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Weighting the pros and cons

Lodi does not need a new Wal-Mart Supercenter


Tuesday, September 2, 2008 6:44 AM PDT

Comments (205 comment(s))

Well, it looks like Wal-Mart might be coming to Lodi with a Supercenter. What could be better?

At this one place you will likely be able to get your glasses, lube the car, put tires on the same car, get some new clothes, fill a prescription, buy some toys for the kids, print photos of the camping trip where you used the supplies from the Supercenter and buy groceries. This place will be so big that the green bananas that you put in your cart will be yellow and ripe at checkout. Heck, I bet some of you will be able to spend a whole day there and actually enjoy it.

Now before you start jumping on me for not going to a Supercenter or to Wal-Mart, you are wrong — I have been to a Supercenter — and I go to the local Wal-Mart when I need things that I know Wal-Mart will have. I found the Supercenter that I went to unbelievable. The selection and the crowd fascinated me.

My problem with the Supercenter is that everything you can get there, you can already get at other stores in Lodi.

From my perspective, the Supercenter will add nothing to Lodi except concentrated traffic, as supported by the California Highway Patrol, and very likely empty retail space in other parts of town. How can that be good?

I cannot understand how the Supercenter will add sales tax revenue to Lodi. What does the Supercenter bring to Lodi that we don't already have at the current Wal-Mart or at another store? Nothing. So, where is the gain? If you want to shop at Wal-Mart and get groceries, then take your cart and walk to Food 4 Less. You will have all that you want and you will get some exercise, too. If you need an oil change, go get one.

I am sure some of you will say that Wal-Mart will offer everything at lower prices. Great, but how does that help Lodi? If you pay less for a taxable item, Lodi actually gets less in sales tax dollars.

What about competition? I am all for it, but it needs to balanced with the costs to society and the public good. If the competition means that Big Kmart, Mervyns or tenants of the current Wal-Mart shopping center close, is that good? Is a lack of choice good? No way. What actually happens is very likely less competition and vacant retail space.

Now if you disagree with me so far, let's consider other towns. Bakersfield has a Supercenter and now they also have a vacant lot where the old Wal-Mart was. What about Stockton, Galt and Elk Grove? Why is it that Lodi cannot wait to have a Supercenter when other towns don't want them? Is Lodi smarter? Do you go to a restaurant after your friend told you the food was bad? I hope not.

Surely some of you will say that we voted for the Supercenter with Measure R in 2004. I'm sorry to say, but you didn't. Neither Wal-Mart nor the Supercenter were mentioned in Measure R. What Measure R would have done, had it passed, was limit the size of a retail store in Lodi to no more than 125,000 square feet. While Measure R would have stopped the planned Supercenter because the Supercenter is larger, it really had nothing to do with the Supercenter.

The Lodi Chamber of Commerce supports the Supercenter and wants people to look out 10 years about this decision because Lodi will need shopping choices. That sounds great. See your future, be your future. I am sure Lodi will need more shopping options in 10 years but is a Wal-Mart Supercenter the future that the Chamber of Commerce wants for Lodi? I hope not.

John Johnson, CFA is a Lodi-based business appraiser. You can reach Mr. Johnson at john@johnejohnson.com or at 369-1451.

Reader Feedback

TAnDC wrote on Sep 12, 2008 9:25 PM:

" observer, that flyer against Walmart probably came from your buddy, Gillespie at Reynolds Ranch. Rumor says they'll do anything to get those commercial businesses over there at RR and looks like they're trying to sabotage Walmart, whoever they are. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 12, 2008 11:16 AM:

" Oh, and those fresh vegetables may even rival the lovely produce you feel you can purchase, in quality and price, at a Wal-Mart. LOL! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 12, 2008 11:14 AM:

" Sportsguru: I'll bet you that, if you try really really hard (sarcasm, of course) you'll find fresh vegetables in Lodi! Imagine that! Aren't we lucky! "

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Observer wrote on Sep 11, 2008 3:57 PM:

" Hey, did anybody else get a large glossy flyer on their front porch in the past few days? It's in opposition to the Super Walmart. There is no information where it came from. Can anybody guess? I love the part where it says, "Why have Super Walmart when we can have Kohl's, Bed Bath & Beyond, Trader Joes, Barnes & Noble, Brand Name Outlets". Somebody spend a lot of money on his unidentified hit piece. "

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SportsGuru wrote on Sep 10, 2008 9:39 PM:

" .
LODIAN, I can't get fresh vegetables at the WalMart store .. I need the SUPERCENTER for that! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 9, 2008 12:38 PM:

" SportsGuru: You can stop by the current Wal-Mart shopping center. "

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SportsGuru wrote on Sep 9, 2008 12:09 PM:

" I wish the Walmart Supercenter would hurry up and open. I need a back-pack and some groceries, and it would be nice to stop in one place to get them! :) "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 10:02 PM:

" sam: There are several businesses in town where my parents still just run a tab and pay every once in awhile. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 9:59 PM:

" sam: I have a million of those stories too. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 9:57 PM:

" Zinfandel wrote on Sep 8, 2008 4:32 PM:

" Lodian wrote:Zin: What has been your experience that leads you to this opinion? "

Growing up in Lodi in my time, you learned at an early age you were acceptable If you fit certain standards. The right ethic group (Dakota German), the right religion (Lutheran), social economic standards (old family money). "


Zin: I don't into any of those categories yet I felt/feel accepted in Lodi just fine. A lot of times people that do not feel accepted might need to look at themselves. They may be excluding themselves. "

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sam wrote on Sep 8, 2008 6:01 PM:

" Zin said "Are you kidding me? Lodi has never had the "lovable feel" that you are taiking about"

I disagree. I remember Lovable Lodi. i remember buying groceries and forgetting my check book. I was asked to just drop the check by next time I was in town. OMG, that is so loveable.

