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Here is the stubborn truth about Cesar Chavez

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14 comments:

  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:32 am on Thu, Oct 18, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4485

    Yeah, I thought so.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:56 am on Wed, Oct 17, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4485


    Mr. Docktor wrote: "BECAUSE, heaven forbid people break up the harmony of a workplace, consisting of all hispanics who refuse to speak English, with people who know English and refuse to speak a language in the workplace other than English."

    This is just totally IGNORANT. I guess it is just irritating to you that there are people in the world who speak other languages, especially if they are on US soil. How dare they?!?!?!

    If you actually knew ANYTHING, you would realize that many, many Hispanics speak English - perhaps not well enough for them to be confident - I interact with many who say they do not speak English, but if I communicate with my limited ability in "Spanglish," we understand each other perfectly.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 9:49 am on Wed, Oct 17, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4485

    Mr. Docktor wrote: "So you are saying Joe should be opposed to immigrants willing to leave their country of origin and enter the U.S. workforce the legal way?"

    Mr. Docktor from a JG column dated February 11, 2012: "Thanks for the great article Joe. The vast majority of those who know you understand you are not opposed to immigration. Just illegal immigration."

    Sadly, "the vast majority of those who know you" DO NOT REALLY know that Joe Guzzardi is OPPOSED to immigration - PERIOD. Why do you think he works/worked for an organization called Californians for Population Stabilization?"

    HERE ARE A FEW SAMPLES OF JOE GUZZARDI columns YOU may has missed, Mr. Docktor. Only an inattentive person would NOT know this about Joe Guzzardi:

    From the LNS columns:

    "As long as we're promoting sensible population control measures, 2012 is an excellent time to stop issuing a million permanent residency visas each year. Many settle in California. Those visas include work permits, a foolish practice that's inconsistent with the reality of 20 million unemployed or under-employed Americans.

    http://www.lodinews.com/opinion/columnists/joe_guzzardi/article_676dfb64-e44a-5838-9ac1-62abba2e9b94.html

    AND

    "Legal immigrants — about 1 million a year — receive work permits. More legally "authorized people increases the work force and reduces job opportunities for native-born Americans."

    AND

    "As I have repeatedly pointed out, the relationship between more immigration and fewer jobs is undeniable."

    Joe Guzzardi's offerings from other publications:

    "A primary school student of average intelligence knows that when 20 million Americans are either unemployed or underemployed, the last thing they need is to compete with overseas workers. Nevertheless, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary, Washington, D.C.-based “think tanks” that depend almost exclusively on employers’ and globalists’ biased input publish endless reams of research calling for more non-immigrant worker visas, mostly the H-1B. Every analysis misleadingly insists that the United States has a shortage of science, technology, engineering and math graduates,"

    http://www.noozhawk.com/article/072312_joe_guzzardi_brookings_institution_worker_visas/

    AND

    "The Filipino teachers are legally in the U.S. on non-immigrant H-1B visas. And that fact begs a bigger question: did Clark County exhaust every opportunity to hire an American before traveling to the other side of the globe?"

    http://www.vdare.com/articles/view-from-lodi-ca-look-out-teachers-the-h-1b-visa-gang-wants-your-job

    AND

    "Seasoned immigration observers recall that originally H-1B visas were intended to "temporarily" satisfy a supposed "shortage" of qualified American software engineers.

    But, as always, temporary became permanent. Soon after the original H-1B legislation was enacted, fully qualified American workers found themselves on the outside looking in.

    So the stage is set for a tough fight: the money grubbers who must argue that they need more imported workers—even though Silicon Valley has laid off hundreds of thousands of workers—against disgusted Americans who want less immigration across the board."

    http://www.vdare.com/articles/cbs-60-minutes-fires-first-shot-in-new-h-1b-battle

    SO, MR. DOCKTOR - next time you want to claim that Joe Guzzardi is ONLY opposed to illegal immigration, THINK before you step on your tongue.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:50 am on Tue, Oct 16, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2813

    Ms. Bobin wrote:

    Once again, Joe Guzzardi fails to make his case with trumped up "facts" as he calls them.

