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Joe Guzzardi Obama birth certificate debate: A closer look

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Joe Guzzardi

Posted: Saturday, April 16, 2011 12:00 am | Updated: 6:38 am, Sat Apr 16, 2011.

The dustup between mogul Donald Trump and New York Times editorial page columnist Gail Collins over whether or not President Barack Obama has a valid birth certificate or is a U.S. citizen makes for wonderful political theatrics. Would-be 2012 Republican presidential candidates, including The Donald himself, must be licking their chops over the potential fodder this nagging "birther" debate may represent during their campaigns.

Even the most ardent Obama supporters would agree that the favorable 2008 conditions under which Obama was elected are ancient history: an America grown weary of eight George W. Bush years, a nation tired of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, an electorate optimistic about the first African-American president, believers hypnotized by "change you can believe in," and the unemployed encouraged by the promise of 3 to 5 million new jobs. All that stood between Obama and the White House was the ineffectual John McCain.

Not only are those advantageous circumstances distant memories for Obama, but the 2008 aggressor will be on the defensive in 2012 over the stubborn unemployment rate, his health care plan and a third war in Libya. More Obama headaches loom. He'll have to defend against all the other accumulated baggage an office holding president carries.

My message to Trump: Go for it! With Republicans having little to lose against an incumbent who projects a $1 billion war chest, why not make Obama's birth certificate one in your arsenal of issues? Nothing in American history could be more scandalous than a president who is not legally eligible to serve under the Constitution sitting in the White House.

While it's hard to be brief about the subject, I'll try. At the debate's core is the short form Certification of Birth that Obama holds and that Hawaii claims is the only document it issues at birth, versus the longform birth certificate that many native Hawaiians have posted on the Internet but which Obama's camp and the Hawaiian government insists does not exist.

The former contains scant information like the child's name, date of birth and parents' race. The latter has the details including the hospital's name, the attending doctor and the appropriate official signatures. Despite passionate arguments that the long form isn't available, Susan Nordyke, who was born in Honolulu on Aug. 5, 1961 just one day after Obama, produced a long-form birth certificate that's on the Internet. Anyone can see it.

Despite protestations by Chiyome Fukino, the former head of the state agency in charge of birth records, that documents pertaining to individuals' birth circumstances cannot be released, the evidence is to the contrary. According to Hawaii Revised Statutes, Paragraph 38-13(a) specifies that the agency "shall, upon request, furnish an applicant a certified copy of any certificate, or the contents of any certificate, or any part thereof." Further, subparagraph C allows that copies of birth certificates "may be made by photograph, dry copy reproduction, typing, computer printout or other process approved by the director of health."

Among the most pressing lingering questions are why, if Obama was born in Hawaii as he insists, doesn't he simply produce the long-form document to prove it?

I'm not convinced one way or the other. For Obama to be the United States president but a Kenyan national, as birthers maintain, means that a large portion of Washington, D.C. insiders, including the Secret Service which vets high level government officials, would have to have looked the other way for two years and kept quiet about what they know.

Still, last year the Supreme Court refused to hear Donofrio vs. Wells, the case that questioned Obama's citizenship. In a single word, the Court stated that the application was "denied."

Whatever your political leanings are, there's enough to question about Obama and his birth certificate that the president should be eager to put all the doubters to rest. So far, that hasn't happened.

Joe Guzzardi retired from the Lodi Unified School District in 2008. He lives in Pittsburgh, Pa. Contact him at guzzjoe@yahoo.com.

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Welcome to the discussion.

119 comments:

  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:36 am on Wed, May 4, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    K Lee wrote:

    I do not have any knowledge of President Obama covering anything up or any knowledge of him spending money on any such thing. Maybe you are just be guessing. Is this another birther accusation?

    K Lee,
    Is this yet another insinuation from the left that if one dares to question Obama's motives it must be because one is racist?

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 3:49 pm on Sat, Apr 30, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Lee stated...Darrell Baumbach: Do you really have so little else to work with that you need to twist the words and point of others in order to get your jabs in? Come on now.

    Lee... this was not a jab... it was a play on words... more joking with a smile.... just as I am sure you were having conversation as you described...

    I think you are very polite... interesting and generally have a very good nature about you... not sure why you interpret my comments as putting you down... sorry

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 2:29 pm on Sat, Apr 30, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Steve Schmidt said, "I would submit to Darrel that Obama's move was a political masterpiece."

    K Lee said, "Hmmm... interesting. I guess it exposed the nutty people."

    Darrell Baumbach said, "I agree with lee ... it exposed the nutty people... all on the left who are silent ... are nutty....Lee has a great point..."

    -----------------


    Darrell Baumbach: Do you really have so little else to work with that you need to twist the words and point of others in order to get your jabs in? Come on now.

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 2:23 pm on Sat, Apr 30, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Darrell Baumbach: There you go again being rude when we're trying to have a conversation (so I thought after your apology). I guess you were not sincere. First you start addressing me in your response and then in the middle of your comments you start talking about me and insulting me, as if you are now gossiping to your buddies. What gives with you? Can't you have a normal conversation or debate without all the nastiness?

    Sheesh....anyway...

    I do not have any knowledge of President Obama covering anything up or any knowledge of him spending money on any such thing. Maybe you are just be guessing. Is this another birther accusation?

    So, it seems that you think I am a nut because I did not jump in with the birther agenda. I'll consider the source of that comment. FYI... it's not being nutty to avoid jumping on every conspiracy theory that comes along. This usually leads to having egg on ones face.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:03 am on Sat, Apr 30, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Darrell wrote:


    Personally, I think the birth certificate issue is and always has been minor... the real story is all the people like Lee that do not question any appearance of impropriety of democrats in power.

    -And will we really ever know how much money Obama has spent to cover up many other things he would prefer the public never know is the $100k question.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 9:10 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Steve stated...If I criticize Michelle Bachman, will someone jump on me for playing the idiot card?...

    Steve... you should be more kind to yourself... I think you are intelligent...why would you describe yourself as an idiot... very narrow focused maybe... but not an idiot... please reconsider...(smile)

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 9:00 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Lee stated...Steve Schmidt, "I would submit to Darrel that Obama's move was a political masterpiece."
    Hmmm... interesting. I guess it exposed the nutty people.

    I agree with lee ... it exposed the nutty people... all on the left who are silent ... are nutty....Lee has a great point...

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:43 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Lee stated...Darrell: I don't know how President Obama decides to spend his money. Isn't that his business?

    Lee … Please tell me you are joking...that is the full extent of your curiosity... we are not talking about $23.99... we are talking about millions... so if George W would have spent millions to hide his military records... which he did not... you would just say... its his money?... Personally, I think the birth certificate issue is and always has been minor... the real story is all the people like Lee that do not question any appearance of impropriety of democrats in power... just like the three monkeys...
    hear no evil... see no evil... speak no evil.... I'm not saying Obama did anything bad... I'm saying spending a fortune to hide personal records should be a red flag to a reasonable person... Instead the left did and still does its best to Nutify the right for questioning the obvious.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 7:32 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Joseph Farah wrote some time ago of the birtherbagger movement: "It's not going to go away, and it will drive a wedge in an already divided public."