I remember a girl in town needed a heart-lung transplant and so many people helped me put on a great find raiser to fund the surgery.

I could go on. I love Lodi. "

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Zinfandel wrote on Sep 8, 2008 4:32 PM:

" Lodian wrote:Zin: What has been your experience that leads you to this opinion? "

Growing up in Lodi in my time, you learned at an early age you were acceptable If you fit certain standards. The right ethic group (Dakota German), the right religion (Lutheran), social economic standards (old family money). "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 4:28 PM:

" Rhodie wrote "But Wify liked the "feel" of Lodi (and is looking forward to the new Walmart)."

Rhodie: The new SWM is not what Lodi has been about nor what made it the nice little town your wife was drawn to. SWM is part of what will change Lodi to something we do not enjoy as much anymore. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 4:21 PM:

" Zin wrote "Lodi is and always has been a very snobbish and cliquish town!"

Zin: What has been your experience that leads you to this opinion? "

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T & C wrote on Sep 8, 2008 2:42 PM:

" If Immigration officers leased out the present Wal-Mart building, there would still be those in this Blog who would still Complain and use scare tactics, even though we get "RELOCATE" illegals back to their own country! Next you will say to us that "illegals come to America to shop at Wal-Mart!" "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 8, 2008 1:45 PM:

" For the record she grew up in a town a quarter the size of Lodi. Superwalmart came in there as well. The locals loved it. They could finally get what they needed. One grocery store closed, but that was because the owner took out more loans than the store could sustain and then split. This was a collge town where everyone was on a tight budget. Well, except for the owner who took off;) "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 8, 2008 1:42 PM:

" "I guess we are going to have to agree to disagree. Lodi is and always has been a very snobbish and cliquish town! I don't see anything loveable about that!"

When we were looking on where we wanted to live we found three places we liked, two gated communities and Lodi. When we talked it over with a few contacts we have here from Lodi and Stockton they all said the samething in different words about Lodi. It's small town, cliquish and thinks it's better than anywhere else around here. But Wify liked the "feel" of Lodi (and is looking forward to the new Walmart). "

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zinfandel wrote on Sep 8, 2008 1:33 PM:

" Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 1:22 PM:

" Zin: All my life. And Lodi has changed. The last several years have not brought the best of changes and now it looks like it's going to get a lot worse. I grew up here, obviously, and Lodi used to be a lot more lovable and livable. "

I guess we are going to have to agree to disagree. Lodi is and always has been a very snobbish and cliquish town! I don't see anything loveable about that! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 1:22 PM:

" Zin: All my life. And Lodi has changed. The last several years have not brought the best of changes and now it looks like it's going to get a lot worse. I grew up here, obviously, and Lodi used to be a lot more lovable and livable. "

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Zinfandel wrote on Sep 8, 2008 12:56 PM:

" Lodian, to answer your question; All My Life!
How long have you lived in Lodi? "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 12:36 PM:

" Zin: How long have you lived in Lodi? "

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Zinfandel wrote on Sep 8, 2008 12:28 PM:

" Lodian wrote:
Zin: Yep, from one Irish a$$ to another (LOL!) we are losing that livable lovable feel and fast. Can it be helped? Stopped? Changed? Avoided?? "

Are you kidding me? Lodi has never had the "lovable feel" that you are taiking about.
Perhaps if you drink enough zinfandel wine and squint your eyes, perhaps you might be able to convience yourself and then your Irish a$$ might get that feeling! LOL "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 8:54 AM:

" Zinfandel wrote "Lodian wrote: livable lovable Lodi

Yeah right, Livable lovable Lodi, my Irish a$$!!!"

Zin: Yep, from one Irish a$$ to another (LOL!) we are losing that livable lovable feel and fast. Can it be helped? Stopped? Changed? Avoided?? "

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Zinfandel wrote on Sep 8, 2008 6:16 AM:

" Lodian wrote: livable lovable Lodi

Yeah right, Livable lovable Lodi, my Irish a$$!!! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 12:46 AM:

" Whew... I'm tired. Till tomorrow... Night "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 12:43 AM:

" continued...

-degrading visual,aesthetic character of our community.-Opinion based on bias.

***Opinion? Perhaps...but Lodians have enjoyed this small town charm of livable lovable Lodi and most would like to keep that small town charm even in growth. We don't have to grow ugly and dumpy. We can grow healthy, beautiful and with character.

-weakens sense of community.-Subjective

***SWM's are not known to promote a sense of community in aesthetics, design,connection-or-attitude.

-negative impact on our quality of life in our charming livable lovable Lodi - Subjective

***Has Lodi not tried to hold onto that small town charm. Lodi has promoted this to visitors in hopes they will come on out to enjoy this little town, wine and all it's charms. A SWM just doesn't fit the bill in those terms. As a Lodian myself, I don't see a SWM as charming. Do you?

-a huge inbalance created by a new Super Wal-Mart with desires to monopolize.-Paranoia.

***From what I understand, these WM/SWM's are swallowing up towns all across the US. They drive local business out and WM/SWM starts to become the only gig in town. I want choice/variety, not-a-monopoly-where-I-then-have-drive-out-of-town-just-to-NOT-go-to-a-Wal-Mart. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 8, 2008 12:18 AM:

" falcon:My-response...

-crime - growth brings crime

***Unhealthy, unwise, hasty growth brings more crime

-traffic - growth brings traffic

***Unhealthy growth, like this SWM, will bring too much too soon. Something we can't handle.

-large vacated empty stores left behind

***Yes, empty buildings left across the entire

-poorly maintained oversized monstrosity (dump) - they will get filled.

***How do you figure? Across the country there are hundreds of just Wal-Marts alone that have been left empty in the wake of the new SWM. This does not include the other stores that SWM puts out of business, leaving even more empty buildings. This is a real problem.

-excessive need of services (police, fire, infrastructure etc) growth pays for it in taxes and fees, and fire.. come on.

