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Mohammed Shoaib, president of the Lodi Muslim Mosque, reflects on the comments made by Councilman Bob Johnson during the Lodi City Council meeting Wednesday evening. (Brian Feulner/News-Sentinel)

Is Lodi a 'Christian community?'

Councilman Johnson's remark during council meeting draws criticism, spurs discussion

By Maggie Creamer
News-Sentinel Staff Writer
Friday, June 5, 2009 6:45 AM PDT

Comments (45 comment(s))

As the debate continues about prayers before the Lodi City Council meeting, Councilman Bob Johnson caused a stir by calling Lodi a "Christian community, regardless of whether people like it or not."

The remark prompted criticism from local residents, and the leaders of Lodi's other religious communities say it's important to remember Lodi is a community of many faiths.

After Wednesday's meeting, Johnson said he probably should have instead said that Lodi has historically been a predominately Christian community.

"A lot of people will amplify further on that," he said. "Many people believe the country is predominantly Christian."

Johnson's comments are in response to the Lodi City Council deciding to hold a public hearing on whether to continue prayers before meetings.

Religious leaders have typically given the prayers, but the practice has come under scrutiny from a national organization because a majority of the religious leaders mentioned Jesus Christ. The nonprofit, Madison, Wis.-based Freedom from Religion Foundation sent a letter to the city of Lodi in May threatening to take legal action if the council won't enforce its own policy that all prayers must be "non-sectarian and non-denominational."

Ralph Matthews, an atheist Galt resident who is a member of the Freedom from Religion Foundation, said Lodi is not a Christian community. He said he wants people to know that just because Lodi has several churches it does not mean Lodi is a Christian city.


Kulwant Singh Tara, left, and Baldev Singh Sangha of the Lodi Sikh Temple respond to Bob Johnson's remarks regarding prayer during Wednesday's council meeting. (Brian Feulner/News-Sentinel)

"I think this issue of prayer in public meetings is ridiculous and divisive," he said. "If they want to pray, they can pray at home, at church or while walking down the street ,but not at public meetings."

When Baldev Singh Sangha heard about Johnson's comment, he dismissed it as the councilman trying to say he simply sees more Christians in the community.

While standing outside Darmesh Darbar Sikh Temple in Lodi, Sangha said it is important to remember there are Muslims, Sikhs and people of other faiths who live in the community, too.

"He shouldn't single (Christians) out," Sangha said. "He should have said there are many religions. He still should consider a combination, a common community."

Johnson said he has always been supportive of all religions and cited his support of the Muslim community when the FBI arrested two Lodi citizens on terror charges in 2005.

Lodi City Council prayers at a glance

The issue: A national organization is upset that a majority of religious leaders that say the prayer before City Council meetings mention Jesus Christ because it is specifically referencing Christianity. Lodi's policy calls for all invocations to be "non-sectarian and non-denominational."

How did the group find Lodi? A member of the nonprofit, Madison, Wis.-based Freedom from Religion Foundation complained the city had Christian-based prayers before meetings.

What did the group do? Using the video of meetings posted online, the group watched 55 prayers from 2007 to the May 6 council meeting and found that 39 included a reference to Jesus Christ. The group then submitted a letter to the city saying it will take legal action if the council does not at a minimum enforce its own policy.

What's next? The council will hold an open forum to hear feedback from citizens and then decide how to respond to the threat of a lawsuit.

"I can remember saying publicly I had a great deal of respect for the Muslims and think they are forthright and upstanding citizens. I don't think I've ever been accused of being a religious bigot. And if people take (my comment) that way, I don't think that is how it is intended," he said.

The vast majority of people in Lodi who belong to a religion are Christian, Century Assembly Church Pastor Dale Edwards said.

"I think that it's like so many things; we tend to patronize the minority that makes the biggest noise. The history of the nation includes prayers in public," Edwards said. "Christian prayers have always been there. To ignore history is a bit naive."

Lodi Muslim Mosque President Mohammed Shoaib said it is hard to respond to the issue.

"What the councilman said is a personal opinion, but all the religions live free. ... We all live together, especially in this country. We all are one," Shoaib said.

Contact reporter Maggie Creamer at maggiec@lodinews.com or read her blog at www.lodinews.com/blog/citybuzz.

What do you think of Councilman Bob Johnson referring to Lodi as being a 'Christian community, regardless of whether people like it or not'?