    Little did he realize that the wedge it would drive would be through the heart of his own party.

    As birtherbagger protests spread through town hall meetings in Republican districts, mainstream Republicans are beginning to realize that they will reap that which they have sown. What the Teabaggers did to the Democrats in 2010 was only a preview of what they are going to do to the GOP in 2012 and onwards. One can't help but wonder whether this ever increasing split between mainline Republicans and the far from center nut jobs will eventually spell the end of the Republican Party.

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 7:30 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Darrell: I don't know how President Obama decides to spend his money. Isn't that his business? If he wanted to make sure every Tom, Dick and Harry were unable to obtain personal information and docs that belong to his family then so be it. That's his business. We have seen the birth docs already, the official papers of his birth. Only the frenzied birthers were seeking more and more and more....as if they would uncover some terrible secret. Our president is legit. What is next on the birther agenda? Complete silliness indeed. A ridiculous distraction for their chosen party for sure.

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 7:16 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Steve Schmidt, "I would submit to Darrel that Obama's move was a political masterpiece."

    Hmmm... interesting. I guess it exposed the nutty people.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:08 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=292553


    I suggest one read the whole article.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:06 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Darrell,

    Quoting from Joseph Farrah's article in WND.com


    "Why would two long-form birth certificates from Hawaii, filled out at the same hospital within 24 hours of each other be so different?

    No explanation was provided by Team Obama, and, of course, none was requested by the media watchdogs who were in a hurry to show they didn't miss the biggest political fraud of the 21st century.

    Sadly, if what is represented on this new "birth certificate" is an accurate representation of Obama's actual birth, it does not prove he is eligible to be president, but just the opposite. "

    Read more: It's settled! Obama's ineligible http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=292553#ixzz1Ky4sHDGr

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 7:05 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    So, if I point out the obvious here, am I playing the "plagiarism card"?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:01 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Darrell,

    There is the issue of Obama's Father not bdeing an American citizen at the time of Obama's birth that no one here wants to discuss. I did counter Steve's argument
    about the first several Presidents qualifying for the "Grandfather Provision" in the Constitution I posted on this thread. But he seems to not have an answer why Obama
    would qualify for this provision. And why is there not the Great Seal of Hawaii stamped on the BC? Every other state in the union has their particular seal stamped on the BC.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 6:54 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Is it just me or are Steve's posts getting stranger and stranger as the day goes on? I would blame it on the moon but I checked its phase and its pretty close to new so perhaps something like a sharp drop in endorphins as the day goes on is the culprit.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 6:07 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    If I criticize Michelle Bachman, will someone jump on me for playing the idiot card?

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 3:56 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    If we follow this line of thought far enough, how long will it be until people who rape children can no longer be called pedophiles if they happen to be Republicans?

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 3:53 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Darrell, you speak of cards but what would you have people do when they are attacked by racist loonies?

    Has the right really become so obsessed with political correctness that an individual who regularly tells racist jokes and uses racist epithets cannot be called a racist?

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 3:33 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Interesting that the left refuses to have a serious conversation... disappointing actually... there are more than two sides to this coin... the looney toon card is played just about as often as the race card... it would be refershing to have an adult conversation... even about Obamas birth certifiate...

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 1:31 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    I wonder whether I need to add an emoticon to that post to indicate that I am joking.

    Around here one never knows......

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 1:29 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Chuckle.... I thought that you had made a brilliant suggestion. The country could not help but benefit from the excerption (to coin a phrase) of these individuals from the national discourse.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 12:38 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2367

    Oops! "Excerpt" that leads the first sentence in the second paragraph of my previous post clearly should be "Except." I apologize for any confusion this may have caused.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 12:36 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Well, Jerry, we will see. In the meantime, I am so pleased that Brian and those who share his beliefs are on your side and not on mine.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 12:25 pm on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2367

    "Political masterpiece?" Doubtful. One of the many problems that plague President Obama is his sense of timing. "Dither" has become synonymous with his choice of when to act on presidential matters. Here, I'm afraid he's moved way too fast.

    Clearly, insofar as Obama's eligibility to be the president the matter is at rest. Excerpt for the very few who might start to demand that the ink or type be analyzed to ensure that it matches the elements of the early sixties era, there's virtually nothing left. I had half-expected that Obama would have held out and used this as a sort of "October Surprise" that would have quelled this issue as his actual presidential record might have been put on the back-burner until this was resolved - especially with the likes of Donald Trump demanding that Obama finally end the problem once and for all.

    No, Obama only served to make himself look foolish and very frightened owing to the entrance of Trump into the fray; why else did he come clean now, just to secure an appearance on Oprah? Aside from Trump’s sophomoric “I won!” exclamations, he truly did pull one over on the president. So as the campaign begins in earnest in 2012, President Barack H. Obama will have nothing else to rely upon than his record as President of the United States of America - Ditherer in Chief. Political masterpiece? Only in his own mind and in the minds of those that truly believe he’s something special, which clearly he is not.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 11:15 am on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Jerry, you have often stated your intention to make sure that Obama only serves one term. I imagine folks like Brian will make that task a whole lot harder which is why I would submit to Darrel that Obama's move was a political masterpiece.

    This issue will only serve to broaden the ever growing divide between the mainstream GOP and the loony minority that makes up its base.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 6:39 am on Fri, Apr 29, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    There you have it folks. Steve Schmidt is definitely a euphemism for condescending.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 9:50 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2367

    Well Mr. Dockter, when it comes to matter such as this I'd rather not go completely with my gut instincts. And while I have had a modicum of success trusting myself in that regard, when I have the ability and time to prove a point with actual evidence, that's the way I'd prefer to go. In this particular case, I do believe that Mr. Obama is a legitimate President of the United States, albeit a rather pathetic one. But rather than repeat what I intend to do to help him become a one-term president or perform yet another cut and paste to get my point across, I'll just refer you back to my post at 5:51 p.m. on Thursday, April 28, 2011 for my final thoughts on this matter. Now at least as far as I'm concerned, unless something of substance arises that would change my mind, I think I'm ready to move on. Of course you are free to do whatever you choose.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 9:00 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    "Candyars"????

    Is it just me or are Brian's posts getting stranger and stranger as the night goes on? I would blame it on the moon but I checked its phase and its pretty close to new so perhaps some other "spirits" are at work?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:47 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Steve wrote:


    Brian, are you aware that the fathers of presidents James Buchanan and Chester Arthur were both citizens of Great Britain at the time of their birth?

    You need to set your racism aside, apologize to us for wasting our time and move on to greener pastures.