***No, these needs can be in excess.

-RV park allowed in parking lot (a peeve) - They park everywhere.

***We should not have an RV park service for overnighters in a store parking lot.

continued... "

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Scrutiny wrote on Sep 7, 2008 8:34 PM:

" Hey T & C!!! You do realize that there`s like 4-5 NON-union stores ALREADY in Lodi don`t you???? Try Apple Market, try Rancho San Miguel!! Try Smart n Final on Lodi Ave!!! Buy for Less on Lockeford is still open I believe!! Food for Less is also I believe, NON- UNION!!!! If you hate unions, start with the biggest ones!!! Start hating on the police and fire Departments!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "

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falcon wrote on Sep 7, 2008 8:11 PM:

" Lodian, You know what else brings crime? A weak economy. People not having enough money to survive. Wal-Mart enables people to survive on less. What about the people that need to survive on less Lodian? Are you telling them to screw off? Flap Flap Flap... The falcon gains altitude. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 7, 2008 8:05 PM:

" Lodian,

-crime - growth brings crime
-traffic - growth brings traffic
-large vacated empty stores left behind
-poorly maintained oversized monstrosity (dump) - they will get filled.
-excessive need of services (police, fire, infrastructure etc) growth pays for it in taxes and fees, and fire.. come on.
-RV park allowed in parking lot (a peeve) - They park everywhere.
-degrading visual, aesthetic character of our community. Opinion based on bias.
-weakens sense of community. Subjective
-negative impact on our quality of life in our charming livable lovable Lodi - Subjective
-a huge inbalance created by a new Super Wal-Mart with desires to monopolize " Paranoia. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 7, 2008 8:00 PM:

" Lodian, the falcon will not crap on you unless you are intellectually dishonest. Now, I have heard the "not wanting undesirables in Lodi argument many times, on these blogs and from others in person. The crime, big monstrosity, large empty store left behind, entrance to Lodi, negative impact etc. etc. etc... have all been different arguments. The not wanting undesirables argument, at least that I have heard, was always linked to people from Stockton and Galt. If you truly meant all of the other things, and not people, then we discuss them. Even though I have heard people before. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 7, 2008 8:00 PM:

" lodian wrote, "falcon: You think an undesirable is a toothless person from Stockton. I'm not on that same page with you. The undesirables I refer to that come along with a Super-Wal-Mart are...

-crime
-traffic
-large vacated empty stores left behind
-poorly maintained oversized monstrosity (dump)
-excessive need of services (police, fire, infrastructure etc)
-RV park allowed in parking lot (a peeve)
-degrading visual, aesthetic character of our community.
-weakens sense of community
-negative impact on our quality of life in our charming livable lovable Lodi
-a huge inbalance created by a new Super Wal-Mart with desires to monopolize "

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T & C wrote on Sep 7, 2008 4:31 PM:

" Wal-Mart is a strong sense of community, by serving the community and providing many grants to the community! Another of your excuses goes flat!
degrading visual, aesthetic character of our community.
As for Quality of life, as a disabled veteran, I have a higher quality of life because the quality products I buy at Wal-Mart are less expensive then at Pennys, Target or K-Mart! Prices will always be lowered at some point at Wal-Mart, and saves customers even more! Your Quality of life excuse falls flat.
OH NO! Lodian uses the EVIL WORD "monopolize"! Guess what readers? Safeway, Raleys, and Food 4 Less have a monopoly over the cost of groceries and have been fighting tooth & Nail to keep Super Wal-Mart out of Lodi! WHY? Because they have a monopoly on groceries, vegetables and fruit prices! Super Wal-Mart will bring to Lodi, "Fair prices for similar products, and each consumer can have a "CHOICE" as to whether to shop at Super wal-mart or high priced UNION Grocery stores! Yor Monopoly excuse just "Back fired on you Lodian!"

T & C 10 points... Lodian "0"! End of story! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 7, 2008 4:23 PM:

" Lodian wrote on Sep 7, 2008 2:49 PM:

"The undesirables I refer to that come along with a Super-Wal-Mart are...

-crime
-traffic
-large vacated empty stores left behind
-poorly maintained oversized monstrosity (dump)
-excessive need of services (police, fire, infrastructure etc)
-RV park allowed in parking lot (a peeve)
-degrading visual, aesthetic character of our community.
-weakens sense of community
-negative impact on our quality of life in our charming livable lovable Lodi
-a huge inbalance created by a new Super Wal-Mart with desires to monopolize."

Lodian, I think the "HEAT " has finally gotten to you!
Crime occurs at ALL retail stores! I have seen police at Target, safeway and Pennys so, your excuse is flat! Target and safeway have high traffic as well!
If the old store is re-leased, or torn down, new retail shops will sprout! Again your excuse is flat!
Geeze, Give RV's a break! where are they to park and shop? At safeway? Give it a rest!
Defrading visual? Lord have mercy on your soul! Do you think the recycling space at Safeway is aesthetic? sorry, another excuse is flat! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 7, 2008 4:13 PM:

" "Raising the bar"... in simple terms, means "Stopping the Union run grocery chains from holding families "Hostage on HIGH FOOD prices, by interfering with FREE ENTERPRISE! We "The citizens of Lodi", have a RIGHT to shop where we want, and pay the price we are willing to pay, not pay the price we are FORCED to pay! End of Story! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 7, 2008 4:08 PM:

" Hey Lodian, "I sure hope the NEW super Wal-Mart gets 8,000 cars a day shopping Here in Lodi! GO Wal-Mart! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 7, 2008 4:06 PM:

" Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 9:47 PM:
"We get to debate and hash this out".

