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Cynthia Neely I see a much different Lodi than Joe Guzzardi does

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37 comments:

  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:02 am on Wed, Oct 20, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    Joshua wrote:

    CAPS does support ammending the constitution to prohibit citizen status being given to children born in the united states of their parents have overstayed their visa, or entered the united states illegally.

    -And that's not such a bad idea Joshua. Perhaps those who enter here illegally or overstay their visa were to think twice about getting pregnant with the sole purpose
    of having a child with immediate U.S. citizenship then we wouldn't be having this conversation. Don't let the facts get in your way Josh.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 5:55 am on Wed, Oct 20, 2010.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Joshua,
    I got the information from an a bio of this organization .I do not know the ins and outs of this organization, but know its basis is not about anti immigration, which was the only point I was trying to make. I too would be concerned about any organization or government that would dictate family size as China does.

     
  • Joshua Hutchison posted at 11:54 am on Mon, Oct 18, 2010.

    Joshua Hutchison Posts: 57

    So you have not denied Joe Guzzardi is a paid advocate of CAPS. This title has in fact been added to the bottom of his column.

    CAPS does support ammending the constitution to prohibit citizen status being given to children born in the united states of their parents have overstayed their visa, or entered the united states illegally.

    I had no idea CAPS was advocating for legislation to compel people to have small families. I am physically ill to think about an American policy of limiting procreation against the will of citizens who wish to have more children the the majority would see fit. This sounds like the Eugenics policies of the early 1900's when the sterilization was forced upon poor and mentally impaired individuals.
    I hope Darrell is wrong about their position on family size, or it is not part of CAPS legal advocacy.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 7:03 pm on Fri, Oct 15, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839


    We at CAPS support limiting immigration and stabilizing population. We urge state and national legislators to:

    * Provide much-needed protection at our borders and ports.
    * Deploy ample interior enforcement so illegal aliens can be identified and returned to their home countries.
    * Toughen sanctions for employers who hire illegal aliens.
    * Support legislation that ensures active cooperation between federal and local law enforcement, facilitating the apprehension and deportation of illegal and criminal aliens.
    * Stop encouraging illegal entry by saying “NO” to amnesties, which only result in more illegal immigration.
    * Reduce legal immigration to traditional levels.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 8:02 pm on Thu, Oct 14, 2010.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    CAPS is unique among population and immigration reduction organizations in our advocacy of less immigration, small family size and the wide availability of family planning information and contraceptive use.

    Joshua....an anti-immigration group would not make the above statement I took from the CAPS website. CAPS is a group that splintered off from a global population control organization. This kind of organization would practice the above. I think your intensions and accusations are misleading..

     
  • Joshua Hutchison posted at 9:49 pm on Tue, Oct 12, 2010.

    Joshua Hutchison Posts: 57

    Joe Guzzardi is not a Journalist. He is a paid advocate of an anti-immigration group called CAPS. CAPS wants to amend the constitution so the 14th amendment excludes the children of immigrants. The other positions of CAPS only involve enforcing current laws and funding for more border patrol officers. And the effect of making the children of undocumented residents have the same status will actually increase the population of undocumented residents. People who have overstayed their Visa will still do what people do, and they will still have children.
    The policies CAPS has which conflict with the 14th amendment would have a stronger effect on females because they give birth to children. The repeal of the 14th amendments' birth right citizenship rights would most likely have unintended consequences like false statements of fatherhood on birth certificates to secure legal status. I can only imagine the strange augmentation of family law this sort of precarious legal status for pregnant undocumented women would have on our society. It is in the face of radical changes like this, that I am comforted by the slow pace of our Government dealing with just about anything.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 10:54 am on Tue, Oct 12, 2010.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2357

    Mr. Baumbach, since we don't actually know each other please be assured that any comments you make I analyze based on past performance. You're a man of integrity and what you offer are interesting and informative takes on issues that often become contentious. You hold your own well.

