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Why I'll be voting 'yes' on Measure W


Tuesday, February 3, 2009 6:02 AM PST

This March 3, Lodians will be going to the polls for the fourth time in 13 months. This special election ballot will have a grand total of one measure/question on it, Measure W, which states:

"Shall Ordinance 1812 of the City of Lodi, an ordinance Approving and Adopting the Redevelopment Plan for the Lodi Community Improvement Project be Adopted?"

Ordinance 1812 was voted on and passed by the Lodi City Council on a 3-1 vote. Council members Larry Hansen, Bob Johnson and Phil Katzakian voted in the affirmitive, and council member JoAnne Mounce was the lone dissenting vote.

Council member Susan Hitchcock was forced to be a nonparticipant in the voting due to her and her husband Jerry Glenn's ownership of property(s) in the purview of the proposed RDA. Hitchcock has, however, cosigned/authored legal documents supporting Measure W and should be considered a strong vote in favor of redevelopment. These documents are openly available at the city clerks' office.

Out of 163 cities in California with populations over 50,000, Lodi is just one of eight that does not have an active redevelopment agency. According to the paperwork filed at city hall, if Lodi had implemented an RDA the 10-20 years ago when it was first proposed, Lodi would have benefited by an average of $1,700,000 every year since.

Of course, whatever money is borrowed to make the projected water, sewer, street, sidewalk and sound wall improvements — as well as what is put toward expanding the sales tax base in these areas — will eventually have to be paid back. The increased tax revenue generated by the RDA is predicted to be sufficient to retire this debt. I mean, who can predict what the city's, state's or country's economy may be like in the year 2040? The people of Lodi should worry more about the futures of Social Security and Medicare, as they both by that time are expected to be well past the point of insolvency without drastic intervention no matter what relatively tiny amount of debt that the city of Lodi may incur via an RDA.

The March 3 election will not exactly be an election that will see Lodians casting ballots in record numbers. Turnout, I expect, will probably be at record lows.

Redevelopment opponents claim that an RDA will make the city of Lodi incur mountains of debt that will have to be paid back by future generations, and will only profit rich developers. The people actually being put to work, paying income tax and not collecting unemployment is apparently of little relevance.

RDA proponents say that redevelopment is a tool that will reinvigorate many somewhat blighted areas in mainly East Lodi, create many new jobs and let Lodi retain upwards of 64 percent of its property taxes that would otherwise be sent to Sacramento. The 64 percent number is according to the Lodi Chamber of Commerce Jan. 12 e-newsletter. Measure W is also supported by Scott Bratton, President of the Lodi Police Officers Association; Pete Iturrraran, President of the Lodi Firefighters Association; and the LUSD school board.

The main opponents of Measure W are a group of local residents calling themselves "Smart Lodi." This group deserves credit for obtaining the necessary 10 percent of registered voters needed to force the special election. The fundraisng efforts by the group, however, are expected to be anemic. Their path of reaching voters appears to be relying heavily on letters to the editor to this paper, the Sentinel, to make their case to the people of Lodi.

The "Yes on W" group is headed by Lodi Chamber of Commerce CEO Pat Patrick who is no stranger to political battles. Patrick also headed the successful "No on Measure R" campaign in 2004. This campaign committee is expected to be well-financed, and will probably raise as much money as needed to make sure that pre-election polling keeps their group well ahead.

While I have in the past disagreed with some of the Lodi Chamber stances on issues, I will be supporting this one. The State of California is NOT going to be generous with whatever meager funds it can secure in the foreseeable future. It just makes sense for the city of Lodi to hold onto its property taxes and make improvements to our fair city rather than let that money go into the black hole that is the State Capitol in Sacramento. It has become abundantly clear that there is virtually no amount of tax dollars that our Los Angelesand San Francisco-dominated state legislature cannot fritter away.

Vote "yes" on Measure W this March 3.

J. Kurt Roberts can be reached at jkurtroberts@sbcglobal.net.

Reader Feedback

danielH wrote on Feb 10, 2009 10:08 AM:

" loadeye: I agree Rushbo was campaigning. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 9, 2009 9:10 PM:

" DanielH, sounds like elrushbo's mommy or daddy are council members. Isn't that the same venom they spewed in Stockton to pass RDA, which has them elbow deep in debt? "

loadeye wrote on Feb 9, 2009 9:08 PM:

" Rushbo, tell us how deep in debt Stockton, Manteca, Tracy and Modesto and just how much they've gotten back from redevelopment? Didn't they have to borrow that money at 10-15% interest for these projects and are still in debt on their redevelopment loans? That is tax money that normally goes to schools, police, fire, libraries, and they'll have their funding cut by the amount of property taxes squandered by your own redevelopment plan. Do you honestly trust, Hansen, Johnson, Hitchcock-Glenn, and Katzakian giving that RDA money to themselves and their own families and friends businesses? If RDA is the real deal, Why is Mayor Mounce against it and being harrassed by the proponents? She would be the first one to vote for an issue like RDA if it really benefitted Lodi and not just the good ol' boys, you know that as well as I do. Hansen has hated her for years for trying to fix up the eastside for years and still carries that hatred with him. That money will merely fix up the streets and that'll be about it. You'll have to get your own loans to fix up your homes and will have to pay it back. "

danielh wrote on Feb 9, 2009 8:01 PM:

" El Rushbo: Stockton is suffering!!!!!

Apparently you don't get that. "

El Rushbo wrote on Feb 9, 2009 7:09 PM:

" You guys have made me rethink this whole issue! You`re right, we "Lodi" should be martyrs and just let Stockton, Manteca, Tracy and Modesto have our tax dollars! They all have an RDA and are collecting the extra $$$. Lodi is now , without ANY doubt, contributing a greater percentage of its Property tax dollars to the county. You want to be a martyr, fine! Just don`t ask everybody else in Lodi to! "

danielH wrote on Feb 9, 2009 9:02 AM:

" El Rushbo: Probably the most painful memory we brought up, on the public record, was Measure U.

Measure U doubled the salary of the mayor with the added job description of managing Freedom-of-information-act public releases.

Then we accused him of not doing his job when information was requested. especially, the mayor was concealing the Enterprise Zone contract that was awarded to Stockton, because of its poverty, and the ambitious proposals to improve that poverty. "

danielH wrote on Feb 9, 2009 9:00 AM:

" El Rushbo: 2 years ago, myself and one of the members of the Republican conservatives actually took the public microphone at the CC/RDA meeting and we called the mayor and 5 of the 6 CC members under the carpet. We did this twice, 2-weeks in a row.

We brought up how Stockton favors favorite pet projects at the expense of small business. "

danielH wrote on Feb 9, 2009 8:57 AM:

" El Rushbo: continued: Probably most importantly, Lodi is special because of the newspaper. This newspaper facilitates a forum for conversations like these.

In Stockton, I guarantee public opinion letters are screened in favor of the advertisers, and the newspaper only allows a certain number of opinions, because they claim there are other "popular" issues that need to be covered also.

If a letter-to-the-editor gets into Stockton, most likely it gets edited first.

In Stockton, they dropped 9 out of 10 of my every attempt to get in a letter.

In Stockton, they had Mayor Podesto and Chavez, who led the movement into RDA, and they steam-rolled their opposition. "

danielH wrote on Feb 9, 2009 8:51 AM:

" El Rushbo: I can answer where were these so-called Republicans in the 4 other cities you mentioned.

Lodi is special because of the fact that it only has a population of 60,000 (?), and because of the math, only about 1,500 (?) signatures were required. This means that a small group of 10 like-minded people can organize, and mobilize on foot to gather the signatures that are required. "

danielH wrote on Feb 9, 2009 8:44 AM:

" Kurt Roberts: You're all speculation. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 8, 2009 11:15 AM:

" And I find it very misleading that the city leaders call it "Lodi Community Improvement Project" and not Redevelopment or RDA. They know either of those labels would shoot it down in a second. Vote NO on measure W, REDEVELOPMENT. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 8, 2009 11:09 AM:

" Campking, that's a very powerful video and should be watched by everyone. Just like those lily white faces on Lodi CC, except for Mayor Mounce, who want to take that land and homes from those minorities, low income and poor Lodians. That condo project in National City bears a striking resemblance to the agreement between Lodi CC and the owner of Wine&Roses, Munson, with that deal to lock out any inside investors from bidding on that so called downtown hotel that's being studied. Isn't the city of Lodi already subsidizing his downtown restaurant, Rosewood, with rents and other gimmees, including many freebie city credit card lunches, dinners and even drinks at the bar? Just like the video says, nothing but a giveaway to the wealthy by council to also line their own pockets. That large RDA area spread around like that will also allow them to use eminent domain on those properties that aren't even in the RDA designation. There are too many money grabbers waiting for our tax dollars to merely line their own pockets and put Lodi $500,000,000 into debt. We're already halfway there. Debts need to be paid before incurring more to line good-ol'-boys pockets. "

campking wrote on Feb 7, 2009 10:39 PM:

" http://reason.tv/video/show/58.html

Interesting take on RDA. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 6, 2009 2:43 PM:

" Observer, you might as well add another blog name to your collection. But it should be more cheerleadsy like. Maybe, crazy legs? "

Observer wrote on Feb 6, 2009 6:47 AM:

" Since you are suggesting I'd prefer to be known as the "Real Deal". I wonder if I can get my blog name changed? "

loadeye wrote on Feb 5, 2009 1:32 PM:

" observer, are you responding for the rear admiral, patton1, or are you, indeed, the real deal? "

Observer wrote on Feb 5, 2009 7:30 AM:

" Hey Lodeye....Ted Katzakian died several months ago. Don't you think it's time to figure that out and at least let him rest in peace. It just continues to underscore the fact that you really have no idea what your talking about. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 4, 2009 10:19 PM:

" You go JoAnne, you're the only one that makes any sense and isn't working for the good ol' boys. No money to the Diede type contractors and developers like Katzakians, Gewekes, Sniders, Gillespies, or any of their good ol' boys circle. And Ms. Cerney, thank you for bringing up the leagal aspects and the awareness that this is just discrimination against the poor and immigrant population of Lodi. And for saying it's simply a giveaway to the good ol' boys. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 4, 2009 10:01 PM:

" patton1, rear admiral, I notice you're out around 3PM. Are you preparing for your CC meeting and have to study the issues tonight? I'm watching the meeting now and it's after 8:30 and you're still awake. Surprise! Ms. Mounce is making manager King look like the con man he is with his doublespeak and indirect answers to her questions. King is just full of buts and ums and sounds like the sputtering, muttering Hansen when he's speaking on something he knows nothing about. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 4, 2009 3:30 PM:

" patton1, rear admiral, what do you have to lose if the RDA gets dumped on? You're very angry about possibly losing some of that pig trough money for some reason. You have something at stake, don't you? "

patton1 wrote on Feb 4, 2009 2:25 PM:

" RDA is a voter approved. Nearly every city has it but Lodi. They all get to keep more of their tax dollars to spend on their cities. But not Lodi, we insist on sending our tax dollars to the state to be spent elswhere. Why, because unlike most places, some of our residents actually hate the city they live in. "

patton1 wrote on Feb 4, 2009 2:23 PM:

" I dont say that RDa money goes into the general fund rather it can pay for things that the general fund currently has to. For every dollar that RDA spends, that is one less dollar that our general fund has to spend. Then we get to spend it on something else. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 4, 2009 1:34 PM:

" patton1, rear admiral, answer the questions posed to you and quit changing the subject. Your lies about RDA don't hold water without any documentation like the MORR documents that show it for the get rich quick scam for the wealthy that it is. Once again, how much of that RDA money goes to the general fund? The answer is none so please tell me why you say it does? You're still full of propaganda and grandiose cheerleading. Please answer if you can. Maybe manager King can help you out. "

patton1 wrote on Feb 4, 2009 12:55 PM:

" San Joaquin Republican Assembly members is a sham group. Sj county GOP is in favor of measure W. They are the real republican party. "

patton1 wrote on Feb 4, 2009 12:50 PM:

" I meant disablity pension not worker comp. My bad. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 4, 2009 9:53 AM:

" I notice that the chamber endorses the ayes, but only chairleader Patrick and not any members, as does the Sentinel with no naames mentioned but apparently Mr. Hanner because Marty can't think for himself without consulting daddy. And how many employees at the Sentinel share the same views. The Republicans voted amongst their members, not just the paid mouthpiece that speaks for only himself like Mr. Patrick. And, rushbo, you even sound a little like Hitchcock-Glenn with your agenda of propaganda without any real substance. Peace out. "

16925 wrote on Feb 4, 2009 8:51 AM:

" El Rushbo

You are welcome Mayor Hanson "

Observer wrote on Feb 4, 2009 6:16 AM:

" If the San Joaquin County Republican Assembly is any reflection of our national Republican leadership we are in a great deal of trouble. The national leadership can't seem to get in touch with mainstream Republicans what makes you think the local leadership can? I was on the fence with Measure W but now I know I will support it. "

El Rushbo wrote on Feb 3, 2009 8:49 PM:

" And where were these so-called "Republicans" when Stockton, Manteca, Modesto and Tracy established RDAs??? Didn`t hear a peep out of them then!!! Guess theyre against going into debt to buy a house too!? "

El Rushbo wrote on Feb 3, 2009 8:42 PM:

" Thank you for your imput Ms. Mounce.. uh, I mean 16925 "

16925 wrote on Feb 3, 2009 8:34 PM:

" Local Republicans against Measure W
The San Joaquin Republican Assembly, a chapter of the California Republican Assembly, a conservative activist group, has come out against Lodi's Measure W.