THERE IS NO DEBATE! The citizens of Lodi approved the new super wal-mart, END OF STORY! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 7, 2008 3:42 PM:

" Rhodie: LOL!!!! Okay... I'll remember to paint it orange for the next hunting trip. ;-) "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 7, 2008 3:09 PM:

" Oh good, Lodian. A guy in the dorm room next to me had a real racoon fur cap. It was the softest thing I ever felt. He took it out hunting once, only once, a bullet ricocheted right next to him. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 7, 2008 2:52 PM:

" Rhodie: LOL! No, I'll be okay. My "furskin cap" came from a real hunter in Oklahoma (not made in China)

It'll bite back. ;-) "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 7, 2008 2:49 PM:

" Is this healthy growth? It may be great for Wal-Mart, but not for the towns it swallows up whole.

I don't want to see Lodi sucked into this vacuum. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 7, 2008 2:49 PM:

" falcon: You think an undesirable is a toothless person from Stockton. I'm not on that same page with you. The undesirables I refer to that come along with a Super-Wal-Mart are...

-crime
-traffic
-large vacated empty stores left behind
-poorly maintained oversized monstrosity (dump)
-excessive need of services (police, fire, infrastructure etc)
-RV park allowed in parking lot (a peeve)
-degrading visual, aesthetic character of our community.
-weakens sense of community
-negative impact on our quality of life in our charming livable lovable Lodi
-a huge inbalance created by a new Super Wal-Mart with desires to monopolize

Here's an interesting note...

"If Wal-Mart grows in the next eight years as it has in the previous eight,it will control 100% of general merchandise sales in the United States; if it grows in the next 16 years as it has in the previous 16 years, it will control all of the non-auto retailing volume in the United States; if the same growth pattern for the next 24 years is like the previous 24 years, Wal-Mart will control all of the county's Gross Domestic Product."
-sprawlbusters.com

continued... "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 7, 2008 2:17 PM:

" Lodian, you better watch that furskin cap too. I've heard horror stories of falcons swooping on prey that turns out to be someone's hat on their head.

Do you think they bought them at Wal-mart or Target? "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 7, 2008 2:01 PM:

" falcon wrote "Falcon is waiting while soaring above... "

falcon: I'll answer your question, just don't crap on my head. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 7, 2008 7:20 AM:

" " Lodian wrote, "Lodi has a responsibility to grow healthy and all offerings presented will not be healthy for Lodi. We are not obligated to welcome undesirables into our town, and then take care of them as well!"

Lodian, my statement about people from Stockton was a description of the attitude that anti-Wal-Mart people have. Not a description of my attitude. Try and mask it all you want, but your words talking about "not welcoming undesirables into our town" confirms and illustrates my point.

Now lets talk about the bar! Lodian, you say "lets raise the bar." The graceful falcon that soars above is granting Lodian magic powers..Who would you place there, that provides the same goods, services, and prices that Super Wal-Mart, but only better? Falcon is waiting while soaring above... "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 7, 2008 1:02 AM:

" Can't we raise the bar? I think we, as Lodians, could and should do so much better. I'm really wondering what happened to the Lodi I grew up in all these years. I love growth, really! BUT, the right kind of growth is so very important. We are losing our Lodi charm and character. Let's try to hang on to it!!!! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 7, 2008 12:53 AM:

" falcon wrote "Then you want to turn it around and accuse me of exactly what it is that you yourself are guilty of. Prejudice against the people that shop at Wal-Mart."

falcon: Wrong again oh feathered one. To the contrary, I think shoppers deserve better than what is being proposed for our town. Lodians that enjoy the current Wal-Mart and care about their hometown deserve to be respected enough by any business to not only be offered quality products all around, but should also be delivered a clean, well kept and safe shopping experience. A store that will deliver these things as well as not cost us more than it should in city services. You see, I actually want more for Lodians, not just settle for what the Super Wal-Mart wants to dump on this town. Raise the bar, falcon. Maybe you can't see the real Super Wal-Mart for the trees from which you claim to soar. Get down here with the real people and see what is really going on. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 7, 2008 12:41 AM:

" falcon wrote "I do not hold that attitude about Stockton people, the arrogant anti-Wal-Mart people do."

falcon: You wrote the offensive remarks. Now own them. I wasn't the only one here that caught you. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 7, 2008 12:38 AM:

" Lodian wrote, "Lodi has a responsibility to grow healthy and all offerings presented will not be healthy for Lodi. We are not obligated to welcome undesirables into our town, and then take care of them as well!"

Further conformation of the mighty Falcon's assertion. Who are undesirables lodian, and what town are you referring?

FALCON FALCON FALCON. The falcon soars above with its discerning eye, ready to pounce on the anti freedom vermin and eat their brains out with his powerful beak! Good night it is getting late. Thanks lodian for the therapy. Blood pressure down now. I know that you want what you think is best for Lodi. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 7, 2008 12:30 AM:

" The fact that it is "who" and not "what" reveals your prejudice against Wal-Mart.

The whole eyesore, monstrosity argument is about what people Wal-Mart brings, not about what the concrete box building looks like. They all look about the same. It is about the people. There are 3 monstrosity big box stores with parking lots on the other 3 corners. Lodian, your eyesore argument just confirmed your prejudice against the people that shop at Wal-Mart and my earlier assertion. How your weak argument so easily confirms, that you are the one that is truly prejudice against "people that shop at Wal-Mart." People that you want to deny the choice to. Then you want to turn it around and accuse me of exactly what it is that you yourself are guilty of. Prejudice against the people that shop at Wal-Mart. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 7, 2008 12:01 AM:

" Lodian, Wal-Marts sophistication, the reason that they have been so successful, is way above your knowledge base. You do not understand the mechanics and innovation of these stores. You do not understand what they bring to the community. If you did, you would be thanking them. This whole eyesore argument is just another conjured up hoax! Eyesore my ass! You have Lowes, Target/Safeway/Food 4 Less/Penny/Wal-Mart on the other 3 corners. Do you want houses on the 4th? I can already hear your answer... No I would rather see some other store...Tell the truth, it is not what it looks like, it is who it is. It is about "who", not "what". Just be honest. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 11:51 PM:

" Lodian, If you have not heard the arrogant argument by the anti-Wal-Mart crowd touting how they do not want the Stockton trash visiting this new Lodi store, then, you are out of touch. This has been one of the many junk arguments made. Another has been that Wal-Mart screws their employees, Wal-Mart sell crap products, all bogus assertions, forwarded by unions, repeated by non thinking sheep, for the sole purpose of creating animosity against Wal-Mart.