Janet Norris
"I think it is because there are lots of churches."
Robert Bargus
"Everyone has their own opinions and beliefs, but to say the community is Christian is kind of rude to atheists."
Linda Hansen
"I think Bob was accurate, but it may have been more accurate to say we are a 'faith community.'"
Zack Bullock
"I don't think it's a Christian community. I know a lot of people in Lodi and they don't seem too Christian."

Reader Feedback

sam wrote on Jun 9, 2009 8:59 PM:

" Stan.... have a great day too and peace out. "

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stantaves wrote on Jun 9, 2009 8:50 AM:

" Sam, you can trust that my use of sarcasm was never intended to offend your tender sensibilities. Jesus Christ was a "man" that -- it is said -- lived without sin; If that is true then Jesus is GOD. I have no reason to doubt the Godliness of Christ; nor does anyone else for that matter. Certainly, it isn't easy to accept that a man walked among us as God -- that's why they call it faith, don't they? That said, it has always been my observation that those who try to emulate the life of Christ tend to live happy and prosperous lives -- an that's a good thing. God bless and good day. "

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sam wrote on Jun 8, 2009 7:17 PM:

" too many spelling errors... sorry.

My point?? Stan, please do not make fun of my Christian beliefs. Jesus is my Savior and President Obama is a man who is my president. "

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sam wrote on Jun 8, 2009 7:12 PM:

" Stan, why would you say President Obama should replace Jesus? That is so sick.

Oresident Obama is our president and is just a man.

Jesus Christ, to many of us, is the Son the God.

I understand your confusion with you being a non-christian. But to us Christians you implication is an insult to our Lord. "

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Lodian wrote on Jun 8, 2009 6:17 PM:

" stantaves wrote "In fact they could just replace Jesus Christ with Barak Obama and make everyone happy, right?"

stantaves: Why would we want to do that? "

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Lodian wrote on Jun 8, 2009 6:15 PM:

" Cogito wrote "I never thought we belonged in Iraq, but we do in Afghanistan. If we put a big enough price on Bin Ladens head, someone will bring it to us."

Looks like you agree with President Obama. "

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Cogito wrote on Jun 8, 2009 2:30 PM:

" Stomp, don't be afraid. I'm just being pragmatic about the fact that you can't take a terrorist splinter group, that's not part of any government or standing army, to the negotiation table. That being said, I never thought we belonged in Iraq, but we do in Afghanistan. If we put a big enough price on Bin Ladens head, someone will bring it to us. "

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stantaves wrote on Jun 8, 2009 8:25 AM:

" The prayer is just fine as long as the city council keeps Jesus Christ out of it; I think the local pastors can handle that. In fact they could just replace Jesus Christ with Barak Obama and make everyone happy, right? "We come together on this day to bow our heads to Barak our heavenly Obama, so that he may look upon us with his devine grace..." -- maybe then he'll no longer feel the need to bow before foreign Kings. "

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iambic grape stomp wrote on Jun 7, 2009 10:05 AM:

" Cogito, I never claimed to be a pacifist--I am not one. My point has always been to not rush into military conflict. "First" necessitates a "second." Your ability to make ill-informed presumptions-as in the case of my views on violence-is frightening. "

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Cogito wrote on Jun 6, 2009 2:54 PM:

" Stomp, how would one go about setting up a "diplomacy first" meeting with the likes of al-Quida, Hamas, Hezbollah, or the Taliban? Would you trust them to follow any kind of treaty? By your "type", I mean pacifists. "

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iambic grape stomp wrote on Jun 6, 2009 8:33 AM:

" AT Japan is quite different than OVER Japan, Dogs. Besides, my point was that no shots were fired in the Cold War. Thank you for making my point for me. Now go type another seriously flawed analogy that does nothing to forward this conversation.

Cogito, "diplomacy first" is a pseudo-intellectual approach to international politics? Do you think we're living the film 300? And please, for the sake of curiosity, what do you mean by my "type?" If you mean those who treat war as a last resort, I would say my "type" has accomplished quite a bit in the history of mankind. C'mon, you gotta do better than that. "

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RaiderHater wrote on Jun 6, 2009 7:05 AM:

" When it all comes down to it, this is very irrelevant.