    -Steve,
    Evidently you are not capable of preventing Obama from blowing smoke up you ARS
    because you are so afraid he's going to call you a racist and you cannot challenge
    a person Regardless of their skin color or ethnicity becaue you're a candyars.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:35 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857


    http://puzo1.blogspot.com/2011/02/citizenship-status-of-our-44-presidents.html

    The only exception to all this, apart from Barack Obama, is Chester Arthur. Chester Arthur (1881-1885), was born on October 5, 1829 in Fairfield, Vermont. His father, William Arthur, when eighteen years of age, emigrated from Co. Antrim, Ireland. His father did not become a naturalized U.S. citizen until 14 years after Chester Arthur’s birth. Chester Arthur’s mother, Malvina Stone, was born April 29, 1802 in Berkshire, Franklin, Vermont. Hence, Chester Arthur was born to a father who was not a U.S. citizen at the time of his birth. Because the citizenship of the wife merged into that of the husband, this made Arthur born to an alien mother and father. He was therefore born with dual citizenship of the United Kingdom and the United States. It is believed that Chester Arthur lied numerous times about his past to hide the fact that when he was born his father was not a U.S. citizen and to therefore obfuscate his ineligibility to hold Vice-Presidential and Presidential office. What is most telling is that Chester Arthur also burned all personal records just prior to his death. Chester Arthur was challenged during his Vice Presidential bid on the ground that he was not born in the United States. No one challenged Chester Arthur on the ground that even if he were born in the United States, he was still not an Article II “natural born Citizen” because of his father’s foreign citizenship at the time of his birth which also made his mother an alien. Hence, the Chester Arthur example is not and cannot be treated as any precedent since the nation was not aware of the truth about his father’s and mother’s non-U.S. citizenship status at the time of his birth. Gregory J. Dehler, Chester Alan Arthur: The Life of a Gilded Age Politician and President, Published by Nova Science Publishers, Incorporated, 2006, ISBN 1600210791, 9781600210792, 192 pages; http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2008/12/06/urgent-historical-breakthrough-proof-chester-arthur-concealed-he-was-a-british-subject-at-birth/. Also see the research done by attorney Leo Donofrio on the Chester Arthur issue which can be found at http://naturalborncitizen.wordpress.com/2008/12/06/urgent-historical-breakthrough-proof-chester-arthur-concealed-he-was-a-british-subject-at-birth/.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:24 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mike...I agree with you that this whole episode was loony.... if the looney' s were the symphony, Obama was the director... if the director stops his baton... the symphony stops playing... right?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:23 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Jerome,

    Regarding your post at 5:51. I agree we are not privy to all the information to come to a conclusion Obama is not eligible. So, until one can prove Jerome Corsi and a miriad of others are all wet, I must conclude you don't know where to go with this. In other words,
    just because you're capable of putting together sentences and thoughts better than me
    doesn't mean your gut instinct is superior to mine.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:13 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Steve Schmidt posted at 6:48 ….Darrell, the President had already obligated whatever duty he had to prove his qualifications in this regard by releasing the short form. He had no obligation to dignify the ravings of a few deranged lunatics by releasing the long form …
    Point well made Steve... no argument with that... but my point was not about his obligation …
    I simply was trying to put myself in his shoes... if I knew I would spend millions to prevent the long form from being disclosed, and if I knew that I could put an end to the speculation and preoccupation of this issue... and save millions at the same time... I would release the long form in a heart beat... I am not saying he was obligated... you are right... but he is the president of all people... not just his supporters and if he has it in his power to make a divided country run more smooth... why not exercise that power...

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 8:12 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Brian, are you aware that the fathers of presidents James Buchanan and Chester Arthur were both citizens of Great Britain at the time of their birth?

    You need to set your racism aside, apologize to us for wasting our time and move on to greener pastures.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:26 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    It seems to me no one here wants to discuss the fact that Obama's Father was not a U.S. citizen at the time of his son's birth in Hawaii and this makes Obama ineligible to be President. And the fact that EVEN Jerome and Darrell don't want to discuss this I find troubling given Not only World Net Daily but dozens of sites with dozens of Bloggers and Writers at this moment are debating this issue, I must conclude there is indeed
    a disconnect with the brightest of bloggers in Lodi or, in Darrells case, from Lodi, with
    the outside world.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 6:51 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Mike Adams, I would humbly suggest that you be careful what you wish for.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 6:50 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Or, perhaps, "fulfilled".

    Is the LNS ever going to add an edit feature to these blogs?

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 6:49 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Please substitute "performed" for "obligated".

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 6:48 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Darrell, the President had already obligated whatever duty he had to prove his qualifications in this regard by releasing the short form. He had no obligation to dignify the ravings of a few deranged lunatics by releasing the long form. It was only when the front runner for the GOP nomination discredited himself by putting the issue on the national agenda that it became necessary for hims to release the long form.

    It is not the duty of the President of the United States to respond to the rantings of every drooling Arizona welfare queen. Indeed, to do so would tarnish whatever dignity his predecessors have left the office.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 6:44 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Brian, I think the fact that the sole current proponent of these absurd racist theories has a long history of making absurd racist comments on these blogs is entirely relevant. It speaks to your character and the character of your movement.

     
  • Mike Adams posted at 6:27 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Mike Adams Posts: 1502

    This sounds like a case for a lawyer! And not just any lawyer, but a super lawyer!
    Some lawyer that isn't bound by legislation and certificates, but a lawyer who has none of these things.......Daniel Hutchins.

    1st....check to see if the flag has yellow fringe
    2nd... Is Barack Obama's name in all capital letters!
    3rd .. determine which corporation owns the rights to President's stock symbol and
    where we can see its' value

    and on and on......

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 5:51 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2367

    Mr. Dockter, of course I believe Obama is subject to the Constitution; as we all are. Only now I believe you may be out of your league insofar as Constitutional law is concerned (as am I).

    Rather than reinvent the wheel as it were by relying upon only the Constitution as your guide to determine any citizen's eligibility to become the president, I'd advise you to dig a little further into the case law and arguments presented before the various courts (including the Supreme Court) that brings us to this point in time Constitutionally and not just as it pertains to President Obama.

    As far as the original problem that existed, had Barack H. Obama not been born within the United States (as many had proposed and probably hoped to be the case), his birth certificate now proves that he was - unless further investigation unearths evidence that would result in this new document to be untrue or fraudulent (which I doubt will be the case).

    No, I think the matter is now settled insofar as his eligibility is concerned. What is still difficult to comprehend is why it took him until now to bring this "sideshow" to a close. Once again, with all the power at my disposal between now and Election Day 2012 I will do all I can to ensure that Barack Obama is a one-term president. In my opinion, dwelling on his birth certificate won’t even begin to accomplish that end, ergo it’s a waste of time.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 5:38 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857


    http://www.thepostemail.com/2010/03/09/department-of-justice-embraces-obamas-politics-of-tyranny/


    Department of Justice embraces Obama’s Politics of Tyranny 386
    Share 0diggs
    digg
    ARGUES IN KERCHNER VS. OBAMA APPELLEE BRIEF THAT U.S. CONSTITUTION IS NOT THE LAW OF THE LAND
    Legal Analysis by John Charlton

    March 9, 2010) — Many U.S. Citizens have not awakened to the fact that the U.S.A. is no longer a Constitutional Republic, but a tyrannical state, overthrown from the very day Chief Justice Roberts administered the oath of office to the ineligible candidate, Barack Hussein Obama II.

    Those in denial of this bitter political reality need look no further for the evidence of the paradigm shift in the minds of lawyers for the U.S. Department of Justice than the opposition brief filed by Tony West, Assistant Attorney General, Paul J. Fishman, U.S. Attorney, and Mark B. Stern and Eric Fleisig-Green, of the Appellate Staff Division of the DoJ, before the U.S. Third Circuit Court of Appeals in the case of Kerchner et al. vs. Obama & Congress.


