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Lodi City Council may delay collection of development fees

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Posted: Saturday, January 30, 2010 12:00 am

In an attempt to spur growth, the Lodi City Council is pondering whether to delay collecting developer fees, which pay for city infrastructure, until the construction projects are complete.

Currently, Lodi collects the fees around when the building permit is pulled to begin construction.

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Welcome to the discussion.

21 comments:

  • posted at 9:18 am on Tue, Feb 2, 2010.

    Posts:

    edumacation wrote: Is it legal for a developer, to also be a builder? to also finance loans? to also be a real estate sales agent? yes yes and yes...Sounds like GMAC in the car business. This is a very simple exercise. Can a homebuyer choose a different builder, real estate sales person, and a banker? Yes, Yes, and Yes.... Are we forced to use the agent? Are we forced to use the builder? Are we forced to use the lender? No, No, and No...

     
  • posted at 7:13 am on Tue, Feb 2, 2010.

    Posts:

    edumacation, It is sad that you have and harbor such deep hatred for developers. Your disdain for an individual that wants to sell something for as much as he can and buy something for as little as he can is pure hypocrisy. I am sure that you do not practice that in your own life. You live in a house and you might have to sell it some day. If it is worth $400,000 are you going to sell it to me for $300,000? Are you going to offer $400,000 to a guy that is asking $300,000 to buy your next house? I know that you wont. That is not how markets work! That is not how business works! edumacation, I am guessing, and I might be wrong, that you are involved in public education. If I am wrong, it really does not matter, but if I am correct, try this. Do teachers Unions try and get the most money and benefits from their districts for the teachers or do they offer less than what the district offers at contract time?

     
  • posted at 3:55 am on Tue, Feb 2, 2010.

    Posts:

    falcon- So you liken Lodi to "El Ranch Grande" in old Mejico, where the "Grand Jefe" is THE KING".., Let us not only praise el numero uno, for "giving" us jobs and LIFE itself. It sounds like fealty to the master, the king, the worshipful developer?Don't you think we need to start a religion to worship the developers?On Sundays, we can tithe to them any money we have left after giving them most everything we have.So you believe in the trickle down theory? Actually, its the trickle up theory! All money from all of us slowly trickles up to the grand developers who give us our lives.My occupation was not on your list, and you are lucky it is not! I would have been blowing the whistle on this "kingdom of Lodi" years ago. Who appointed these greedy people as Kings and Queens of the HIll?

     
  • posted at 3:42 am on Tue, Feb 2, 2010.

    Posts:

    falcon- ...and i forgot about the undocumented building trades workers. Some work for cash, others for rent discounts...but NO ONE knows, since it must be some "subcontractor", that you may have known for years! See know evil, speak no evil, hear no evil...I know nothing. ROFL!We need an immigration reform bill that places responsibility for hiring illegals at the TOP of the pyramid, not the bottom.But the structures that are built ALL have documents that union scale was paid for all work? Who gets to keep the difference btweeen what is REALLY paid and what is billed?

     
  • posted at 3:34 am on Tue, Feb 2, 2010.

    Posts:

    falcon: Is it legal for a developer, to also be a builder? to also finance loans? to also be a real estate sales agent? yes yes and yesInstead of having a trade where you trade your labor for money, you multiply the profit(s) geometrically via layers of businesses.Look at all the wonderful things that this person did for all of us. So civic minded!Why don't we just put a toll gate at each entrance to Lodi, and charge a fee everytime someone wants to drive in or out?Thats a good business model! And if the visitor spends any money at a retail store, part of the money goes to monthly LEASE payment paid to the developer! Not bad!So now, unemployment is up, payroll is down, commercial leases are down, and developers are whining that THEY need a bailout?? That THEY want government guarantees of MORE profit!Lets look at it from THIS realistic perspective? "..Everyone knows that this town would die if it weren't for a few developers..." Thats a sad song, but I am not singing it!

     
  • posted at 3:22 am on Tue, Feb 2, 2010.

    Posts:

    falcon-7:02 amI don't know pre$$ure$on, but I will speak for myself.I KNOW developers. They are "in the family". What do they say privately?"...Being a developer is better than robbing a bank...!""...You can make more money, and as long as you have layers of structure, you can always pretend that you don't really know whats going on!..."I have nothing against profit! But, I don't like cheating! Its the GREED I don't like!Explain this scenario.You have land that can not support agriculture, developer "A" buys it for a nickel, subdivides it "in the typical manner". This land has NO intrinsic value.A friend, developer B buys some homesites and lets them sit, adding NO VALUE. Later, developer "B" sells it at a "profit" back TO Developer "A". Is "A" stupid? Later, "A" sells it to another local developer and the game continues.Now, that this land has demonstrated INCREASING value, off to a local bank to get a construction loan. Does this sound familiar?Do you remember the whitewater fiasco of the 70's and 80's?