Live your life... live your thoughts... but don't waste your time with what the ignorant speak. "

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citizen wrote on Jun 6, 2009 12:21 AM:

" God I am so sick of muslim this and islam that, why must everyone kiss these peoples butts to keep them from being "offended". These people are a bunch of whiners they need to toughen up and just deal with the fact that a big majority of people that are muslims are complete nut jobs that need to be eliminated. Anyway I guess that is off subject, seems every day they are complaining about something and the picture on the front page of paper just drives home that point. "

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Cogito wrote on Jun 5, 2009 11:31 PM:

" Stomp, your type never accomplished anything meaningful in the history of mankind. Those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't. You attempt to sound superior with your pseudo intellect, but in reality, you're just a bunch of cowards. "

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warrenb1973 wrote on Jun 5, 2009 4:11 PM:

" What about these Mormons that knock on our doors and try to sell there religion to me and my family!! Nobody tells them they cant do that.. "

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dogs4you wrote on Jun 5, 2009 4:03 PM:

" Those two clowns in N. Korea and Iran are similar to the Wright Bros., since it took them some time, but they finally got the plane off the ground. If they continue to work at it, well we shall see. "

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dogs4you wrote on Jun 5, 2009 3:59 PM:

" stomp you don`t get out much do you, N. Korea fired a rocket that passed over Japan. And yes they have been aimed in that direction. Looks like I`ll have a dove for dinner tonight, while you might try some crow. "

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iambic grape stomp wrote on Jun 5, 2009 3:53 PM:

" But have any rockets hit Japan or Alaska, or even been aimed at them? Your hawk needs bifocals. "

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dogs4you wrote on Jun 5, 2009 3:51 PM:

" Stomp I remember Cuba and the Bay of Pig and Russia sending missles to Cuba. This was an anybody can win situation, JFK got lucky and made Russia blink first and the Russian Chairman had his ships turn around and head back to Mother Russia. We were ready for WW 111, no need to talk. Russia just backed off. At the UN the Russian Chairman took off his shoe, pounded it on the table and stated, We will bury you. That didn`t happen, as you well know thanks to Ronald Reagan who ended the cold war without firing a shot, he just outspent them and sent Russia war machine into the rust bucket. "

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dogs4you wrote on Jun 5, 2009 3:37 PM:

" grape stomp, according to you, there are plenty of threats out there. I can name two, N. Korea that continues to develope rockets that are capable of hitting Japan, and even Alaska. And for what pourpose I have no idea. You sound like a dove, and you know what happens when a hawk sees a dove.

Then there`s nut job that doesn`t believe the Holocaust happened and continues to work on his idea of atomic weapons, he`s not afraid of this country since he know`s Obama won`t do anything, all talk and a smile. If NUT JOB were to send anything atomic towards Isreal, that would be the end of Iran. The Isrealies are smart and have plans ready to turn Iran into the largest piece of glass on the planet.

He was afraid of George Bush since Mr. Bush would have retaliated, no more 911`s. "

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iambic grape stomp wrote on Jun 5, 2009 3:02 PM:

" Because, Dogs, capability is not the same as an attack. In regards to flexing vs. lifting: remember the Cold War? If we apply your logic--well, you know what would have happened.

There are plenty of threats out there. It would be a shame for us to be one of them because of hot-headed reactionism like we saw under Bush. Are you really against diplomacy first? "

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mp wrote on Jun 5, 2009 2:32 PM:

" Has Bob Johnson ever been in a church?

His daily ritual consists of sitting at the bar downtown and slinging back Gin.

How is that guy still alive: 8 gins a day, eats out every meal, and doesn't exercise?

He must have someone on his side! "

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dogs4you wrote on Jun 5, 2009 2:25 PM:

" Rather than mixing religion and politics at the CC meetings, I would suggest everyone stand, put their hand over their heart, and pledge allegiance to the United States of America, then everyone can just get along. And Bob Johnson can get his foot out of his mouth.

Grape Stomp, nice try buy you haven`t answered my question, why flex your muscles unless you intend to do some heavy lifting. The US might lead the world, but with China`s permission. "

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voter wrote on Jun 5, 2009 2:18 PM:

" I am certain it was Zeus casting his mighty thunderbolt the other night. He has been angered by the CC and their blatant snub. "

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wtf wrote on Jun 5, 2009 1:58 PM:

" Maybe we should take a cue from the animals....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0TjfOKnF-c "

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iambic grape stomp wrote on Jun 5, 2009 1:19 PM:

" We could also be a Dionysian community.

I'd love to see Bacchus as a guest on The 700 Club! Go Bacchus! "

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lodi boy wrote on Jun 5, 2009 12:48 PM:

" Pat Robertson states clearly on the 700 CLUB this is a Christian nation, and that we should all believe in Opposite Marriage.