The group prefers Lodi and other cities take advantage of their county's state-approved enterprise zone, which is a special district that receive job-creating tax breaks.

Here's what group President Nancy Cochran had to say in a written statement:


San Joaquin Republican Assembly members voted unanimously to endorse a NO vote for Proposition W, a measure to appear on the ballot at a special election called by City of Lodi on March 3.

As a chapter of California Republican Assembly, described by President Ronald Reagan as the conscience of the Republican Party, our members believe strongly in individual freedom and the entrepreneurial spirit. These principles have proven through time to be essential elements for success in business and in the community at large. Government interference thwarts business development. Measure W would place a burden on our financial future, instead of encouraging free enterprise.

The Enterprise Zone concept is the real answer for the blighted areas of our communities to thrive. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 3, 2009 8:25 PM:

" http://seelodi.groupee.net/groupee_files/attachments/8/7/3/8731002682/8731002682_RDA_costs.pdf?ts=498917B1&key=9AEDC23FD6BA9F258C3C9DF6BEA14D96&referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fseelodi.groupee.net%2Feve%2Fforums%2Fa%2Fga%2Ful%2F9731002682%2FRDA_costs.pdf "

El Rushbo wrote on Feb 3, 2009 8:20 PM:

" Loadeye; So you`re calling the entire Lodi Police Dept., Lodi Fire Dept., the Lodi Unified School District, County Supervisor Victor Mow as well as 4/5 of our own city council...and I quote, "bottom feeders"? You really need to come down out of the clouds and recognize that you may be wrong on this one...... "

loadeye wrote on Feb 3, 2009 8:19 PM:

" http://seelodi.groupee.net/groupee_files/attachments/5/8/7/58710711/58710711_Municipal_bonds.pdf?ts=498916E4&key=10C0F07126EF1E30F1F4B285E6AACF8A&referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fseelodi.groupee.net%2Feve%2Fforums%2Fa%2Fga%2Ful%2F68710711%2FMunicipal_bonds.pdf "

loadeye wrote on Feb 3, 2009 8:11 PM:

" http://seelodi.groupee.net/groupee_files/attachments/8/7/7/8771054682/8771054682_Response_to_Councilman_Johnson.pdf?ts=49891413&key=6E0189E558021B62DCF396D487FAF572&referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fseelodi.groupee.net%2Feve%2Fforums%2Fa%2Fga%2Ful%2F9771054682%2FResponse_to_Councilman_Johnson.pdf "

loadeye wrote on Feb 3, 2009 7:53 PM:

" Read the link below and tell me what Patrick and Diede construction are doing in this "partnership" for redevelopment. This warning letter from thed state of California only shows that Diede can't survive without his good ol' boys at city hall. Aren't those the same good ol' boys that let him sneak that new building in there in the vineyards? Did he buy his acre for acre farmland? Why is it these local scab contractors have to have connections in city hall to get all these gravy contracts, even though they aren't even close to low bid on many of them? Why does the city council, attorney and manager continue to let these backdoor deals happen? If it were anybody but Diede and Patrick, you'd be in jail and investigated by the grand jury. Quit the games city council, you four who back RDA and are friends and business associates of Diede and make them play by the rules everyone else does. If they did work other than their sloppy bang em'in maybe they could be competitive. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 3, 2009 7:39 PM:

" Here's a letter of warning to chief Patrick. Check out this blog.

http://seelodi.groupee.net/groupee_files/attachments/1/9/2/1921061682/1921061682_Warning_letter_to_CC_from_State_of_CA.pdf?ts=49890CCC&key=7692254A7869D5AED0A0678DC83DE785&referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fseelodi.groupee.net%2Feve%2Fforums%2Fa%2Fga%2Ful%2F2921061682%2FWarning_letter_to_CC_from_State_of_CA.pdf "

OTH wrote on Feb 3, 2009 7:36 PM:

" Patton

Do you realize how chidish and downright stupid it is to say that because people disagree with you they lack civic pride and patriotism? Do you drink? "

loadeye wrote on Feb 3, 2009 7:27 PM:

" rushbo, how are our property taxes going to these other cities? Aren't you borrowing this funding to hopefully pay it back in 45 years at up to 25% interest? What guarantee is there that it can even be paid back? And you'd trust these same lame councilpersons and manager that already have us $250,000,000 in debt and want to increase that to the 500,000,000 max in two or so years? The same inept group that has LEUD deep in debt and headed for a bond rating drop soon? If this isn't a pyramid scheme, where are all the eastside residents that are so thrilled about RDA? Those eastsiders that have revealed themselves are all opponents. Why? Why are two Lodi ex-mayors opposed to RDA? Why don't you proponents reveal the contents of the MORR documents to us opponents and your other proponents? Afraid that truthful document that shows what a scam redevelopment really is would make you look like the greedy bottom feeders you really are? "