I do not hold that attitude about Stockton people, the arrogant anti-Wal-Mart people do. Quit trying to turn around the truth about exactly what these snobs believe and what I believe. I am not the one that wants to deny people another choice when shopping. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 11:36 PM:

" Reagrding the Lodi Wal-Mart...

http://www.sprawl-busters.com/search.php?SRCHstory=lodi%2C+ca "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 11:19 PM:

" It's great to see a win for the little guy against the mostrosity...

WAL-MART LOSES IN COURT (Turlock, CA)

"The court maintained the long-held position that cities and towns have a legitimate public purpose in regulating the size of projects within their borders. Because big box stores bring with them adverse impacts like traffic, crime, and environmental degradation, cities and towns can pass limits to protect the health, safety and welfare of local residents. It is convoluted to argue that a Wal-Mart bringing in 8,000 new car trips a day, is good for the environment---but the courts did not buy it. This court case confirms once again that size capseven narrowly writtenare legitimate uses of the zoning code, and whatever impact such codes have on competition is not the issue. If a public purpose, such as protecting the character and plan of development of a community is at stake, a community can adopt a code to prevent such adverse impacts, and even a company as litigious as Wal-Mart cannot trample on those local police powers."

-- http://www.sprawl-busters.com/search.php?readstory=2318 "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 10:10 PM:

" falcon wrote "Mikemcm, You have mistaken what I meant."

falcon: Oh, really?

falcon wrote: "If they are missing teeth, you can tell them to go back to Stockton."

Oh, sure, falcon. Tell us more about how you feel regarding Stockton residents. You are now backpedaling now just because you got caught. Sad. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 10:04 PM:

" T & C wrote "WE THE PEOPLE voted to approve the super wal-mart!"

T & C: No, we did not vote for a Super Wal-Mart store.

Lodi has a responsibility to grow healthy and all offerings presented will not be healthy for Lodi. We are not obligated to welcome undesirables into our town, and then take care of them as well! Nope, you are wrong. Lodi has a responsibility to its citizens to be careful, responsible and wise in planning and in business. It needs to be what is best for livable lovable Lodi, not just what you desire for yourself personally. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 9:56 PM:

" falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 2:15 PM:

" So, let me get this straight, lodian wants the citizens of Lodi to vote to approve or deny a legal business (that is already here) the opportunity to move to another location in Lodi."

Don't be dim. You know all too well that a Super Wal-Mart is a completely different animal than our current Wal-Mart store. Maybe you need to catch up a little more. If the store was exactly the same there would not have been a vote put forth to the citizens of Lodi. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 9:52 PM:

" falcon wrote "...you can stand at the door and tell them who can shop there. If they dont look right to your satisfaction, they you can turn them away. If they are missing teeth, you can tell them to go back to Stockton."

falcon: If you can't see the problem with what you wrote here then I am afraid I can't help you. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 9:48 PM:

" classof72 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 7:46 AM:

" Stating that the comparison of Lodi to Stockton is like comparing apples to oranges seems odd; if Lodi attempts to have a Super WalMart (like Stockton), lots of new home subdivisions (like Stockton), extended city boundaries (like Stockton), and other urban/suburban amenities (like Stockton), then it appears we are comparing apples to apples... "


Well said, classof72. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 9:47 PM:

" T & C wrote "Always the "Whiner" Lodian, because WE THE PEOPLE voted to approve the super wal-mart!"

Poor, T & C. Always trying to figure it all out. I am no more a whiner than you. It's always funny when someone calls another a name that they should hold themselves. It's interesting that you'd like me to stop "whining" (as you say) and let whatever happen here in Lodi just happen. Yet, aren't you the one whining, I mean complaining and pointing out, that Wal-Mart should be allowed to build in Lodi? There's two sides to an issue (sometimes more) and YOU are not the only one that gets to be heard. Sorry pal. It looks like you think it's okay to voice your opinion and feel all others should just shut it down. Hmmm, that's not the way it works here in America. We get to debate and hash this out. You can call the opposing view to your stand on this issue a "whine" all you like. I can do the same. Thank GOD we live in America! "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 5:32 PM:

" Mikemcm, You have mistaken what I meant. That is one of the arguments that I have heard against Wal-Mart. "We do not want those raunchy Stockton people in our town." Not my words or thoughts, but those of the prejudiced anti Wal-Mart crowd. I think that argument is pathetic. This is the arrogance of those people.

"Do we really want Stockton people shopping in Lodi" is another argument by the arrogant. I have heard it. This is not how I think. "

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mikemcm wrote on Sep 6, 2008 5:22 PM:

" As a Gen. Contractor I often work in Lodi but moved to Stockton many years ago. I have always considered Lodi one of the nicer small cities of our area. Generally decent folk and a pleasent place to work. But, we all have the occassional embaressments who so like to here themselves they have a mouth-movement and smell things up. We have our share and they're in every town. What does hating on Stockton as "Falcon" does with his suggestion that "Lodian" send those "missing teeth back to Stockton" have to add to the debate over Wal-mart or no Wal-Mart" Please leave Stockton out of your mouth if you can't muster a better argument. To the better part of Lodi, good luck with your fight to preserve what you have. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 5:18 PM:

" Your welcome T & C, thank you for standing up for free enterprise. Thank you for rejecting business prejudice. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 5:16 PM:

" Yes, If you choose not to go there fine, but do not restrict my choice based upon your subjective prejudices. "