I'm pretty sure it's a Christian community. Jesus turned water into wine, and that's why God gave us so many wineries. "

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iambic grape stomp wrote on Jun 5, 2009 12:00 PM:

" 1143: Your ideology, which sounds like preemptive strikes, reflects the same frame at work as Ahkmenijad's; only the roles are changed. Your fears will likely be realized much faster if we continue along your rough-and-gruff path. "

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iambic grape stomp wrote on Jun 5, 2009 11:51 AM:

" Dogs: So far, no one in your catalog of nations has been nuked. I'd rather see the situation diffused with diplomacy than rush into a nuclear war. Had military action already been taken against Iran, there would probably be a lot of ash to answer for. So my answer to you is this: yes, Iran is flexing muscles. But easy on the trigger-finger, Dogs. The whole "shoot first, ask questions later" isn't going to be a good policy if, as your tone suggests, the US is going to serve as a world leader. "

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1143 wrote on Jun 5, 2009 11:42 AM:

" dogs4you..............Good & appropriate comment. If O'Bama would learn to govern rather than trying to be the Messiah he would be much better off. Unfortunately he does not have the backbone.
Hopefully Israel will show strenth in handling the Iran issue.........O'Bama NEVER will. He will continue to tour the world with his telepromters & SMILE. "

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dogs4you wrote on Jun 5, 2009 11:33 AM:

" Grape Stomp: While the Big "O" isn`t singing "Bomb Iran" perhaps you can answer a question, why is that little nut job that runs Iran continue to work on building an atomic device and a rocket to deliver it? He claims it`s for electric generation, bull, Iran sits on one of the worlds largest oil reserves. For someone who calls for the destruction of Israel, and to be wiped of the face of the earth, it would seem to me that Obama is getting the wrong message. Perhaps Isreal will do what this country won`t. Then again there is always N. Korea and their little nut job to contend with. Hopefully this country won`t turn into the mouse that roared. "

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jramagic wrote on Jun 5, 2009 11:18 AM:

" Johnson's dumb remark sounds Limbaugh-like. Very provincial and narrow minded, to say the least. I hope it was a mis-speak on his part and perhaps taken out of context.
If it is not, he should not be serving in a public post. Look to Obama's great speech in Cairo. Words like that elevate mankind. What a difference from the past where nothing but further antagonization was spat out by our poisonous "leaders", fanning the fires of hatred- ON PURPOSE! "

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sam wrote on Jun 5, 2009 10:29 AM:

" iambic grape stomp, excellent post. "

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iambic grape stomp wrote on Jun 5, 2009 10:26 AM:

" 1143: Obama said he has had quite a bit of exposure to Islam and Muslims during his life--to the point that he has an understanding of Islam, something one needs to acheive mutual tolerance.

Your post reminds me of Beauty and the Beast; "We don't like what we don't understand, in fact it scares us!" That aside, America was also founded, in part, on genocide, slavery, and other atrocities that as a nation, we finally decided were wrong. He's celebrated because he's not singing "Bomb Iran," and in doing so, trying to build a bridge rather than dismissing one of the world's major religions. "

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illegalinLodi wrote on Jun 5, 2009 9:54 AM:

" Being a Christian, I just consider the source, councilman Johnson, and his bullyish and flying off the handle ways just to try to make a fool out of what someone else has to say. Poor old man just can't accept thee fact that he could possibly be wrong. Couldn't this invocation be scheduled for those who would want to pray or worship (non-denominational) be scheduled outside the Carnegie Forum for all those who'd like to participate? Then the meeting could continue inside, with all members present from the city administered a drug and alcohol test and swearing on the bible to tell the truth and not just listening to your city manager with his weekly spin. "

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1143 wrote on Jun 5, 2009 9:24 AM:

" Comrade O'Bama again asserts himself to be a Muslim after preaching Chrisianity prior to his election. He as shown himself to be a liar and an unethical Chicagoian politician. Too bad we can not have a citizen re-call of this slimmy guy.
America was founded on Christian believes..........How does the Media allow this character to get away with is comments.
The N.Y. Times, Washington Post, etc. just swoon over this socialist/nationalist...........Why? "

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mjp wrote on Jun 5, 2009 9:22 AM:

" There is absolutely nothing disrespectful about a prayer for any religion and anyone that thinks that way has a issue that they personally need to deal with. Two days after 911 I attended a community prayer service in which all faiths were represented and I listened to christian prayers, Jewish prayers, Moslem prayers. Everyone was respectful of everyone else. If you are unable to do that, then you have a problem, not the rest of us. "

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LodiEye wrote on Jun 5, 2009 9:03 AM:

" Lodi is a religious community, not just a Christian community. When you look at the budgets, at all levels, the pending layoffs (4-5 firemen), the rising electric and sewer rates, and the fact that an old man can't even adopt a dog (see other article), then maybe prayer at a City of Lodi meeting is a good thing: "God help us." "

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lodisafeway wrote on Jun 5, 2009 8:34 AM:

" "Mr. Obama noted that the United States also could be considered as 'one of the largest Muslim countries in the world.'" (http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/06/02/obama-signals-themes-of-mideast-speech) My error was that he made this statement prior to departing on his latest overseas trip; for that only I apologize for the error. But he did state not too long ago that, "we do not consider ourselves a Christian nation."

Now, words mean things; the President of the United States doesn't just blather without having put tremendous thought behind the ramifications of his comments, or at least he should. However, he could be taking his cues from the Joe Biden playbook, although that's doubtful.

His statement regarding the United States and Islam needs to be considered carefully. Certainly at first blush it might appear that he wasn't stating that we are a "Muslim" nation, but as he compares the number of Muslims with other peoples of faith here, his attention to the volume of those who follow Islam is telling.

But as I stated previously, regardless of whether or not I agree with him (or anyone else) makes no difference. He has the absolute right (as Johnson does) to express his beliefs. "

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jbhiker wrote on Jun 5, 2009 8:06 AM:

" lodisafeway said: 'our own president has declared the United States to be Muslim'. How absurd and totally predictable are you trying to be? Turn off that AM Radio before you reach 100%. "

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lodisafeway wrote on Jun 5, 2009 7:49 AM:

" Besides, now that our own president has declared the United States to be Muslim (while standing on foreign soil), I suppose this subject is now moot. While I absolutely disagree with Obama in this regard and believe him foolish to make such a claim, he has the right to believe and espouse it. "

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lodisafeway wrote on Jun 5, 2009 7:46 AM:

" The only reason that offering a prayer (to anyone) has become an issue in a government building is because over time it has been held to be contrary to the Constitution as so many now erroneously believe. Yes, the Supreme Court has made decisions that would have one think that the "separation of church and state" is spelled out to mean that religion has no place within the confines of government-owned structures; but I must strenuously disagree.

The First Amendment couldn't be clearer that the only thing that is prohibited regarding religion is that the government cannot establish its own church and require the citizens to follow its tenets. The amendment was added to address precisely one of the major reasons so many fled Europe to the "New World."

Political correctness has taken us to the point of absurdity. Johnson has the right to believe Lodi is a Christian community (and voice that opinion) as anyone else has to claim that Lodi is Jewish or Muslim. And all have the absolute right to argue for or against any such claims.

We are a nation of people with different beliefs. All must be tolerated. "

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Cogito wrote on Jun 5, 2009 7:42 AM:

" Ive heard many Christians in this community speak intolerantly of other faiths in this community. Most of the time, it's of another denomination of Christians. One church in town even ran a seminar for their members, against the Mormons, over the "white salamander letter". The letter was proven to be a hoax, but the church never apologized. But to be honest, nobody has shown more intolerance than Atheists. They think their civil rights are being violated every time they see a cross, or overhear someone praying. Plus, they only seem to be offended by Christians. They are the biggest crybabies of anyone. "

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Stella wrote on Jun 5, 2009 7:20 AM:

" mjp, I think you miss the point here. No one is asking Christians to apologize for their beliefs. At issue here is the City Council using a public building - and public time - to pray to Jesus. That is disrespectful of all non-Christian Lodians, whose tax money supports the council, who attend meetings and have to sit through what is a private religious ceremony, and whose own religious - or non-religious - views are not respected or represented. It's also disrespectful to many Christians who do not believe that their government should be getting mixed up in their religion. "

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mjp wrote on Jun 5, 2009 6:43 AM:

" You know Lodi is a community that is accepting of all religions, but the fact is the majority are Christian. What is the big deal. If a certain religion is intolerant of other religions then that is a problem. But it is a problem within the members of that religious community, it should not require that the rest of us must start apologizing for our beliefs. "

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