El Rushbo wrote on Feb 3, 2009 5:34 PM:

" mp, why are 95% of Cal. cities over 50,000 pop. using RDAs. Why has Victor Mow encouraged Lodi`s RDA? Why is redevelopment law still on the books if it so harmful? Why has the Lodi Unified School District, Lodi Police Off. Association, Lodi Fire association all endorsed Measure W? Why do 4 out of 5 of our own city council endorse Measure W? Why do you want Lodi`s property tax money going to Stockton, Manteca, Tracy and Modesto? "

Whoa Nellie! wrote on Feb 3, 2009 5:06 PM:

" Well, it seems like Loadeye is a lil upset about being called disabled. Load, you make it sound like being disabled is a bad or negative thing. I know several people who have had they're bodies breakdown as you describe, some claiming Workers Comp and one whose problems were/are more degenerative. Perhaps Patton1 was suggesting that you are maybe mentally disabled due to your constant conspiracy theory GOB Developer Slumdog Millionaire Westsider blogs. For every one positive thing you have to say here there are at least 500 negative rants. "

loadeye wrote on Feb 3, 2009 4:14 PM:

" That's how full of crap you are, patton1. 29 years and never drew workman's comp. The skilled trades allow retirement at 55 in all crafts, with at least 10 years. I chose to work til I was 57 before I was completely broken down. Quit spreading your SOB BS about my disability. I used to work for local contractors here and they're nothing but a bunch of greedy employers. One of them, CenCal Fire, has charges pending against them by the National Labor Relations Board for cheating their own employees on a prevailing wage job here and the city of Lodi still makes sure they and Diede Construction still get all those prevailing wage jobs. Diede has union pickets at his gate periodically for unfair wage and labor practices. These are your ratty, cheating owners who'd cheat their own mother out of a penny. I hope you're really proud of them and their low quality work. I'll bet neither company has many tradesman that are qualified journeyman and been in any kind of apprenticeship program. I don't want my RDA money, or any money, going to thieves like this. Patton1, why do you keep accusing me of being disabled? "

patton1 wrote on Feb 3, 2009 2:25 PM:

" Again Lodieye now shows that he hates local contactors. Who escapes his hatred. Lodieye bleeds a union pension every month. A pension he got early due to claim disablity. Very low ethics "

loadeye wrote on Feb 3, 2009 1:51 PM:

" Redevelopment keeps local contractors working while they cheat their employees on wages, cut every corner possible and shoddy, poor workmanship, all aided by the city employees who help them cheat, lie and reduce their contract bids behind closed doors to get those contracts. "

mp wrote on Feb 3, 2009 1:19 PM:

" Article Request:
Oxford Street and its redevelopment problems

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Article Information:
Title: Oxford Street and its redevelopment problems


Author(s): Russell Schiller

Journal: International Journal of Retail & Distribution Management

Year: 1984
Volume: 12
Issue: 6
Page: 34 - 36

ISSN: 0307-2363

DOI: 10.1108/eb018252

Publisher: MCB UP Ltd
Document Access:
Existing customers:

Abstract: Oxford Street is one of the best-known shopping streets in the world, but it suffers from serious problems. Investors are cautious about it; many of the buildings are of poor physical quality, and new developments pose technical difficulties. Russell Schiller offers several solutions to these problems. Oxford Street could be better managed, as are some of our better quality covered shopping centres. But in itself this would not be sufficient: what is also needed is a courageous decision to reduce traffic and introduce more pedestrianisation. Another possibility is to increase the physical depth of Oxford Street. This article is based on a talk given by Russell Schiller at a conference in September on the future of Oxford Street, organised by Westminster City Council. "

mp wrote on Feb 3, 2009 1:17 PM:

" http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1620375

Great link to an article about abuse.
Read have way down. "

mp wrote on Feb 3, 2009 1:11 PM:

" No hater here!

Just a truth sayer!

One who desires to stop out of control government spending!

No on Measure W Please!

I LOVE THESE BLOGS!!!!! "

mp wrote on Feb 3, 2009 1:10 PM:

" mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:46 PM:

" Your agruement that "the money goes to the State" is getting REALLY old.
If you take from the State, the State will ask the taxpayers for more...
Come on.
I don't support Measure W becuase there is ZERO accountability.

You ask me to trust me council people with more money?

They can't manage the money that have.

My electric rate are higher that then they have ever been.

My water and sewer rates are out of control.

They can't get my Walmart.