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T & C wrote on Sep 6, 2008 5:15 PM:

" Thank you falcon for seeing things as they are, not by wearing rose colored glasses and pretending. Let's get on with building Super Wal-Mart! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 6, 2008 5:12 PM:

" Always the "Whiner" Lodian, because WE THE PEOPLE voted to approve the super wal-mart! That must have ruined your day, huh? Now, after all this time you still are whining! The answer is to not shop there Lodian and you will have a better day! Allow others to choose if they wish to shop at the super wal-mart! Free enterprise is the foundation of America, not "Being held hostage by Union run high priced grocery stores! You know which ones I am talking about! "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 2:15 PM:

" So, let me get this straight, lodian wants the citizens of Lodi to vote to approve or deny a legal business (that is already here) the opportunity to move to another location in Lodi. On what basis? Just because they are Wal-Mart? Talk about prejudice. And why Wal-Mart? What if Rayley's wants to move? Fill in the blank. What about Smart and Final? Should the citizens vote on all stores? "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 2:03 PM:

" lodian wrote, falcon: Wow, you are really prejudiced against the less fortunate. Shame on you. "

??????? How in the hell did you come up with that? Can you explain how you derived this? Are you reading the same blog? Do you have me confused with someone else? Please connect the dots for me. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 12:07 PM:

" I think that if the vote, that is now allowing this dumpy monstrosity into our town, was put forth better in the first place then we wouldn't be discussing this thing. The voters wouldnt have approved it. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 12:04 PM:

" falcon: Wow, you are really prejudiced against the less fortunate. Shame on you. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 10:43 AM:

" I know that I am dreaming. That would be justice. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 10:42 AM:

" Is there an attorney out there in Blog land that can tell me if a case could be made for a class action lawsuit, against the obstructionists on behalf of all of the people that have lost money because wal-mart has been delayed? Citizens who shop at Wal-Mart have not been able to save because they have been denied access to cheaper Wal-Mart products by agents of predatory competitors and unions. Justice would be to account the loss to the community in savings and recover it from the obstructionists. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 10:34 AM:

" lodian wrote, "Personally, I just don't want this dumpy monstrosity in Lodi. There is no benefit to it and it will only cost us money and headaches... and it's a big fat eyesore too.

Fortunately you do not speak for everyone. The free market speaks for everyone. The free market should speak for everyone. Your conclusion that "There is no benefit to it and it will only cost us money and headaches" is myopic. Once again, you are speaking for others. There obviously is a benefit to it and that is why people shop there. It saves people money and therefore reduces financial headaches.

It allows people with less money to have the same things as people with more money. The products are not all crap as you suggest either. Many of their products are the same products that are on the shelves of other stores. TV's Computers, Cameras, Batteries. Blanket condemnation of Wal-Mart products is intellectually dishonest. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 10:22 AM:

" Lodian, maybe you should set up a wal-mart clean store, helpful people, no crappy products oversight committee that goes into walmart and tells them what to do. Then you can stand at the door and tell them who can shop there. If they dont look right to your satisfaction, they you can turn them away. If they are missing teeth, you can tell them to go back to Stockton. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 9:32 AM:

" T & C wrote "Its sad a bloggers log-in name upsets you so much."

T & C: No, it's nasty thieving bloggers with no character that is annoying. Oh, might that be you? LOL! Geez, give the lies a rest. If you have to lie about a darned blog name then you sure as hell will lie about the bigger issues, so go ahead and continue on as we all know the score with you, "L". "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 9:28 AM:

" T & C: Nope, I don't drink Starbucks chuck. It's overpriced motor oil with a truckload of sugar added. NOOOO THANKS! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 6, 2008 9:25 AM:

" Falcon wrote "If wal mart was unionized, the extortion would end. It would go away."

Falcon: Would the store then be cleaner (not a dump), better staffed with helpful/knowledgeable employees, more quality products and groceries that aren't science projects by the time you get them home? Hmmm, maybe union is not so bad. Personally, I just don't want this dumpy monstrosity in Lodi. There is no benefit to it and it will only cost us money and headaches... and it's a big fat eyesore too. If you can make all the bad stuff go away with a union then that's fine. If you can make all the bad stuff go away without a union then that's fine. Just make the bad stuff go away...far far away from Lodi. "

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T & C wrote on Sep 6, 2008 8:00 AM:

" Well Lodian.... Please ask tc, T&C, TANDC, pattin1, edumacation and all of his aka log names the same question: "Can't you come up with a personality of your own"? One log-in name is all that is necessary, and since day #1 of the registration requirement, I have only used ONE Log in name! Its sad a bloggers log-in name upsets you so much. I will leave a free Starbucks coffee coupon at the counter for you. "

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T & C wrote on Sep 6, 2008 7:56 AM:

" Grocery store UNION CHAINS are "HUGE" on "Protectionism"!They would love to keep their HIGH PRICES the only GAME in town! Its called Excessive profits at our expense! "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 7:32 AM:

" Good call Observer. Zoning is Zoning. It is not an issue of where any more. It is an issue of who. The round peg fits in the round hole. There is a round hole available on the board. One of the players in the game has a round peg, but another player tells him he cant use it.