     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 5:28 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Steve,

    Besides you, I know of no one else who has used the N word here on the NEW blogg format. Can you please explain to us why something I have acknowledged I did in bad taste on the OLD blogg format has any revelance on this thread?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 5:22 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Steve,

    Take a flying leap. Who the heck are you to tell me what to do? If you can't handle the fact that BO is not a natural born citizen it's not my problem. I knew you were dense.
    But this takes the cake. You seem to have no problem enabling Obama. Look at the BC again. His FATHER was not a citizen of America.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 4:23 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Brian, when you make "n1gger" jokes, you forfeit the right to talk about the infamous race card.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 2:46 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    K Lee posted at 12:18 pm...Well, the president had shown his birth information to us a long time ago. The newly released longer form states the same information as the other legal birth form that we’ve already seen...
    I appreciate very much the response, however, it does not address my question at all....
    Mr Obama could have avoided paying a fortune hiding what he now released... he spent more than most people make in 20 years. Why? By releasing the short form, it may have satisfied many... but that is not the point... I am surprised that you do not think spending a fortune is odd... when it was preventable. He only donated 60,000 to charity during all those years, but could spend millions to hide a silly birth certificate... his priorities seem whacky as does his character...

    Its this inexplicable behavior that makes some question his sincerity and judgment... it also added fuel to the fire that he was hiding something... because I think he is intelligent, he must have known what he was doing and somehow saw political advantage to doing what he did.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 12:18 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    For the record, I will challenge ANYONE if I don't think they are eligible REGARDLESS of their skin color or ethnicity.

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 12:18 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Darrell Baumbach: Please don’t wait with “bated breath” for my answers. They are really not that profound. :-)

    Well, the president had shown his birth information to us a long time ago. The newly released longer form states the same information as the other legal birth form that we’ve already seen. I never had a problem with the certificate we had all already seen years ago. I never listen to the nuts and their conspiracy theories. I think for myself. I think you do too.

    Both of the forms are legal documents of birth in the United States. Both carry the same weight. It has been frivolous to insist on more birth docs when birth has already been documented and proven.

    What might the “birthers” focus on now that their conspiracy theories have been blown out of the water (again)? As we see here on the boards, some have already moved to another complaint about the president's birth.

    I believe that the president has more important things to address and so do the American people.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 12:03 pm on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Of course we all know when a liberal is losing an argument they throw in the race card.

    Had it not been for affirmative action people would not have looked the other way on Obama's eligibility. In other words, it is racist for people to look the other way. We'll let Steve digest this for a while.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 10:19 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Brian is right about one thing (a first?). His credentials as a incoherent racist on these blogs are long established.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 9:12 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Steve wrote:


    I find it telling that the sole remaining birther on these threads is a man who likes the word "n1gger".

    -Actually I don't like it's derogatory connotations. Blacks still call their own this word.
    Steve is referring to a joke that was circulated around that mentioned Obama as a Presidential Solution. The joke is in bad taste. Sorry to offend anyone when I posted
    parts of it a LONG time ago.

    Now,
    let's get back to the fact that Obama has somehow qualified for the "Grandfather Provision" in the Constitution. Incidently, Jerome Corsi has a new book coming out on the whole issue of Obama and his BC. For those of you who don't remember him
    he wrote the book about John Kerry and the Swift Boats.

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 8:50 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    I find it telling that the sole remaining birther on these threads is a man who likes the word "n1gger".

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:29 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    BORN IN THE USA?

    Obama challengers: Doc proves president ineligible
    'They are going to have to face the music on this at some point'

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Posted: April 27, 2011
    8:07 pm Eastern


    By Bob Unruh
    © 2011 WorldNetDaily

    President Barack Obama in the Oval Office April 4, 2011
    The "Certificate of Live Birth" document released by the White House today, if authentic, assures Americans that their president was born in Hawaii as he has said, according to two participants in a lawsuit who challenged the president's tenure in the Oval Office.

    But they say it also proves he's ineligible under the Constitution's requirements to be president.

    According to Mario Apuzzo, the attorney who argued the Kerchner vs. Obama case, and the lead plaintiff, retired Navy Cmdr. Charles Kerchner, the documentation reveals that Barack Obama Sr., a Kenyan national subject to the jurisdiction of the United Kingdom, was the father when Barack Obama Jr. was born.

    That, they say, would disqualify Obama because of the Founders' requirement in the Constitution that a president be a "natural born Citizen," commonly understood during the era of the beginnings of the United States to mean a citizen offspring of two citizen parents.

    Read more: Obama challengers: Doc proves president ineligible http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=292441#ixzz1KpeGWYcT

     
  • Barry Oaks posted at 8:02 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Barry Oaks Posts: 2

    I viewed the full version of Obama's Certificate of Live Birth and thought the date where the mother signed and date where the doctor signed (one day apart) were somewhat similar in appearance. The angle of the numbers and angle of the dashes were possibly consistant with each other. It made me think that the same person placed both dates on the document. Perhaps a handwriting expert would have a different opinion.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:01 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Looks like the powers to be a Lodinews don't review posts after 5pm. This explains
    why my posts and others didn't show up right away.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:57 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Steve wrote:

    I suspect he felt that the documentation he had previously provided was adequate, which it was. It certainly isn't Obama's fault that a group of politically motivated nut jobs decided to make this an issue.

    -We still have the issue of his Father not being a U.S citizen. The "Grandfather Provision"
    in the Constitution no longer applies to Presidents. So' I'll ask again: Why should this Provision now apply to Obama?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:41 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Steve wrote:

    I suspect that folks like Brian will still be flinging spittle over the issue decades from now.

    -Yep,
    I know Steve. The U.S. Constitution is just a bunch of spittle

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:39 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Jerome wrote:

    Mr. Dockter, I think you're stretching things just a tad now.

    -So, are you concluding the Constitution does not apply to B.O.?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:19 am on Thu, Apr 28, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    For the third time I will post to counter Steve's post about the first several Presidents of the U.S. Let's see if it gets deleted again. I don't know why since it is a segment of the Constitution.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_Born_Citizen_Clause

    Constitutional provisionsSection 1 of Article Two of the United States Constitution sets forth the eligibility requirements for serving as President of the United States:

    “ No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States. ”

    The grandfather provision of the "natural born Citizen" clause provided an exception to the "natural born" requirement for those persons who were citizens at the time of the adoption of the Constitution. (The first several Presidents prior to Martin van Buren as well as potential Presidential candidates such as Alexander Hamilton were born as British subjects in British America before the American Revolution and this grandfather clause would cover them.)[1]

    Additionally, the Twelfth Amendment states that: "[N]o person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States." The Fourteenth Amendment does not use the phrase "natural born citizen". It does provide that "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 7:21 pm on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    I suspect he felt that the documentation he had previously provided was adequate, which it was. It certainly isn't Obama's fault that a group of politically motivated nut jobs decided to make this an issue.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 6:07 pm on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Steve,
    How convenient for you to leave out the "Grandfather Clause" that only applied
    to the first few Presidents.So, this begs the question: Why should Obama be Grandfathered in when there has been ample enough time for parents of prospective Predidents to be born in America?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_Born_Citizen_Clause

    Constitutional provisionsSection 1 of Article Two of the United States Constitution sets forth the eligibility requirements for serving as President of the United States:

    “ No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States. ”

    The grandfather provision of the "natural born Citizen" clause provided an exception to the "natural born" requirement for those persons who were citizens at the time of the adoption of the Constitution. (The first several Presidents prior to Martin van Buren as well as potential Presidential candidates such as Alexander Hamilton were born as British subjects in British America before the American Revolution and this grandfather clause would cover them.)[1]

    Additionally, the Twelfth Amendment states that: "[N]o person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States." The Fourteenth Amendment does not use the phrase "natural born citizen". It does provide that "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

     
  • Tara O'Neil posted at 5:15 pm on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Tara O'Neil Posts: 1

    What ever happened to "Leonard?" I used to love to read his comments on here!