    As far as any defense-taking on your part on my behalf, those who offer such silly remarks are merely out of debate ammunition. They're put forth for no other reason than to take the focus off of the discussion of which they find themselves on the losing side. As a result, I've chosen to ignore those who habitually engage in such puerile behavior even when it might appear they're trying to discuss things in a more mature manner.

    Keep up the good fight!

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 9:05 am on Tue, Oct 12, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    Given how much Mrs. Neely took out of context in Joe's column, I wonder how many other things did she take out of context while she was a city attorney?

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 9:08 pm on Mon, Oct 11, 2010.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mr Kinderman,
    There have been rumors that I have somehow attempted to defend you. I hope you do not take that as reality as from my perspective, you have never needed defending or would think it needed. Sometimes I find your wit humorous and then attempt to participate in the frivolity to express my sense of humor

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 10:56 am on Mon, Oct 11, 2010.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2357

    Still, I hope Ms. Neely doesn't feel too cyber-bullied by my insensitive rebuke. If so, I'll apologize here in advance - I'm truly sorry.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 10:54 am on Mon, Oct 11, 2010.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2357

    While not necessarily important to the subject(s) at hand (my how things have morphed!), Ms. Neely should realize that the city in which Mr. Guzzardi currently resides is Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania - not Pittsburg. Obviously she's thinking of that other small, unique town to the west of Lodi. Still, accuracy is a fundamental in journalism, so I thought a correction to be the best course of action here.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 10:48 pm on Sun, Oct 10, 2010.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2357

    I believe you're correct, Mr. Baumbach. Their labeling me a cyber-bully might cause consternation among other contributors on this forum, but I simply take it in stride. If this were even remotely true, I would have heard from the editors at the News-Sentinel and quite possibly the local authorities as well. With all the press regarding this very phenomenon, any accusation of cyber-bullying should be taken seriously. The fact is I'm about as rational in my discourse as they come - and that's what bothers them so much.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 10:46 pm on Sun, Oct 10, 2010.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Mr. Baumbach: Haven't you checked your thesaurus yet?

    Your fawning defense of Mr. Kinderman is really getting embarassing. Mr. Kinderman is quite intelligent enough to defend himself if necessary.

     
  • John Lucas posted at 7:21 pm on Sun, Oct 10, 2010.

    John Lucas Posts: 2730

    Brian Dockter posted
    Do us all a favor and crawl back in your hole.

    all I can say is one two three CLASSY!!!!!

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 4:45 pm on Sun, Oct 10, 2010.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Jerome R Kinderman posted...But like “The Fonz” from Happy Days fame, that’s one word I doubt ever passes over their progressive lips.

    Well, I think just the opposite. I think Manuel, and other progressives consistently say it...
    Something like" Mr. Kinderman, you are wrooooonnnnnnnnnng(wrong)... I imagine those words cross their lips incessantly and relentlessly causing their lips to parch and seek water often.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 4:37 pm on Sun, Oct 10, 2010.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Mr Kinderman, I have noticed consistent traits among people who accuse you of being a cyber-bully…or some other name meant to influence you.
    01. Commonly do not offer ideas of any kind as to how your ideas are factually inaccurate, which would be interesting if attempted.
    02. When they disagree, they claim to laugh, cringe or become outraged.
    03. They respond by completely mischaracterizing the points you make.
    04. They say you write too much.

    I think an appropriate name should be assigned to people who fit this category… how about “ progressive”. Any thoughts?

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 1:33 pm on Sun, Oct 10, 2010.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2357

    What I've found interesting lately is since my detractors are unable to make labels such as hate-monger, homophobe, fear-monger, or racist stick, a new tack begins: the assignation of “cyber-bully.”

    If Ms. Marquez truly believes this to be true regarding what I "write and write and write" about on this forum, then I must wholeheartedly implore her to report any such post(s) to its moderators. Since I would expect such a claim to fail due to an overwhelming absence of proof, the logical conclusion would be that they've (to include Ms. Marquez, although it appears she’s relatively new to the comments system, but apparently familiar with my name) simply failed to beat me in the arena of ideas. I would then advise that she and others either work harder to prove their cases, or seriously and honestly begin to consider that they just might be wrong. But like “The Fonz” from Happy Days fame, that’s one word I doubt ever passes over their progressive lips.