     
  • posted at 1:03 am on Tue, Feb 2, 2010.

    Posts:

    " Those people see doctors, drink coffee, buy wine, buy bicycles, go to church, and help contribute to the profit of other businesses. pre$$ure$on, these developers take risks and put their necks out. If you make it more difficult and costly for them to function and make profit, you punish all of the other businesses that benefit from this trade. That makes us all worse off. "

     
  • posted at 1:02 am on Tue, Feb 2, 2010.

    Posts:

    " pre$$ure$onLender Fees - BankPermit FeesDesign FeesPrinting CompanyConcrete ContractorConcrete CompanyPlumberPlumbing supply company-Sinks, pipe, faucetsLumber Company-studs, nails, hardware, plywoodTruss CompanyFraming contractorElectricianElectrical Supply Company - Wire PlugsHeating and Air Contractor and Supply CompanyRoofing ContractorInsulation ContractorInsulation manufacturerDrywall contractorDrywall supply companyDoor CompanyFinish ContractorPaint Supply CompanyPainterCabinet Maker and Supply companiesTile manufacture Tile contractorsGranite contractorsStucco contractorsLighting supply companiesmasonry contractorsmasonry supply companiesDoor hardware companiesCarpet manufacturing companiescarpet contractorslandscape nurseries landscape contractorshome cleaning peoplereal estate agentstitle companiesbanks againAll these companies above participate in the construction of one new home. They have offices, employees, and they eat food, buy trucks, and burn fuel. They buy insurance and shop at Target and Wal-Mart. They are not all "rich." But you would slap them down with your condemnation of developers. All of this noted, in commercial development you attract companies to our community that fill these structures. THEY EMPLOY PEOPLE WITH THEIR PROFIT. "

     
  • posted at 1:02 am on Tue, Feb 2, 2010.

    Posts:

    " pre$$ure$on, I am shaking my head in amazement at your resentment regarding development, construction, and processes concerning Lodi's economy. Your sad resentment of developers and worry that they are going to make a profit shows me that you do not understand basic economic principals. You do not comprehend the magnitude of the contribution of one single family home to our economy. Can you tell me what industry in Lodi has contributed more to Lodi's economy than construction and development? Can you tell me what kinds of transactions contribute to sales tax revenue? Can you tell me what kind of conversion of land adds value to it that increases property tax revenue? Each new home costs around $200,000 in building products and labor, not including real estate fees, bank fees, and title fees. How many people do you think that the construction of one new home or a major shopping center employes? I have a feeling that the numbers are above your capacity. It is sad that you would hinder economic growth in our community while falsely trying to act as if you are a friend to it. "

     
  • posted at 3:24 pm on Sun, Jan 31, 2010.

    Posts:

    In this depressed financial climate, cities shouldn't be deferring anything. Maybe an exception would let me defer my house payments. Why treat the public sector any different than the private sector. When I see Geweke getting a deferred deal it makes me laugh. Many strings must have been pulled to swing that sweet deal. And as far as John Beckman and the BIA, I would ask to see just who those 90 cities are and when they adopted those deferments? I see water bureaus and counties, etc. and coming from the BIA of the Delta and Mr. Beckman, I challenge him to prove his statement is nothing but hogwash.

     
  • posted at 3:14 pm on Sun, Jan 31, 2010.

    Posts:

    Observer, Help me out.It is my understanding that the developer pays the fee then adds this fee (plus interest I'm sure) to the cost of the project and passes it on to the new property owner. I don't know about you, but I paid development fees in the cost of my house. I don't want to pay for others too. That is what would happen if we eliminate these fees now.I believe these fees are actual costs incurred by the city and they should be recovered by charging the developer, who then passes the fees on to the ultimate owner.No?As for new development,there is plenty of vacant retail space in Lodi now, and there will be more when Costco opens and the super center finally goes in.New development is necessary and it will come again one day. When it does, new development needs to pay it's way. In my view, bribing developers with tax payer money is a bad idea--unless you happen to be a developer.

     
  • posted at 12:30 pm on Sun, Jan 31, 2010.

    Posts:

    The City should be doing everything possible to encourage economic growth. As far as I'm concerned they should not only defer the fees they should abolish them. Progressive cities actually help contribute to improvements to attract businesses.

     
  • posted at 9:47 am on Sun, Jan 31, 2010.

    Posts:

    What will the city council and city of Lodi tell the next batch of city employees that will either get fired, laid off, hours cut and take pay cuts that are coming in June-July? Will they be rehired or taken care of next year or five years from now when those development fees are paid? Those developer fees need to be paid now. You neglected to cut the first half of this fiscal year hoping the money fairy comes before June. Manager King, you get your information from the same sources that I do and you know that is not going to happen and that Lodi needs those fees and charges immediately. Looking at the faces that will be involved in this decision, I see personal friendship and business ties involved and the decision will be based on the old scratch my back and I'll scratch yours or future favors basis.