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 4:58 pm on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Steve,

    The point is, back when the Constitution was being adopted there weren't very many
    Parents of prospective Presidents born in America. Now, here comes along Barack in a time where there are plenty plenty parents of prospective presidents born in America.
    So, this begs the question: Why should Obama be Grandfathered in like the first several Presidents of America?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 4:51 pm on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Oh those little details such as the "Grandfather Provision". Heaven forbid Steve be bothered with such minor (in his mind, of course) formalities.


    Constitutional provisions

    Section 1 of Article Two of the United States Constitution sets forth the eligibility requirements for serving as President of the United States:

    “ No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States. ”

    The grandfather provision of the "natural born Citizen" clause provided an exception to the "natural born" requirement for those persons who were citizens at the time of the adoption of the Constitution. (The first several Presidents prior to Martin van Buren as well as potential Presidential candidates such as Alexander Hamilton were born as British subjects in British America before the American Revolution and this grandfather clause would cover them.)[1]

    Additionally, the Twelfth Amendment states that: "[N]o person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States." The Fourteenth Amendment does not use the phrase "natural born citizen". It does provide that "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 3:55 pm on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    "K lee"... I'm still waiting with bated breath for your answer... why would president Obama spend a fortunate to hide what he just released... I had no doubt all along that he was an American as I have stated in past posts... there was no reason to hide it... the information on it is trivia... but Obama's behavior was strange... odd.. and bewildering... I for one am happy Barack Obama finally did the responsible thing... which was to stop wasting everyone's time... which only he could have done...
    he should have done it because it was the right thing to do... rather than behave like a child enjoying a prank... silly!

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 11:47 am on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    As for Brian's so called argument, eight of the first nine Presidents of the United States were born the children of British subjects just like Barack Obama. In fact, Andrew Jackson's father had been in the country for less time than Barack Obama Sr had when their respective son's were born.

    If you are going to argue that George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, James Monroe, John Quincy Adams, Andrew Jackson, and William Henry Harrison should all have been disqualified from the presidency....

     
  • Steve Schmidt posted at 11:26 am on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Steve Schmidt Posts: 2607

    Jerry, as I have said before, Birtherbaggerpalintitis is a mental disorder. No simple document release is going to cure it. I suspect that folks like Brian will still be flinging spittle over the issue decades from now.

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 9:57 am on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    I suspect that President Obama's birth information (again) may continue to bother "some" Americans. Some folks have actually gotten whipped up into a wild frenzy over this topic. And some are just simply, and easily, led by the loud voices of others. Perhaps said Americans have little else to do. I just don't know. It does seem to be such a waste of time, effort and resources to keep up this "birther" agenda. Time to move on folks. Think for yourself.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 9:22 am on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2367

    Mr. Dockter, I think you're stretching things just a tad now. What the White House released has clearly settled the question of Obama's place and date of birth - two of the three requirements for becoming President of the United States. Now while I've never been a "birther" as defined by most (believing that he was not a United States Citizen) as I only thought it strange he wouldn't let the American people see it.

    I am actually relieved that there will be no Constitutional crisis that surely would have occurred otherwise. I would rather he be voted out of office in 2012 due to his abysmal record than removed because of some sort of chicanery and a conspiracy. Imagine how that would have played out!!

    On the other hand, the issue of why now is interesting. Could it be that Donald Trump can actually bend the arm of the President of the United States to such an extent as to have him utter "uncle!" over such an issue as this? If so, if Trump actually does decide to run in 2012, Obama may be in deep trouble indeed - and I certainly hope so. I’m no Trump fan, but if he’s the “guy,” then so be it!

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:55 am on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Thank you, Mr President for releasing your long form birth certificate proving you are Native born to this country. Unfortunately it is also Primae facia evidence that your father was BHO Sr., not a US citizen as required by the Constitution. You were a dual citizen at the time of your birth. Your father was Kenyan/UK and you were born in Hawaii, so you had dual UK/US citizenship at birth. The Constitution requires the President be Natural born meaning a singular allegiance to the US at birth, distinguished from Native born, meaning born in the country. A Dual citizen by definition has a dual allegiance, which is expressly forbidden by the Constitution in the unique requirement for the Office of the President. Are we supposed to start ignoring the Constitution now? I didn't get the memo, which parts do we ignore, or is it all of it?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:37 am on Wed, Apr 27, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857


    Chuckle,

    I see BO has produced yet another copy of his certificate of LIVE BIRTH from Hawaii.
    We've been down this road before. A certificate of live birth DOES NOT conclude he was born in America. So far, no one else has noticed his sleight of hand.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:38 am on Tue, Apr 26, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Pat... I think Lee (he/she, or it) was pulling everyones leg... style was everything... content was vacant... I thought I was wasting my time in meeting he/she/ it's protocol... it turned out I was right this time... too bad, I was looking forward to the substance.

     
  • Patrick W Maple posted at 12:23 pm on Sun, Apr 24, 2011.

    Pat Maple Posts: 1805

    Much like the question left for BO...who are you? In your statement to Mr Baumbach, you could have asked to be addressed as any of the below or not at all. Simply stating that you are not something leaves the question as to what you ARE. Much like the BO quandry. I disrespect no one...only challenge the comments and facts they put forth. I, like Misters K and B, would like to know your whereabouts on the subject of BO...you have yet to state it and as of this moment have not answered any questions posed to you. If you want to have a civil adult conversation you must not stand in silence on your points of view. Speak up young (man? woman? student? liberal? conservative? other?)...maturity comes from experience and common sense...me thinks thee may be short in the tooth...unlike the aforementioned.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 7:38 pm on Sat, Apr 23, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    K Lee posted at 8:49 am...
    (K LEE's question)...How many people, in our government and beyond, do you think are involved in a cover up regarding the birth of President Obama?
    “ANSWER”... None... there is no apparent cover up... regarding the birth of President Obama...
    ( K LEE question)... And how are all of these people being bribed to keep quiet?
    “ANSWER”... Since there is no apparent cover up … there is no one to keep quiet....
    I think my answers are repetitive and have been answered three times now … however, As Mr Kinderman indicated, the question of conspiracy is a non issue.... curious that you refuse to answer a very easy question... and just to be friendly, I apologize
    for addressing you as Ms Lee... it was a simple mistake as a past blogger who went by Ms Lee made comments and asked questions exactly as you did and I in error typed Ms Lee as I confused you with her. So now that your protocol has been followed, would you be so kind to answer my question.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 4:50 pm on Sat, Apr 23, 2011.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2367

    K Lee, if there is a cover-up (conspiracy, let's call it what it might be) it's obvious that no one here has an inkling as to how far or deep it might go. But here's the thing - no one's concerned (at this point) about any alleged conspiracy. There are just those who simply would like to see the actual birth certificate - not the "abstract of birth" or some other computer-generated form certificate that you or I could produce in less than a nanosecond on our computers will half-decent software and a mediocre printer.