     
  • Kristin Marquez posted at 11:35 am on Sun, Oct 10, 2010.

    Kristin Marquez Posts: 7

    When a respectable retired city attorney like Ms. Neely writes about her views of Lodi in response to the column Guzzardi wrote, I read.

    When a cyber-bully like J Kinderman writes and writes and writes as if he is Guzzardi's best friend, I laugh.

    I don't care to hear or read responses from J Kinderman.

    Let's hear from Guzzardi. Not his wanna be followers.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 11:14 am on Sun, Oct 10, 2010.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Kristin Marquez posted…I have read many comments and opinions defending Guzzardi's view/other obscure view

    I believe that Mr. Gizzard’s view in his article has little to do with the support he is getting. Had people been opposing his perspective with vigor and passion, I would not have said much. However, this is an issue of censorship and intolerance for others with a different world view. I think Kristin is incorrect in stating she has read many statements defending his view. What she read was the defending his right to express his views. I think that Ms Neely accurately expressed what see views as did Mr Guzzardi. Neither is right or wrong, it is just what they see.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 10:24 am on Sun, Oct 10, 2010.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2357

    Ms. Marquez asks, "I have read many comments and opinions defending Guzzardi's view/other obscure views, but I haven't seen his response, why not?"

    Why would you expect him to respond? After all, I think he articulated his positions quite well. Agree or disagree, Mr. Guzzardi is certainly under not obligation to offer a response. He's a columnist, not a reporter. What is truly amazing is how influential he actually is. Of all the offerings by local contributors to the News-Sentinel, I doubt any one (or combination of all for that matter) have garnered such responses from not only the community, but from the Editor-in-Chief of the paper and other columnists as well (as evidenced by Ms. Neely's comments here).

    While I don't know precisely what his goals were, but for any of us who enjoy writing what we desire most is to get people to think. In this regard he is 100% successful in what he set out to do. If I were the owner, publisher or editor of this or any other newspaper, I'd be a fool to follow the advice to fire this guy.

    If I were an advertiser, I'd insist that my ad appear on the Op/Ed page whenever a Joe Guzzardi column is scheduled for publication. If I were the editor of that particular section, I’d start to think about raising the rates that these advertisers pay on that day alone. And if I were Guzzardi, I’d ask for a hefty raise; although I have it on good authority that he writes for the love of it and nothing more.

     
  • Kristin Marquez posted at 9:15 am on Sun, Oct 10, 2010.

    Kristin Marquez Posts: 7

    Ms. Neely,
    Very well said. You are my hero!

    I have read many comments and opinions defending Guzzardi's view/other obscure views, but I haven't seen his response, why not?

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 8:21 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    Frankly,

    I think Lodi has gone a bit too far with all the wine tasting joints. Much like all the real estate speculation that caused the bottom to drop out of the market. The Lodi-Stockton area is still one of the foreclosure capitals. There is such a thing as being over-optimistic. Those who forget history are doomed to repeat.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 4:32 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    I wonder if Joanne has ever thought of how many Mexican-American CITIZENS have lost out to a job because Illegals will work it for less? Perhaps she isn't aware it ends up costing the employer much more because of the higher taxes the employer pays
    because the illegals go to town with our social services.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 4:26 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    So Joanne,
    Please give us your position on how Blacks are impacted because of illegal immigration.


    http://www.capsweb.org/content.php?id=668&menu_id=14

    Terry Anderson - If You Ain't Mad, You Ain't Payin' Attention
    Terry Anderson, known from Washington, D.C. to Los Angeles for articulating the popular rage, sat down with Californians for Population Stabilization (CAPS) to discuss the impact illegal immigration has had on black Americans. He is the host of The Terry Anderson Show airing Sundays, 9pm PST.
    http://www.theterryandersonshow.com/

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 4:12 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    Joanne,

    here's the link since you seem to be a bit confused or misinformed about CAPS.


