual membership is estimated at 2,000 - big threat, eh?)

    We've had socialist policies since the 1930's, but we never hear complaints about this huge amount of socialism from the cons here because most of them BENEFIT from it all - Social Security, Medicare, Social Security Disability, Social Security Income (disability), the VA medical centers and on and on. If it's a government run program - it's "socialism" whether you paid into it or not.

    Then it's on to the "freeloaders and moochers." Every society has some, but I'd be willing to bet that most people would trade living in squalor for a decent paying job any day.

    Which, by the way, the Republicans in the House and Senate have denied the American public by voting against it or not bringing the president's job plan up for a vote.

    And then they whine when people need extended unemployment benefits, when THEY are the ones preventing people from getting on with their lives.- THEY are the ones who CAUSED THE RECESSION.
    FYI, cons - in order to get unemployment, you have to HAVE BEEN EMPLOYED to begin with.

    Quit whining and griping about people who want something for nothing and get back to the business of getting this country's economy back on track.

     
  • Mike Adams posted at 8:52 am on Sun, Jan 12, 2014.

    Mike Adams Posts: 1385

    Seems most of the cons are tongue tied on this one. Or forgot how to write.

     
  • Walter Chang posted at 7:07 pm on Sat, Jan 11, 2014.

    Walt Posts: 1117

    "jealous left-leaning zealots"

    Oh brother!

    So Jerry, John(s) left leaning, huh? Definately. A zealot? Not anymore then you. Jealous? No, not at all!

    Unlike you...

    Who's only here strictly out of concern for himself.

    Only for your own desires, beliefs and entertainment. Repeatedly proselytizing and chastising all those you despise. Thy "opinion" et al must reign supreme.

    They're here, out of concern for others.

    Not for themselves. People that are suffering and in need. Not free loaders. Families that could use a little help or a break. Not criminals. For children.

    They would like the tax regulations to be fair and equitable. Corporations and government to be accountable. Opportunities and hope for a better future. A fair shake.

    They're here out of compasion.

    Not jealosy.

    [thumbup]

     
  • John Lucas posted at 4:43 pm on Sat, Jan 11, 2014.

    John Lucas Posts: 2730

    The average fast food worker is 29 years old. This age is not like when we were growing up. We grew up when liberal policies grew a strong vibrant middle class. the policies changed with Reagan and we are stuck with a floundering economy which only favors the super wealthy. BTW, Ed, the super wealthy thank you for your support.

     
  • John Lucas posted at 4:38 pm on Sat, Jan 11, 2014.

    John Lucas Posts: 2730

    You might try opening a history book yourself. Before Reagan the rich paid a much higher tax rate than they do now. Since then the middle class has been hollowed out, income inequality has skyrocketed and upward mobility has gone way down. Your conservative economics only works for the uber wealthy and they thank you for your support.

     
  • Ed Walters posted at 1:36 pm on Sat, Jan 11, 2014.

    the old dog Posts: 526

    I am quite sure that McDonalds workers work hard for their money, however doesn`t everyone. The teen agers comprise most of the work force at McDonalds and might be their first job, and I commend them for for applying and getting that job. Anyone working at a starting wage over time feels he or she deserves a pay raise, at a starting wage means the person is most likely living with their mother and father or a couple of room mates. And by no means can afford to live by themselves or have anything else that requires more than mimium wage. To raise the mimium wage can only mean the price of a burger will go up or the junior worker will go home. Still at $10 an hour over $8.50 that new car will have to wait until a higher paying job is found, and not in the fast food industry. When construction starts again, the trades and a great place to find a high paying job and without a college education, now we are talking about hard work that can be dangerous also, working the drive thru, piece of cake. The reason for outsourcing, the same as fast food, not necessarly for the CEO, but for the shareholders that purchase stock in order to make money, Money, thats what its all about.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 10:46 am on Sat, Jan 11, 2014.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2353

    Oh for crying out loud! I’ve been hearing this claptrap that the rich aren’t paying their “fair share” for years. Well, why aren’t they paying their fair share? We’ve got a tax code that dictates what everyone should pay, and unless they’re breaking the law, they’re paying precisely what they’re supposed to be paying. So if they ARE breaking the law, then go after them.

    By the way, how much should the “rich” be paying? Let’s take the oil companies for example, shall we. How much does it take for them to get the oil out of the ground, to the refineries, refine it, store it, ship it to the gas stations for distribution, and then getting it into the gas tanks of every gas-guzzling American’s automobile? Now let’s look at the taxes that are hooked onto each gallon of gas that we drink. It’s been proven that those “rich” folks who get the gas to us are permitted to keep far less in profits than what the government takes in taxes - and exactly what does the government actually do in order to assist with getting that fuel to us? Nothing! Oh, you can say that they build the roads. Fine - but how much is each truck hauling that fuel from place to place during the process taxed for the privilege of driving over those roads?

    The problem isn’t the successful among us that have earned all that money. What I’m hearing is nothing but jealous left-leaning zealots complain: “If the super-rich in America paid an equitable share of taxes (which they do not), they would still live much better than the rest of us.” Well, boo-hoo!! They have better homes and better automobiles! What a bunch of malarkey! You want more? Then do what it takes to open a business and make it successful. Then you can live as well as the super rich in America. Until then, you’ll have to settle for homes that compared to practically every other country throughout the world are considered mansions.

    So let’s then look at how fine it would be under socialism and then communism: crack open a history book and take a look at the differences between the two Germany’s after World War II for an excellent example. Separated by just a wall, the disparate differences are striking. Look at what the East Berliners had to drive compared to those on the West side; look at their homes; look at the heels of the boots of communism they were forced to live under. Is that what we want here? Really? Not in MY America we don’t!

     
  • John Lucas posted at 9:42 am on Sat, Jan 11, 2014.

    John Lucas Posts: 2730

    Yes there many who think like I do out there. Mr Cooper is just one of many. Most think it is pointless to argue with people like you because you gave up critical thinking years ago if you ever were capable of it. I argue with people like you so you will put on paper who you really are and what you are really about. As I have said before, You are one of the best advertisements for the Liberal cause.

    BTW, I am not Mr Cooper but I welcome him. I am not Darrell Baumbach who attempted that nonsense before.

     
  • John Lucas posted at 8:33 am on Sat, Jan 11, 2014.

    John Lucas Posts: 2730

    [thumbup]

    Very well put. Good letter. The reality is that Conservative are for redistribution of wealth. Through the bought off lobbyists and politicians they give a tax code and laws that distribute to the top of the income scale.

     
  • Joe Baxter posted at 8:17 am on Sat, Jan 11, 2014.

    Joe Baxter Posts: 1846

    Hmm, John Cooper, aka John Lucas? Eerie similiar overtones.

     

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