    As I posted a little earlier here on this forum, "... let's start at the beginning, ok? Where and when was he born? Of the three requirements to qualify to be president, these two items are available on his birth certificate. Somewhere down the line (if not already done), this document needs to be safely ensconced in the National Archives. All some are asking for is a little peek. Where's the harm in that?"

    It could be that Obama's got it and having a great time using it as political fodder to keep attention away from his abysmal presidential record and quite possibly the "October Surprise" in 2012 will be the unveiling of his fully certified and verifiable Hawaii birth certificate. Of course his hope would be then that so much time had been wasted over this issue that the voters would be unable to figure it out by Election Day, thereby making it much easier to give him his next four years to continue to fundamentally transform the United States of America. And frankly, I really don't think we can afford too much more of that.

    I just believe we’re entitled to know the truth now; not a year and a half from now.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 4:42 pm on Sat, Apr 23, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Darrell wrote:

    I think the silence indicates that something is not right.... When Lee and others asks silly questions ... makes the issue appear goofy, and never respond to serious questions... it makes you wonder.

    -Indeed the silence is deafening.

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 4:13 pm on Sat, Apr 23, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Patrick W Maple: Here's a thought... Try addressing me by my posted name. No need for you to be flip and disrespectful. Can you not have a mature and respectful conversation without all the attitude?

     
  • Patrick W Maple posted at 3:45 pm on Sat, Apr 23, 2011.

    Pat Maple Posts: 1805

    Mrs, Ms, Mr, Sir, Ma'am, Madame or Sargeant Lee: I answered your question...as often others answer other questions. There is only one person hiding anything...BO... You have it all wrong in your line of questioning...it is his manipulators who do not want him to answer any questions, who expect him to read the lines and then hide from the conservative media and people...in fear he and they will be found out. People like George Soros, Warren Buffett and the hundreds of others who donate(d) billions of dollars to get him elected...hmmmm...they still haven't figured out all of those millions of dollars from internet donations yet have they.

    You know....it took years for Bernie Madoff to get caught...the people who lost all of their money (most of them) knew something was going on but they didn't want to stop the gravy train and get off. Obama and a lot of other politicians (local ones too) are on a similar gravy train and are aware of where the train is taking them. Woooo!Woooo! Are you on board?

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 3:09 pm on Sat, Apr 23, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Darrell Baumbach: I am not a "Ms" Lee.

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 3:08 pm on Sat, Apr 23, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Darrell Baumbach: You did not sincerely answer my questions. You just added flip remarks. Now you call my questions "silly" yet insist that I proceed and answer your questions. That's not a mature way to have a conversation. It makes me wonder since you do not want to answer my serious and sincere questions. Your lack of respect will get you nowhere. Well, I tried to engage in a respectful conversation about the topic, but I guess you are not interested. You just want to stoop to the name calling. Oh well. Perhaps I should have known better.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 9:07 am on Sat, Apr 23, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms Lee...please respond... I look forward to seeing well thought out answers that no one addresses...

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 9:04 am on Sat, Apr 23, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    It is interesting that I have not seen one person anywhere offer a discussion to answer the questions posted anywhere.... just oh those birthers are at it again... I think the silence indicates that something is not right.... When Lee and others asks silly questions ... makes the issue appear goofy, and never respond to serious questions... it makes you wonder.
    Jerome.... interesting thoughts you posted.... maybe some of the anti-birthers so to speak can shed light and solve this intentional mystery.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 5:07 pm on Fri, Apr 22, 2011.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2367

    One also has to wonder why virtually no classmates or neighbors of Barack Obama as he was growing up have come forth if for nothing else just to get their fifteen minutes of fame for being so close to the President of the United States, even if their time together may have been fleeting.

    For many there is just something a little "off" about this guy and how he reached the pinnacle of American life virtually unscathed politically. One day he's a State Senator; the next he's barely serving as a U.S. Senator and then voila! He's the "leader" of the free world. Even in America where everyone has a shot at the American dream, this is truly a miracle - whose story must be told. So, let's start at the beginning, ok? Where and when was he born? Of the three requirements to qualify to be president, these two items are available on his birth certificate. Somewhere down the line (if not already done), this document needs to be safely ensconced in the National Archives. All some are asking for is a little peek. Where's the harm in that?

     
  • Patrick W Maple posted at 4:12 pm on Fri, Apr 22, 2011.

    Pat Maple Posts: 1805

    Ms Lee: One...let him tell the American people who he is...I am an educated man...I would like to know what he REALLY believes...where are his writings? Why did he let/have someone else write his book(s) and then take credit for them? There are none is so blind as those who will not see. BO talked no one into hiding anything...it is exactly the opposite...they (his handlers and advisers) have talked him into saying nothing...like a lot of politicians, he says one thing while contemplating and planning on doing something else. Leave no footprints, no fingerprints, no breaths of sound and you will never be found.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 3:39 pm on Fri, Apr 22, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    K lee... my question was more simple...which you did not answer... . Ill ask again...Why would president Obama spend a fortune to prevent anyone from viewing his long form birth certificate?... makes no sense to me...

    In addition, I did not perceive you were trying to make me look looney... I said you were trying to make the issue itself look looney. There is no cover up... there is no bribery... May I ask... if I am wrong, and you are not simply trying to make this issue "look" looney, then what was your motivation for picking those two questions?... the questions themselve imply whackyness...
    Now I have answered your questions twice, where as you are still evading.

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 2:48 pm on Fri, Apr 22, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Patrick W Maple: How many people do you think are involved in this cover up? Are you thinking it's all government people or government and many others as well? How have all of these people been talked into such a cover up?

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 2:44 pm on Fri, Apr 22, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Patrick W Maple: So what is he covering up?

     
  • Patrick W Maple posted at 2:24 pm on Fri, Apr 22, 2011.

    Pat Maple Posts: 1805

    There is only one person covering up anything...and he is covering up more than just a birth certificate. It takes at least two people for a conspiracy...those who might help him are merely aiding and abetting (in the form of encouragement and money)...this can be accomplished by either omission or comission or both...oops I forgot or shhhhh.

    This reminds me of when we were just sending advisors into Viet Nam, weren't in Cambodia, didn't have the CIA in Cuba, weren't spying (Gary Powers) on the USSR and most recently didn't have boots on the ground in Libya.