And they want more... " "

commonsense1 wrote on Feb 3, 2009 12:58 PM:

" mp, of the 163 cities taking advantage of an RDA, name the cities that have suffered because of that choice. Or, maybe you can name a city that has suggested they wish they had sent those tax dollars to Sacramento. Please don't use examples where employee union's have been the main sourse of municipality problems. "

patton1 wrote on Feb 3, 2009 12:43 PM:

" Are you saying that there is more accountablity in the county or state? What a joke? Lodi hasnt even cut services or jobs yet. Have you seen whta the county and the state are up to? "

patton1 wrote on Feb 3, 2009 12:42 PM:

" MP is a hater. How does paying for the new police station equate to a scam? How does reparing firehouse 2 equate to a scam? What corporation gets rich? "

patton1 wrote on Feb 3, 2009 12:41 PM:

" How does new sewers, streets facade improvemenst etc. equal a sham.How would redoing Cherokee Lane be called a sham? "

El Rushbo wrote on Feb 3, 2009 12:40 PM:

" County Supervisor Victor Mow has stated his support for Lodi implementing an RDA! Is he secretly wanting the county he represents to suffer??? "

El Rushbo wrote on Feb 3, 2009 12:36 PM:

" The County Treasurer`s office has said that technically all the property tax revenue generated in the county, stays in the county. Though ever since Prop 13, the state has instituted MANY avenues by which the state can receive county dollars, just not calling them property tax dollars. Lodi needs to KEEP LODI DOLLARS IN LODI!! Don`t let Stockton, Manteca, Tracy and Modesto get a disproportionate share of Lodi $$$$$$!!!! "

mp wrote on Feb 3, 2009 11:03 AM:

" Corporations and the rich have deverted tax dollars into their own pockets have left agencies penniless causing the taxpayers to make up the difference!! "

mp wrote on Feb 3, 2009 11:01 AM:

" Patton1, this has nothing to do with civic pride and patriotism. Redevelopment is a sham that developer have hidden behind for over a decade. Government subsidizy and bailout. The kind of poor management that has gone unchecked cause the ecomonic downfall we are current experience.

Just tell the truth and let people make up their own minds. "

mp wrote on Feb 3, 2009 10:57 AM:

" mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 5:13 PM:

" mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:46 PM:

" Your agruement that "the money goes to the State" is getting REALLY old.
If you take from the State, the State will ask the taxpayers for more...
Come on.
I don't support Measure W becuase there is ZERO accountability.

You ask me to trust me council people with more money?

They can't manage the money that have.

My electric rate are higher that then they have ever been.

My water and sewer rates are out of control.

They can't get my Walmart.

And they want more... "

patton1 wrote on Feb 3, 2009 10:34 AM:

" the truth is that it is easier to hate our local government for some because they feel that they hatred goes further. The lack of civic pride and patriotism is a very sad comment on these peoples lives. "

patton1 wrote on Feb 3, 2009 10:32 AM:

" How is it that people trust Sacramento more than Lodi? How is it that people think that taxes and fees placed on us by Sacramento is better than those in Lodi. "

patton1 wrote on Feb 3, 2009 10:31 AM:

" RDA helps pay for things that our general fund now has to. That measn theat the general fund will have more money. "

OTH wrote on Feb 2, 2009 11:27 PM:

" Patton

You state "Mounce has never done a thing for the eastside. She is just beholden to a small group of not in my backyarders."

Can you tell me which of the esteemed listed far westside dwellers has done anything for the eastside? It's been there for years while each and everyone of the people mentioned have avoided it like the plague. It may as well have been a different planet.

However now that the visions of dollar signs dance in the wanters heads it's all they've thought about for years.

How much money have taxpayers paid to replace rotting infra structure that has been diverted to something else? "

blossom wrote on Feb 2, 2009 7:51 PM:

" I personally am TIRED of WASTE and NO accountability.
Sick sick sick of it!!
I am voting NO!
NO WAY! "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 5:15 PM:

" Now now now.... just becuase other cities have RDA.

That is no reason for Lodi to go into millions of debt to benefit a bunch a developers. "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 5:14 PM:

" Be honest now......

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:39 PM:

" Not nuts overnight! I didn't make that claim. Simply, don't lie to the votes and say eminate domain is outlawed when is only take a vote of three council members and thiry days to repeal the
ordinance.

No scare tactics - just facts.

Just be honest and say you "could" use eminate domain and explain the cases where it would apply.

Don't lie and say outlawed!
That's giving people a faults sense of secuity. " "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 5:13 PM:

" mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:46 PM:

" Your agruement that "the money goes to the State" is getting REALLY old.
If you take from the State, the State will ask the taxpayers for more...
Come on.
I don't support Measure W becuase there is ZERO accountability.