    I'm sure HE will vote for Willard Mitt Romney who supports RAISING THE CEILING on the H-1B Visa in order to allow MORE FOREIGN WORKERS to enter the US and take American jobs. But he most likely missed THAT little tidbit in the news.

    -Ms. Bobin,

    So you are saying Joe should be opposed to immigrants willing to leave their country of origin and enter the U.S. workforce the legal way? I know it sticks in your craw anyone should be a proponent of allowing immigrants other than Mexicans to enter this country BECAUSE, heaven forbid people break up the harmony of a workplace, consisting of all hispanics who refuse to speak English, with people who know English and refuse to speak a language in the workplace other than English.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:51 am on Tue, Oct 16, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2813

    Ms. Bobin,

    Has the thought ever occurred to you you have double standards?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:48 am on Tue, Oct 16, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2813

    Back to fixing clocks. I grow tired of trying to commucate with someone who denies such imminent threats.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 6:42 am on Tue, Oct 16, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4485

    Also, securing the borders was not the focus here - the focus of my comments were the lies and misinformation written by Joe Guzzardi. Period.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:01 pm on Mon, Oct 15, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2813

    Ms. Bobin wrote:

    I never said the border should not be secured.

    -But you have said it is a fact every American wants the border secured. Shall I post some more articles contrary to this?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 6:54 pm on Mon, Oct 15, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2813

    Ms Bobin wrote:

    Fact - everyone American wants to secure the borders

    -Ok, anything you say Ms. Bobin.

    http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2010/0628/special-report-immigration-opening-borders-mexico-let-them-in.html#

    Special Report: Immigration

    Let Them In
    Philippe Legrain, 06.10.10, 09:40 AM EDT
    Forbes Magazine dated June 28, 2010
    Opening America's borders is morally right, economically beneficial--and would even make America safer.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 6:43 pm on Mon, Oct 15, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2813

    No I'm not advocating this. You do have a way of sidestepping questiions presented to you. However you did contradict yourself. You did say every American wants to secure the borders. You call this a fact. but you know it's not a fact because there are those advocating for cheep labor. So, in a sense you can't possibly believe it is a fact every American wants top secure the border when you believe I'm an advocate of cheep labor. Or, Do you actually believe, since I am the only one who advocates this, then the people who don't want to secure the border is essentially zero?

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 8:20 am on Mon, Oct 15, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4485

    Wow, that is a big change - Mr. Docktor advocating for cheap labor for "wealthy, greedy business people."

    OK - so he wasn't. I never said the border should not be secured. I HAVE written MANY times in this forum that EMPLOYER SANCTIONS need to be strengthened.

    Since YOU rarely read what I ACTUALLY write, you would have missed the fact that I have said the above over and over and over again.

    Without the demand, we would see less reason for illegals to come here. This year alone, farmers and ranchers have complained about the lack of labor, supposedly due to better economic conditions in Mexico. It is hard to believe that that labor is coming here legally, yet these people openly complain that many crops will go unharvested.

    Finally, I wanted to stress that I am not in favor of illegal immigration or not securing the borders.

    Each time I write comments about Joe Guzzardi's columns, people have the belief that I FAVOR illegals - no - I FAVOR Joe Guzzardi telling the ACTUAL TRUTH about the things he is reporting on - like the speech he refers to in this column - he intimates (that means he wants his readers to BELIEVE) that Obama likes illegals and Obama wants people to believe that Cesar Chavez liked illegals.

    THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN IN THIS SPEECH NO MATTER HOW MUCH JOE GUZZARDI WANTS PEOPLE TO BELIEVE IT.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 4:32 pm on Sat, Oct 13, 2012.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2813

    Ms. Bobin wrote:


    Fact - everyone American wants to secure the borders. Most Americans want immigration reform - the only difference is WHAT reform will take place.