    My dad use to say the Nixon was lying...because his lips were moving...ditto BO

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 11:56 am on Fri, Apr 22, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    Darrell Baumbach: I thought it was a pretty simple question. Can you try to answer it? It wasn't meant to be insulting or to make you look loony. Sorry you feel that way. Some think that there is a cover up. Why? And if you think there is a cover up, who is involved in said cover up? It seems to me that there would have to be a lot of people involved if you think the president is covering up some personal information.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:24 am on Fri, Apr 22, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    K Lee posted at 8:49 am...How many people, in our government and beyond, do you think are involved in a cover up regarding the birth of President Obama? And how are all of these people being bribed to keep quiet?

    K Lee... the premise of your questions is insulting and treating this issue as loony..
    .
    I have not heard one person anywhere, anytime, think of this as a cover up or that anyone would have been bribed... you are attempting to frame the issue and concerns to make people look “wacky”...

    Please answer my question meant for an adult who contemplates and thinks...
    Why would president Obama spend a fortune to prevent anyone from viewing his long form birth certificate? It is not reasonable. He is not that rich... I think a reasonable person would not spend one dollar to privatize a birth certificate....Please notice that I am not insulting you with a childish question or premise...

     
  • Kim Lee posted at 8:49 am on Fri, Apr 22, 2011.

    Kim Lee Posts: 1798

    I have a question for those that do not believe that President Obama is a US citizen, with a legitimate birth certificate....

    How many people, in our government and beyond, do you think are involved in a cover up regarding the birth of President Obama? And how are all of these people being bribed to keep quiet?

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:23 am on Thu, Apr 21, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Brian... I am beginning to enjoy the cartoon Ms Bobin produces... Im hoping she does not step out of character as she has relegated herself to a comical joke... thus.. a good cartoon. Its really not her fault as she has found herself taking positions that have no basis in reality, therefore she cannot offer constructive factual data to support her arguments... her only option is to produce a cartoon and hope people think it is real...

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:00 pm on Wed, Apr 20, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    There you have it folks. Joanne has not offered up one kernal of evidence to the contrary
    of the findings that Obama may not be a U.S citizen.

    And I quote Joanne:

    "Ah, the squish, squish, squash....splat! of The Boys Club tripping over themselves in the swamp of absurdity in a desperate effort to not take a stand on this topic."

    For her sake, she should step out of character and at least try to engage instead of making it seem like we are giving her no incentive to engage.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 3:39 pm on Wed, Apr 20, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    FYI, Mr. Nelson - Obama would not be the one to take a paternity test, unless you are suggesting that HE fathered Davis. Hmmmm....maybe THAT is the secret Obama wants no one to know!

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 3:38 pm on Wed, Apr 20, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Ah, the squish, squish, squash....splat! of The Boys Club tripping over themselves in the swamp of absurdity in a desperate effort to not take a stand on this topic. "Maybe he is. Maybe he's not. I don't know, but when the truth comes out I don't want to be remembered as being "wrong."

    If you all re-read your posts, you might see how ludicrous you all sound, but then you all would not admit that either.

    "Chucke!" (credit to Mr. Docktor)

     
  • Charles Nelson posted at 10:21 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Charles Nelson Posts: 259

    This whole debate is silly. If Obama simply had a paternity test, they'd find out his real father is Frank Marshall Davis. Davis is an American citizen, as is Obama's mother. That would qualify Obama as a natural born citizen, no matter what soil he was born on.

     
  • Patrick W Maple posted at 10:16 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Pat Maple Posts: 1805

    ms b: REALLY sloooooooooowwwwwwwwwwww: So you are saying the BO was an illegitimate child? My aunt and uncle were married when their baby was born...therefore he was a legitimate birth. He was able to obtain his COLB and a copy of his birth certificate some 56 years later from the German Government, a copy of his parents marriage license (married prior to his birth) and confirm his right to be a naturalized citizen...can not run for the pres though. You see bobby simple solutions and answers often come from simple minds with simple thoughts and perspectives. I just say put up or shut up BO...of course his bosses won't let him.

    I am not a birther...never have been...never will be...just a veteran US citizen who wonders how such an illegitimate entity can become president.

    Mr D: BO did not spend the money...his "directors and bosses" did.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 9:49 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mr Kinderman stated..."Birther?" These terms have had no impact on me. I have noticed that they usually emanate from those who have difficulty in expressing themselves in a more adult manner...

    Mr Kinderman... in my opinion... perfect observation!

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 9:47 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    posted at 7:09 pm ...So the last time Mr. Baumbach wrote on this topic, Obama had spent 2 million. He has now reduced that number to 1.5 million.
    Ms Bobin, I am not Obama's bookkeeper nor your nanny... It is public record that the political action committee 'Obama for America' paid $1,066,691.90 to the Perkins Coie law firm between Oct. 16, 2008 and March 30, 2009, to fight every request to release Obama's original birth records... since then, more money has been spent but not all totally declared... the exact number is not known or important as you are simply deflecting the real issue … which is that people like you do not care if he has a birth certificate or not... you simply want a nanny and Obama is happy to grant your request...
    Ms Bobin... maybe you could stop behaving like a little school girl and use your intellect... Can you articulate specifically what you mean by “birther”... since that is a term meant to denigrate rather that communicate. Do you have the ability to articulate what you mean or are you satisfied and pleased just to throw stones and behave a cave woman...

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 8:58 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2367

    "Birther?" These terms have had no impact on me. I have noticed that they usually emanate from those who have difficulty in expressing themselves in a more adult manner. Take this "birtherbaggerpalintitis" that comes from another contributor on this forum with the same type of intellectual deficiencies; I suspect he’s configured one of the function keys on his keyboard to keep from having to type it out each of the countless times he’s used it; or maybe a cut-and-paste works just as well. Until just this moment I've simply ignored them. Still, I rather like the term Patriot - an American who wants to know the truth insofar as our so-called leaders are concerned. Hillary Clinton screamed at the top of her lungs that it is our duty to question them; and that's all I'm seeking.

    Now as far as Obama's citizenship is concerned, I don't know if he's a legitimate president or not. But what I do know is that he has been performing presidential duties since January 20, 2009. If it were to be discovered that there is a serious problem in this regard, then the fallout would be monstrous. There would have to be a whole lot of backtracking to undo the damage that he has already done.

    But just imagine the kind of investigation that would need to occur owing to the conspiracy that had to have been ongoing since well before he was nominated in 2008. The Bush/Gore debacle of 2000 would look like a nice walk in the park compared to what we would be in for. But I don't think that the things Obama has done so far are so damaging that they can't be fixed by simply electing a new president in 2012. So, if it is proved that Mr. Obama should have never been handed the keys to the White House, all that would be necessary is a big fat asterisk next to his name and/or picture whenever he’s referred to by historians.

    So keep up with the silly names – I’ve never used them myself – but if it makes others feel better who really cares? I don’t.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:46 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Frankly,
    I'm not the least bit desperate to find out whether B.O. is a citizen or not. I'm just curious
    why he spent at least 1.5 million to cover up something. Now, I don't care how much money he has. But for anyone to not construe spending this kind of money to cover up something as an act of desperation needs to have their head examined.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:41 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Ms. Bobin wrote:

    And, Mr. Docktor, you are late to the "illegitimate" claim. That was made more recently by our esteemed local TEA Party leader on these blogs. Desperation leads to desperate (and ignorant) comments.