    Californians for Population Stabilization

    http://www.capsweb.org/content.php?id=32&menu_id=7&menu_item_id=25

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 4:08 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    -Doesn't seem like such bad positions Joanne. So, are you pro open borders?


    We at CAPS support limiting immigration and stabilizing population. We urge state and national legislators to:

    * Provide much-needed protection at our borders and ports.
    * Deploy ample interior enforcement so illegal aliens can be identified and returned to their home countries.
    * Toughen sanctions for employers who hire illegal aliens.
    * Support legislation that ensures active cooperation between federal and local law enforcement, facilitating the apprehension and deportation of illegal and criminal aliens.
    * Stop encouraging illegal entry by saying “NO” to amnesties, which only result in more illegal immigration.
    * Reduce legal immigration to traditional levels.
    * Eliminate “chain” migration by limiting “family reunification” to spouses and minor children of legal immigrants.
    * Stop terrorists via new regulations for student and tourist visa holders that make their location and movements known.
    * Eliminate “birthright citizenship” for children of illegal aliens.
    * Reduce foreign pressure to immigrate to the United States by funding family planning assistance in other countries.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 4:02 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    I'm not entirely convinced that Joanne's last name isn't Bobit. Perhaps IT runs in the family. So I better be careful.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 3:55 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    Cynthia wrote:

    So Mr. Guzzardi, I am sorry you did not stay long enough to look around you and see why we call our town "Livable, Lovable Lodi." But unfortunately, I feel that if and when you do come back, you will still not see the Lodi that I see.

    -No Cynthia,

    I suspect Joe doesn't wear rose colored glasses. You are right in this instance.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 3:51 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    Darrell,

    Maybe we should get people up to speed like Joanne and Cynthia on Joe. Perhaps they aren't aware Joe probably still knows many of his students he tried his best to teach English at the Lodi Adult School who are still living off the dole (government subsidies). And coming from Cynthia, in so many words, it is almost impossible to go somewhere in Lodi and not see someone you know.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 3:44 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    Joanne wrote:

    You made the assumption that she is an Obama supporter when she did not state that in her editorial. How could you possibly know that?

    -Joanne,

    I believe Darrell made it quite clear how one could arrive at who Cynthia supports. In any event, am I to presume you don't agree with Cynthia about her assumption that Joe could not have known the women pushing the strollers? This would be consistent with your inability to ascertain things because of your lack of common sense.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 3:13 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Ms neely...Lodi has a small-town atmosphere, boasts friendly and courteous neighbors, and offers many small businesses where, for the most part, service, quality and products received are first-rate...

    I agree... I see this in lodi as well... good observation... however, some people in Lodi seem to be intollerant of people with different experience and thoughts different than their own. I am happy that Cynthia expressed her views as she sees Lodi just as I am happy Joe expressed his as well.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 3:00 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Brian, If I had to guess, who Ms Neely supported…. From her statements one might conclude that she supports Obama rather than McCain… just like I have no way of knowing for sure, but one might conclude Joanne Bapin supports the left rather that the right… I could be wrong, but if you use common sense… It’s a possibility that she supports Obama as well… Now I’ve done it… I hear the thought police knocking…. I’ve got to go…

    01. to your district congressman, Jerry McNerney, who will meet you "On the Corner" to address your concerns.
    02. I found some of Mr. Guzzardi's criticisms quite bizarre
    03. Mr. Guzzardi, there will always be welfare cheats, but in this economy there are many who are without jobs due to no fault of their own.
    04. They are working, paying taxes, learning English and adapting to a new culture. It should not be surprising that we hear foreign languages in our diverse society.
    05. If Mr. Guzzardi reads history, perhaps he will recall that Italians, the Irish, the Chinese and many other groups have been discriminated against when they first came to this country
    06. But like many others, apparently now that Mr. Guzzardi is safely here in this wonderful country, he would like to pull the ladder up to prevent anyone else from coming.
    07.