Unfair. "

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falcon wrote on Sep 6, 2008 7:19 AM:

" Ahhh another soul drank the anti-wal mart communist cool aid! Bahhhh Bahhhh.. Sheep! That is what all of you wal mart haters are! Sheep! Non thinking, economically inept, cool aid drinking sheep. The unions have told you that "the bad people are coming." The frenzied catastrophic cliche's from the wal mart watch play book have suggested your ideas. Why dont we just admit a truism. If wal mart was unionized, the extortion would end. It would go away. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 5, 2008 8:31 PM:

" Observer: So, is that T & C or T&C? "

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Observer wrote on Sep 5, 2008 8:13 PM:

" They would have to be violating the law or zoning ordinance. This is no different than free speech. There are a lot of people that say things that personally offend me but I believe they have the right to say it. Hey, there are blogger on this site that offend me but they have every right to be here if they don't violate the rules that have been set. Example, my good friend t&c. ;-) "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 5, 2008 7:09 PM:

" Observer: How bad would a Super Wal-Mart have to get/be before you would not be pleased to have the dumpy monstrosity in your town? "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 5, 2008 7:00 PM:

" T & C: Sure, you just pulled that name out of a hat and SUPRISE it was the exact same name of a long time poster. Sure, ya right. I know you don't really believe that so why do you expect the rest of us to swallow that lie. We know the truth. Whatever, we've all known what you are about from the very beginning. Go ahead and keep lying. We know your routine. I bet you were the one that kept posting as Lodian before the log-in system. Can't you come up with a personality of your own? Geez... what a big fat "L" (place an "L" on your forehead) "

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Observer wrote on Sep 5, 2008 5:09 PM:

" My issue with Walmart has never been about, cleanliness, prices, product lines, etc. It's about competitiveness and free enterprise. If a business meets the zoning requirements then how does government pick and choose who should be allowed? I also believe it is a form of protectionism. When I was in business I would have loved to be the only game in town. Where do you draw the line? To me it's a much bigger issue than Walmart. "

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T & C wrote on Sep 5, 2008 4:53 PM:

" There were "NO" lies Lodian! Each of us was FREE to choose ANY of 1 MILLION possible combinations of words, names or phrases, such as T & C, "IF and ONLY IF" that name was not taken! T & C was not taken, thus it was Free for anyone to use as a log-in name. No one, I repeat "NO ONE" had EXCLUSIVE rights to use the log-in name I chose! If they had such a right, Lodian, I submit they should have reserved it before me. End of Story! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 5, 2008 3:36 PM:

" T & C wrote "I simply chose a user log-in name, just as you and every other blogger did when they registered!"

T & C: Oh sure, you are so innocent. NOT! Stop lying. You know good and well that your stolen blog name was that of another for a very VERY long time. The day came along when we could all log in with registered blog names and you swooped in and snatched that name of another poster named, T & C. It's not like that name is common, ya know, like "LODIAN" or something. Stop the lies. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 5, 2008 3:31 PM:

" T & C wrote "How about this idea fellowBloggers:
"You shop where you want, and I will shop where I want and let the Super Wal-Mart come to Lodi!" I will be happy, you will be happy and its a Win-Win situation? How about it? "

T & C: Nope, won't cut it. You still get above and beyond what you want and we in turn must suffer this dumpy monstrosity that is the Super Wal-Mart. We also have the pay the price for this thing.

How about this... You shop at the Wal-Mart that is already here in Lodi for your Wal-Mart loving pleasure and the rest of us can continue to shop at our favorite stores. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 5, 2008 3:27 PM:

" T & C: Regarding Wal-Mart shoppers... some people have different standards regarding quality, price, cleanliness, service and value. Or maybe it's just that they have more tolerance for the lack of such things. In my opinion, Wal-Mart is below standards on all of the aforementioned. "

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T & C wrote on Sep 5, 2008 2:11 PM:

" Rhodie, I sure agree it will be nice to enter the cooler part of 2008. Until then, may you always have the Delta cool breeze beside you and a cold drink in your hand! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 5, 2008 2:07 PM:

" Lodian wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:15 AM:

" Rhodie: Here's one for your mental notes... "T & C" is the blog name thief that stole a long time blogger's handle in retaliation as he never agrees with the original T & C. (notice the spaces between the letters)!

Here's a NEWS Flash Lodian:

When LNS switched to a user name registration format, anyone could choose a user name, ANYONE! There was no theft, no crime! I simply chose a user log-in name, just as you and every other blogger did when they registered! I hold no grudge against tc, T&C, TandC, patton1, edumacation or any other blog name he chooses! I have the right to disagree with anyone in a forum as long as I explain the basis for my disagreement, or agreement! It seems to me it is he, not I that is throwing the temper tantrum over his failure to register T & C, before me. "You snooze, you lose! He will in time Lodian, "Get over it"! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 5, 2008 2:02 PM:

" I fully believe that if someone is happy shopping at a particular store for groceries, like Food 4 Less, that they will still remain a loyal customer, UNLESS shopping at Super wal-Mart will in comapring product, product size and product price, they see they will save more then just a couple of $$$!

How about this idea fellowBloggers:
"You shop where you want, and I will shop where I want and let the Super Wal-Mart come to Lodi!" I will be happy, you will be happy and its a Win-Win situation? How about it? "

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T & C wrote on Sep 5, 2008 1:59 PM:

" Lodian... Please answer this all important question that ALL Wal-Mart haters ask themselves at some point: "If wal-Mart is so evil, so poor quality, to much spoiled meats, veggies, and just down right BAD...."Why is the parking lot always full of customers"? One would think, using your rationale, Lodian, that "ONCE customers saw how terrible Wal-Mart was, that they would IMMEDIATELY STOP shopping at Wal-Mart, and head in "HERDS" to all the other retail stores, large and small!" My rationale is simple and to the point: "I love Wal-mart. I like stretching my $$$$ without sacrificing quality! If I can find a better price for the same thing, sure I will shop elsewhere! Value, customer service and satisfaction if I am "Unsatisfied" will always keep me a Wal-Mart Customer. OH, by the way Lodian, "If and when the Super Wal-Mart comes to Lodi, I intend for now, to grocery shop at Food 4 Less, and if a special is on, at S-Mart, Raley's, or Safeway! "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 5, 2008 12:24 PM:

" I've noticed a turf war for all the various incarnations of T&C.

I agree with the Target for the Milk and yogurt things. Their drinks and lunch snacks are a better price than where I've found else where as well. When we're runnign low I'll plan a bike ride down there or swing by after a couple other stops.