    -I don't think even the local Tea Party has any esteem. Look who's desperate to validate
    something when no one really knows the truth about Obama's Nation of birth. I doubt
    you have any facts that could prove he is a citizen nor do I have any facts to the contrary.
    and so we speculate. It seems to me you're angry we speculate. Why?
    You're attempts to cherry pick information just goes to show how DESPERATE you are.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 8:24 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    And, Mr. Docktor, you are late to the "illegitimate" claim. That was made more recently by our esteemed local TEA Party leader on these blogs. Desperation leads to desperate (and ignorant) comments.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 8:20 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Oh, Mr. Docktor...along with the fact that Obama's birth in Hawaii has already been legitimized, so has the claim that he spent X amount of dollars to suppress his records.

    I'm really beginning to wonder if Arizona is really a part of the US or some separate, alien nation that has no access to information that those of us in the US do.

    No fear, Mr. Docktor, I am not in any way affected, insulted or otherwise by your personal attacks that you feel the need to make on a regular basis...in fact I recognize that it is a requirement of your membership in "The Boys Club." I'm sure it bolsters your self-esteem and makes you feel super masculine and DEFINITELY adds to your intellectual profile.

    'Chuckle!" (credit to Mr. Docktor)

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:33 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Ms. Bobin:

    Has the thought ever entered your mind that Obama has spent 2 million but only 1.5 mil was his own?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:28 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Ms. Bobin wrote:

    The reason your cousin is not a citizen is that he was an illegitimate child of a US citizen and a German national. Doesn't take a genius to figure that one out.

    -Well, there you have it. I am willing to explore the notion of Obama being an illegitimate child to make this issue even more interesting.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:24 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Joe wrote:

    Whatever your political leanings are, there's enough to question about Obama and his birth certificate that the president should be eager to put all the doubters to rest. So far, that hasn't happened.

    -I doubt there is anything that would convince people like Joanne that Obama may be trying to hide something. Oh, how love is blind.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:17 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    http://patdollard.com/2011/01/hawaiis-governor-cant-find-obamas-birth-certificate-with-video/


    In Hawaii, at the time Obama was born, anyone could obtain a Certificate of Live Birth, which is not a birth certificate, for anyone else, based only on their word, and not requiring any official substantiation from any hospital. The fact that Obama has a certificate of live birth proves nothing, as the document means nothing. The only thing that would prove it is a birth certificate, which, according to the governor himself, does not exist.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:10 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Ms. Bobin wrote:

    Really, Mr. Baumbach, where do you stand on this topic? Mr. Kinderman and Mr. Maple are obviously birthers, but you have just danced around in the mud just for the fun of disagreeing with everyone on this blog that you do not like.

    -It's quite obvious Darrell goes out of his way to find common ground with just about everyone here whether he likes them or not. And, Ms. Bobin goes out of her way to disagree with people she doesn't like. In fact, I rarely see Miss Bobin searching for common ground with ANYONE. The dinner table must be very lonely at Ms. Bobin's house given her reluctance to break bread with just about ANYONE.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:00 am on Mon, Apr 18, 2011.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2857

    Ms. Bobin wrote:

    So the last time Mr. Baumbach wrote on this topic, Obama had spent 2 million. He has now reduced that number to 1.5 million.

    -Chuckle,
    Is there really a difference? The fact of the matter is, B.O. has spent a butload of
    money to cover up something. And that stuuuuupid little word "birther" is an attempt by those who wish to distract from the obvious that B.O. is NOT being very transparent about the whole issue.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 7:16 pm on Sun, Apr 17, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Mr. Maple: I have a friend who was born in Italy while his father was on a sabbatical from Stanford University doing research in art history. His parents registered his birth at the US Embassy in Rome. He is an undisputed citizen and qualified to run for president.

    The reason your cousin is not a citizen is that he was an illegitimate child of a US citizen and a German national. Doesn't take a genius to figure that one out.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 7:09 pm on Sun, Apr 17, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    So the last time Mr. Baumbach wrote on this topic, Obama had spent 2 million. He has now reduced that number to 1.5 million.

    Really, Mr. Baumbach, where do you stand on this topic? Mr. Kinderman and Mr. Maple are obviously birthers, but you have just danced around in the mud just for the fun of disagreeing with everyone on this blog that you do not like.

    Take a stand for a change and stop hitchhiking on the backs of your pals.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 10:31 am on Sun, Apr 17, 2011.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Leave it to Ms Bobin to jump on the"Obama conspiracy bandwagon". bobin wrote:
    "versus the long form birth certificate that many native Hawaiians have posted on the Internet but which Obama's camp and the Hawaiian government insists does not exist."
    This statement is blatently false. No one has ever stated that the "original" birth certificate "does not exist."
    Ms Bobin must have a lot of time on her hands to even speculate the "details" of the conspiracy that exists in her mind concerning people who question Obama's inexplicable actions to spend 1.5 million of his own money to prevent his records from being released.
    you are a sad, sad individual.

     
  • Patrick W Maple posted at 7:02 am on Sun, Apr 17, 2011.

    Pat Maple Posts: 1805

    ms b: I have a cousin who was born in Germany to GI and German citizen he was brought here in 1951 and never received his documentation until he was 56 years old...after his mother died in 2000...it happens all the time...just look south!

    People with small minds and thoughts live in tiny boxes. Asking questions is a good thing...in fact it is what this country was founded on...or is that a conspiracty theory too?

    By the way...my cousin could not run for the presidency either.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 6:58 pm on Sat, Apr 16, 2011.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2367

    As far as no one ever stating that Obama's birth certificate doesn't exist, there certainly is a sense of confusion over the matter. Rather than just publish the thing, here's some interesting reading from HonoluluStarAdvisor.com that includes an interview with Hawaii's Governor Neil Abercrombie: http://tinyurl.com/68fefoe. Since this is one guy who could easily put this issue to rest at the very least it makes the water a bit murkier.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 5:30 pm on Sat, Apr 16, 2011.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Leave it to Joe Guzzardi to jump on the birther bandwagon. Guzzardi wrote:

    "versus the longform birth certificate that many native Hawaiians have posted on the Internet but which Obama's camp and the Hawaiian government insists does not exist."

    This statement is blatently false. No one has ever stated that the "original" birth certificate "does not exist."

    Mr. Maple must have a lot of time on his hands to even speculate the "details" of the conspiracy that existed in 1961 to smuggle Obama into the country, falsify the circumstances of his birth, all with the certainty that he would run for president.

    You are a sad, sad individual.

     
  • Patrick W Maple posted at 1:44 pm on Sat, Apr 16, 2011.

    Pat Maple Posts: 1805

    Mr P: Thanks for the site. I must agree...the COLB are completely different...even though they are only one day apart. Where are the signatures on BO's document...and why is it in such pristine condition?? What were the travel restrictions from Kenya and other countries during that period. My understanding is that children under a certain age did not have to have travel documents...only their parents did. Couldn't they have taken him to Hawaii soon after he was born and claimed him to have been born there? Whether he was born here or not, he certainly does not live up to a citizenship level.

     

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