You ask me to trust me council people with more money?

They can't manage the money that have.

My electric rate are higher that then they have ever been.

My water and sewer rates are out of control.

They can't get my Walmart.

And they want more...

NO DEAL! " "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 5:12 PM:

" Your avoiding my questions...... come one now patton/commonsense/whoever you are.

Lets talk facts since you are so full of them! "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 5:11 PM:

" Now who is talking scare tactics!!!
Speak with fork tongue patton/commonsense1/patrick/all-in-one!

The general fund can not and will not be funded through redevelopment. All RDA can do is provide tax breaks on the eastside.

It can not pay for salaries or operations. "

patton1 wrote on Feb 2, 2009 4:34 PM:

" If you think Lodi has financial problems now, wait until measure W fails. If we cant keep this money form going to Sac. than rates are going up boys and girls. You can thank the people who hate lodi for that. "

patton1 wrote on Feb 2, 2009 4:31 PM:

" Schools dont lose with meassure w, they win. They get more money. Thats why LUSD endorses it. Coscto is outside they area so they dont get a dime.RDAs cant make cities go bankrupt, they are seperate. For all of you who hate the cc so much that they would let our tax dollars be spend by Sacramento first, I say shame on you. "

commonsense1 wrote on Feb 2, 2009 4:06 PM:

" Just curious. Out of the 163 cities benefiting from an RDA, can someone list those that have been bankrupted due to their use of an RDA? "

loadeye wrote on Feb 2, 2009 2:04 PM:

" mp, wait'll they give millions more in concessions to get that Costco store in here for Gillespie at Reynolds Ranch. We'll just keep paying and paying in lieu of higher utility rates and probably more surcharges for the Katzakian-Weybret ground pollution cleanup and Lodi's neglect of eastside infrastructure. Councilwoman Mounce is the only one who can stop this madness. Listen to her and watch or attend those council meetings and watch the others show their stupidity and greed. "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:46 PM:

" Your agruement that "the money goes to the State" is getting REALLY old.
If you take from the State, the State will ask the taxpayers for more...
Come on.
I don't support Measure W becuase there is ZERO accountability.

You ask me to trust me council people with more money?

They can't manage the money that have.

My electric rate are higher that then they have ever been.

My water and sewer rates are out of control.

They can't get my Walmart.

And they want more...

NO DEAL! "

loadeye wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:45 PM:

" patton, you and your city girls would have over $10 million if you'd make Hutchins Square pay back the money they still owe and lose an extra 1 1/2 million more every year. Get rid of those money sucking programs for the wealthy and well connected there and you'd have that 1 1/2 million for yourselves. "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:42 PM:

" You should be ashamed to say money is gone if you can't tell me where is would go.
On Adminastration?
On Water lines? (taxpayers already paying)
On ground water contamination? (Taxpayers already paying)
DOUBLE DIPPING? "

loadeye wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:41 PM:

" patton, reality, commonsense, girard and the rest of you city cheerleaders, why are all those proponents westside or out of the eastside area for RDA? I thought you blunderbusses hated Mr. Iturran, ex-chief Hansen and those dirty unions? Now you say we should vote for measure W because they are backing it? How about their membership? Did anyone bother to ask them? We'll find the answer to that question next month. I want to see that 20% of my property tax money go to the schools, don't you? How do you propose the schools make up for that 20% of property tax that Lodi will keep line the pockets of the wealthy, well connected and cheating contractors that can't make a living without the city of Lodi government pig trough? You must surely be those pigs that feed from it, too. Read the MORR report on what RDA really does to a town and you'll change your tune in a minute. I left the link the other day. Did you bother to read it? "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:40 PM:

" WHAT WOULD YOU DO WITH THE MONEY IF YOU HAD IT!!!! "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:39 PM:

" Not nuts overnight! I didn't make that claim. Simply, don't lie to the votes and say eminate domain is outlawed when is only take a vote of three council members and thiry days to repeal the
ordinance.

No scare tactics - just facts.

Just be honest and say you "could" use eminate domain and explain the cases where it would apply.

Don't lie and say outlawed!
That's giving people a faults sense of secuity. "

patton1 wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:35 PM:

" I read where kurt says that Lodi would be keeping $1.7 million every year had we already had RDA. That is a shame that we have let that money go. The east side deserves that money and the people who oppose measure W should be ashamed of themselves. "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:35 PM:

" These are not scare tactics.
They are facts.
Which should have been answered a long time ago.