     
  • Jerome Kinderman posted at 2:38 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Jerome R Kinderman Posts: 2357

    I think there are many communities that would take issue with Ms. Neely’s notion that “[t]here are few places that I know of other than Lodi where you can be on a first-name basis with people all the way from the young man or woman who bags your groceries, to your district congressman…”

    Either Ms. Neely doesn’t pay close attention to other communities of the same size and scope as Lodi (why would she?), or she’s just a tad naïve. I recall during the debate over Wal-Mart’s expansion this same idea that having a big-box store would forever change the small-town atmosphere and would actually harm its uniqueness. Well, Lodi is hardly unique – virtually every other state in the Union has small cities (yes, Lodi is a city, not a town) that “boast friendly and courteous neighbors, and offer many small businesses where, for the most part, service, quality and products received are first-rate.”

    On the other hand, there are quite a few unfriendly neighbors and small (or larger) businesses that have dispensed with any semblance of service and quality even here in “Livable, Loveable Lodi” (is that really our motto?) – I know because I’ve experienced their idea of service first-hand. But for those of us who have resided here for any considerable period of time, we’ve forgotten that we’re wearing those rose-colored glasses that mask the unsavory elements in our little burg.

    Still, Ms. Neely is certainly entitled to her opinion of Lodi; just as is Mr. Guzzardi entitled to his. But during the past few weeks or so, it seems Guzzardi’s rights in this regard have been hindered just a little.

     
  • Darrell Baumbach posted at 2:33 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Darrell Baumbach Posts: 9405

    Brian... please consider your self reported.... I submitted your ridiculous statements to the thought police that a certain blogger referred me to… I’m certain that you will get your just punishment… say… 3 days in solitary confinement reading blogs from a particular blogger who enjoys reporting people with different thoughts than her own… I wish you well and hope you survive... but I doubt that is possible with the severity of the punishment.

     
  • Joanne Bobin posted at 1:41 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Joanne Bobin Posts: 4488

    Mr. Dockter: Mr. Guzzardi's association with the organization Californians for Population Stabilization substantiates Ms. Neeley's comment regarding "pulling the ladder up."

    I hope that someone reports your ridiculous commentary on Ms. Neeley - accusing her of wanting to slap Jan Brewer and telling her to crawl back into her hole. You made the assumption that she is an Obama supporter when she did not state that in her editorial. How could you possibly know that? Or do you just assume that anyone who disagrees with YOU is an Obama supporter.

    Actually, banning you from this site would be a better approach due to your constant incivility toward those who disagree with you.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 12:53 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    Cynthia wrote:

    I found some of Mr. Guzzardi's criticisms quite bizarre. For instance, he complained about pregnant women pushing strollers, suggesting that they were taking advantage of welfare programs. First, I do not know how he knew whether or not all these mothers are on welfare.

    -Cynthia,
    Please tell us what else you see in your crystal ball. For you to say that Joe could not have known these women pushing strollers AT ALL is quite a stretch. Perhaps he did recognize them and he opted not to mention this in his column. But you'll just keep on saying it was a kneejerk reaction for him just to advance your agenda.

     
  • Brian Dockter posted at 12:40 pm on Sat, Oct 9, 2010.

    Brian Dockter Posts: 2839

    Cynthia,

    I consider Joe's opining much more prevelant and not kneejerk than yours. And I doubt Joe was suggesting the foreclosure crisis is unique to Lodi, although it has one of the highest per capita foreclosures in the country. I could go on and on about your intellectual dishonesty about Joe. But for now, I'll end with your WAY out of line comment about Joe wanting to pull the ladder up on future immigrants who come here LEGALLY. And it is easy to conclude that you're problably
    not too happy about 1071 in my home of AZ. Since you are an Obama supporter it seems to me you would also like to slap Gov. Jan Brewer for daring to protect our border with Mexico. Do us all a favor and crawl back in your hole.

     

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