     
  • posted at 7:44 am on Sun, Jan 31, 2010.

    Posts:

    I'm not sure, but I believe the council voted 4-1 in favor at the last cc meeting. Right?

     
  • posted at 10:31 am on Sat, Jan 30, 2010.

    Posts:

    Pre$$ure.....good to have you back. Are you on probation or fully tenured? Anyway, I look forward to your conspiracy theories again. Welcome home!

     
  • posted at 7:29 am on Sat, Jan 30, 2010.

    Posts:

    pre$$ure$on- Excellent comments! Why should developers have a one way street. They want all benefits and All money to flow from local government, taxpayers and tenants to developers.With the millions they have been extracting from us, why do they need more free benefits.The question is simple--it results in this:Are the developers here for us? Or are they here for themselves? To even suggest another freebie--is to answer the question.This is exactly what slumlords do. They want ZERO risk and ALL guaranteed profit.There may be another approach. Its called a restricted time period. How lomg does it take? We see promises layered on promises about the new housing developments they lobbied for, now they are whining that they want higher profits by refusing to build until house prices go higher. Why is that our responsibility?You promise it, you deliver! This is what the Wall street banksters did. They profit they win, they lose, we bail them out, and they win again. It's all me me me with these people.

     
  • posted at 4:43 am on Sat, Jan 30, 2010.

    Posts:

    lodidian, most Lodians are not aware of those projects even being funded, more or less being completed. That's how sneaky the council and management are. I would think these are pre-arranged outside contracts as either I just missed reading them in the public notice section of the newspapers or they were merely approved as some other public works project. All other cities display their projects and the public and final bid results on any public works projects, but Lodi's public works department either does not, apparently, feel the need to do so. My suspicions are that there are situations where some projects aren't what they seem to be and that certain local companies seem to garner all the bids. Why else wouldn't public works show those public bid results on each and every project like nearly all other cities do? To get those bid results you have to go to city hall to request them. I assume they want to know who's being nosy and make sure you're not some union rep or troublemaker. The city has a great website but certain public information is only available at city hall. You pay to have the documents printed. LOL

     
  • posted at 4:30 am on Sat, Jan 30, 2010.

    Posts:

    We'll see just where this city council and management team align themselves with these local developers. Cutting back here and laying off and firing there, scraping to make ends meet with the budget, no developer or builder should be given a free pass by the same three votes that always stand up for the wealthy and well connected, especially the locals. Did you have that same compassion for those homebuyers that asked for an extension on their mortgage payments and were foreclosed on instead? Some of you council and management went out and bought those homes for investment at dirt cheap prices, didn't you? Why let these developers slide? Or maybe you're silent partners somewhere along the line? Lodi needs the finances with another budget coming in June-July and those monies those developers legally owe need to be paid to keep our services where they are at now, especially police and fire. Bring us a public hearing on this issue if you want to hear your ears burn. And not one of those 7AM specials like your council meeting but at 7PM at Hutchins Square in the auditorium.

     
  • posted at 4:20 am on Sat, Jan 30, 2010.

    Posts:

    With the state of the economy worse in California right now, why would the city of Lodi let a large local developer, like Mr. Gillespie get away with not paying his fees like all others have to? Has DGP even purchased the replacement acreage for the agricultural land he raped? This Reynolds Ranch has been a lemon from day one. I am happy to see that BC/BS was able to stay and keep their employment base in Lodi, but very unhappy with the way it was done. Why did Hansen, Johnson and Katzakian vote to approve this project and then just weeks later let RR do away with the school and park and increase the commercial square footage? They approved the project that was completely different from the original and then allowed DGP to drastically change the number and densities of the residential areas. After all these breaks to get RR approved, why should Mr. Gillespie get more preferential treatment from Hansen, Johnson and Katzakian when they once again vote together to curry to DGP. DGP will get another favor and the citizens of Lodi will pay again. Lodi needs the funds and DGP needs to pay up. "

     
  • posted at 1:12 am on Sat, Jan 30, 2010.

    Posts:

    What if a developer goes bankrupt before the fees are paid? Does the developer pay interest on the deferred fees?

     
  • posted at 12:39 am on Sat, Jan 30, 2010.

    Posts:

    I think it would be a good idea to delay collection of administrative fees but I do not believe tax payers should have to "front" the cost of work and materials for infrastructure for new development projects. For example, I don't think the we should have paid for the Wal*Mart hook up at the South East corner of Kettleman and Lower Sacramento road or the half million dollars already spent on the "raw hookup" for the surface water treatment plant. I don't think tax payers should provide interest free loans. Do you?

     
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