    -Ms Bobin,

    So now you are saying there aren't any wealthy, greedy business people who are looking for cheap Illegals to work under the table for them? How is now you think these business people want the border secured? Or is it just a figment of (the many who read your posts) imaginations because you never really had those seniments/

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 11:30 am on Sat, Oct 13, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4485

    FACTS - continued:

    4. Guzzardi correctly states that Cesar Chavez was anti-illegal immigration. What he FAILS to tell you - as is his usual tactic in order to mislead, is the following:

    Chavez was anti-illegal immigration for the following reasons:

    - Illegal workers undermined his efforts to organize farm workers - workers on strike could easily be replaced by illegals.
    -Illegals COULD NOT protest their working conditions and the abuses farmers and ranchers heaped on them - for obvious reasons- they could easily be fired or replaced if they complained.
    -Chavez's focus was to form a union for agricultural workers - a goal that could not be accomplished if those efforts could easily be destroyed by farmers hiring "scabs" who had less rights than the striking workers.

    Joe Guzzardi states: "the high school kids knew little more than that Chavez was involved in some way with agriculture. Despite what could accurately be described as heavy-handed efforts by the Hispanic lobby to portray Chavez as a heroic figure who illegal immigrants admired, their efforts failed.

    Guzzardi needs to explain this - no proof to back up this claim.

    When you consider that polls show that a large percentage of Americans don't even know who the president and vice-president of the US are, nor can name the past six presidents, or even the LIVING presidents, or are unaware of who their representatives in Congress are, why should anyone be surprised that Hispanic kids, solely on the word of Joe Guzzardi, should be familiar with a man who died in 1993?

    Strange that a man who opposes the teaching of Hispanic studies in public schools would be surprised that Hispanic kids are unfamiliar with Chavez.

    Joe Guzzardi wrote: "I'm certain that Obama's empty dedication speech didn't sway them even if they bothered to read it or watch parts of it on the evening news."

    This statement disgraces the memory of Cesar Chavez himself. No dedication speech, no matter who delivers it, should be refered to as "empty." But read it for yourself and gauge the "emptiness."

    Once again, Joe Guzzardi fails to make his case with trumped up "facts" as he calls them.

    I'm sure HE will vote for Willard Mitt Romney who supports RAISING THE CEILING on the H-1B Visa in order to allow MORE FOREIGN WORKERS to enter the US and take American jobs. But he most likely missed THAT little tidbit in the news.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 10:56 am on Sat, Oct 13, 2012.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4485

    Joe Guzzardi wrote: "Facts, as the saying goes, are stubborn."

    Sadly, this is the only part of this column that Guzzardi got right. He has once again invented his own facts, written misleading statements and portrayals of events in order to serve his demagoguery on the subject of illegal immigration.

    Fact - everyone American wants to secure the borders. Most Americans want immigration reform - the only difference is WHAT reform will take place.

    What Joe Guzzardi got wrong:

    1. Minor, at best - Helen Chavez is Cesar Chavez's widow - not his "elderly grandmother."

    Couldn't get even the most simple "fact" correct.

    2. President Obama attended this dedication (make your own decision about his motives - I know many will, as has Joe Guzzardi) because it had been scheduled years in advance, it is a NATIONAL MONUMENT, and remotely perhaps because Cesar Chavez started his career as a "community organizer," much as Obama did, however with much less MOCKING than Obama has received. I am in no way ruling out the opportunity to court Latino voters in a state that already will OVERWHELMINGLY vote for Obama.

    3. Read a transcript of Obama's speech at the dedication. Oh, my gosh, it is SO full of references that support illegal immigration and Cesar Chavez's support for illegal immigration:

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/10/08/1141743/-President-Obama-s-remarks-at-dedication-of-Cesar-Chavez-National-Monument

    Judge for yourself, after reading this transcript, if the following Guzzardi statement is true:

    "Apparently, neither Obama nor his advisers have any concept of what Chavez's legacy is truly about. Chavez was not a champion for more immigration, or whatever other flowery language the president might use in an effort to establish a connection with Latinos."

    Maybe it's just me, but the only reference to "immigration" the president makes is one to the PAST immigration of the ancestors of those attending the ceremony.

    Other than that, I think President Obama succinctly captured the "legacy" of Cesar Chavez.

     

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