Instead this cc tries to shove more debt down the taxpayer throats without upfront accountability. "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:33 PM:

" fair enough, but don't you think once the city finally has the ability to borrow money for, say the grape bowl, they will not think twice and bulldoze house for the sake of the community greater good?

Not to think in terms of scare tactics, but interest rate on RDA bonds can be as high as 25%.

What about the debt the current has? Do you think $148 million dollars on the LEUD is good debt?

Do you think the city will every be able to pay that down in your life time?

What about the bonds the city HAS TO go out for.... Lodi Energy Center and Water Treatment Plant?

I think RDA on top of everything else is just way to much power handed to local officials that do not have the kinds of experience necessary to over see millions in debt.

The last thing Lodi needs is another sink hole of spending. "

reality wrote on Feb 2, 2009 1:17 PM:

" mp the city has always had the right to use eminent domain for public purposes to build a fire station to widen a street etc. i understand that the city has used eminent doamin only 3 times in 100 years. why the rampant fear that the city will go nuts overnite if a development area is approved. it is scare tactics at its worst "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 11:14 AM:

" Oh and patton1/reality/all-in-one, I have asked several point blank questions which you are trying to avoid. How about it? Double dip? Public vs Private eminate domain? Debt?

Any answers? "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 11:11 AM:

" pattan1, that is quiet the assumption you have made about Ms. Mounce. If I remember correctly Mounce helped get a code enforcement department in the city, spend years with eastside improvement on community outreach, helped get sidewalks for ada, helped get tree triming, helped get lights in alleys, helped with street sweeping. Let me think....... I will research and continue later as to all the thing Ms. Mounce has done to help the eastside. What have you done pattan1? "

patton1 wrote on Feb 2, 2009 11:05 AM:

" Mounce has never done a thing to help the eastside. She is beholden to a small group of not back in my backyards. "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 10:24 AM:

" patton1, reality, commonsense1, have you been golfing all weekend? You have been so quiet. "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 10:22 AM:

" Where are all the Eastside people for Measure W?

So far we have only heard from the people how will receive kick-backs or do not understand the long term problems surrounding RDA. "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 10:20 AM:

" patton1, I am sure that Ms. Mounce wants to help the eastside residents. She has been fighting for the eastside for years. JoAnne Mounce says, "No to Measure W."

What is wrong with this picture? "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 10:18 AM:

" I don't disagree that taking money from the State is not such a bad idea, but what is Lodi leaders going to do with the money?

It seems that all the developers are the one who will come out on top and all the poor people on the eastside will get the shaft - again. "

mp wrote on Feb 2, 2009 10:16 AM:

" Sounds like a lot of good people support measure w, but I found this post on another interesting:


16925 wrote on Jan 31, 2009 11:00 AM:

" LNS failed to mention that the only council member who lives in the project area, the council member who has faught for 18 years for eastside improve does not support Measure W or the current redevelopment plan. JoAnne Mounce has concerns that the plan does not protect the eastside residents and small business owners from the city council members and staff.
Eminate Domain can not be used for private use but it can and will be used for public use. Example: if the grape bowl renovation needs a parking lot there goes all the houses!
If an sports complex goes in on the eastside - where - a city block full of houses.
Not to mention what the eastside really needs: sidewalk repair, new sewer and water lines, road repair. That is what this plan should be insuring.

The plan calls for infrastructure and TCP clean up. The citizens are already paying for that. Will the city refund the money to the taxpayers or double dip? " "

reality wrote on Feb 2, 2009 10:10 AM:

" im sure that pete iturrean the pres of the fireman union is a real slumloard with tons of property on the east side.
loadeye is ajerk who will say anything to cloud the issue no matter how much of a lie it is "

patton1 wrote on Feb 2, 2009 9:46 AM:

" The group opposing measure W want Lodi's tax dollars to continue to flow to Sacramento instead of being spend here. How crazy is that! This small group is against helping the eastside and they use scare tactics to support their selfish and irresponsible behavior. "

patton1 wrote on Feb 2, 2009 9:44 AM:

" Yes read the pamphlet.

In favor..
Susan Hitchcock Principle/cc member
Scott Bratton Lodi police association
Bo Katzakian retired former Mayor
Ivan Suess for Loel Center
Pete Iturren Lodi Firfighters Union
tracy Williams Ceo of Loel Center
Doctor Mullen
Larry Hansen
Russ Munson
Sara Herbele "

loadeye wrote on Feb 2, 2009 8:42 AM:

" Read your voters' pamphlet carefully, see who all the wealthy, well connected and good ol' boys are who are donating money to the Yes proponents and see they all own properties or slumhouses that need fixing up and then vote no to welfare for the rich and management and council thieves. No on W! "

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