Saide note sort of related. Can't wait for it to cool down so I don't sweat so much riding around town. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:15 AM:

" Rhodie: Here's one for your mental notes... "T & C" is the blog name thief that stole a long time blogger's handle in retaliation as he never agrees with the original T & C. (notice the spaces between the letters)

It's just one big soap opera around here. LOL! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 5, 2008 10:11 AM:

" T & C: Top o' the morning to you!

T & C wrote "Readers please do not follow Lodian's advice and shop at TARGET! "Target has no Grocery & Produce section"!"

You may certainly shop at Target for whatever the Wal-Mart across the street offers. Target has a small grocery area, if that's what you are after. It does make it easy to pick up a gal of milk, cereal, butter and bread when in for a quick stop. I find Target's prices to be better as well. My personal choice.

It's a matter of opinion regarding meat and produce at a grocery store. Some expect-higher-quality-in-their-food.

It is widely known that Super Wal-Mart ends up being a dump. I don't want a dump, like a Super Wal-Mart, in Lodi. I tend to have higher standards for what I'd like to see join us in our livable lovable town. If you want to lower your standards, and I think the food you put in your mouth should be at the top of your standards list, then by all means go shop for crap. Just don't ask Lodians to pay for it and deal with-the-monstrosity-in-our-nice-town. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 5, 2008 8:57 AM:

" How about I just use postits and stick them to the window? Then I can block out the sun a little and keep the glare off the screen. "

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T & C wrote on Sep 5, 2008 8:14 AM:

" Good Morning Rhodie:

I am against you making a notebook to track everyone's comments! Why? T&C, tc, TC, TandC, patton1, edmacation and all his other blog names would drive you crazy, lol! Plus, it would make it look like you had "Way" too much time on your hands. Stick with what you are doing, Have a great friday! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 5, 2008 8:10 AM:

" Good Morning Lodian:

Sorry but its just one more "SCARE TACTIC presented in this forum! Here is the bottom line in a nutshell, so "Please read carefully"!

Those who want to pay higher prices for groceries, please shop anywhere but Super Wal-Mart! Those who want good quality, decent prices, please shop at Super Wal-Mart! There isn't any grocery store that doesn't have a vegetable employee, who inspects their produce to ensure that "Wilting" fruits and Veggies are removed! If all the "WHINERS" against Wal-Mart would simply boycott Wal-Mart and let the rest of us save money and enjoy quality produce, EVERYONE would be happy! As for the "Bad produce you supposedly bought, Lodian, all I can say is this:
Readers please do not follow Lodian's advice and shop at TARGET! "Target has no Grocery & Produce section"! "

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classof72 wrote on Sep 5, 2008 7:46 AM:

" Stating that the comparison of Lodi to Stockton is like comparing apples to oranges seems odd; if Lodi attempts to have a Super WalMart (like Stockton), lots of new home subdivisions (like Stockton), extended city boundaries (like Stockton), and other urban/suburban amenities (like Stockton), then it appears we are comparing apples to apples... "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 4, 2008 5:09 PM:

" Rhodie: Yes, that would be crazy! LOL! "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 4, 2008 1:25 PM:

" Ya know Lodian, I just realized your confusion over my kids question. It wasn't til I was reading the new Elkhorn letter that I connected you with the comments about your child having bad experiences at the school. Had I remembered I would have skipped the question. Sorry about that.

I need to get a note book and start bios for the people who post here so I can keep straight who I'm talking to. Or does that sound crazy? "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 4, 2008 10:50 AM:

" No Lodian, you didn't change my mind. I still think the Walmart will be a huge benifit to people who like/need the advantages of one stop shopping. I'll try it out for a few trips when the store is open. Like everything else it comes down to the bottom line. If their food is of equal quality to what I get now but cheaper, I buy there. If it is a lower quality or more expensive I buy else where.
I just realize the futility of the discussion. I know you are fixed on your opinion and I am fixed on mine. There are so many other fun topics that are much more interesting to discuss than the potential evil of an American Franchise business model vs small town feel.
At least we agree on family fitness issues. I've seen people drive from food4less to walmart and Safeway to Target. I hate it when I see a family mobile sit and wait for that one car to back up close to the enterance so they can save a few steps. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 4, 2008 9:14 AM:

" T & C wrote "Anything in Stockton cannot be compared to Lodi! Stockton and Lodi are like apples and oranges."

T & C: I disagree. This Lodi store will be on the south end of town, not far from Stockton. I imagine this Lodi store will have the same look and feel of the Stockton store. Just look at the current Lodi Wal-Mart. It's not much different than the Stockton store now. About 99% of all the Wal-Mart's I've ever seen are dumps. IMO "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 4, 2008 9:08 AM:

" T & C wrote "When I read the comment; "Wal_Mart's "fresh" groceries never last" I spit out my coffee! Here is a News Flash! Fresh groceries in any grocery store DO NOT LAST! Fresh fruits and veggies will all spoil!"

T & C: Stop playing the dimwit! ;-)

The comment read "Wal_Mart's "fresh" groceries never last. The meat turns brown too soon and the fruit had mold on it when I got home. Gross!"

T & C: Notice I had "fresh" in quotes for a reason. Again, Wal-Mart's SO CALLED "fresh" food lasts only till it gets to ones house after shopping and that's about it. Come on, you can't tell me that you are having trouble understanding this comment? (chuckle) Or maybe you have experienced this disappointment yourself.

You'd better go get that coffee stain treated. "

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T & C wrote on Sep 4, 2008 6:58 AM:

" When I read the comment; "Wal_Mart's "fresh" groceries never last" I spit out my coffee! Here is a News Flash! Fresh groceries in any grocery store DO NOT LAST! Fresh fruits and veggies will all spoil! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 4, 2008 6:55 AM:

" Good Morning Lodian: Anything in Stockton cannot be compared to Lodi! Stockton and Lodi are like apples and oranges. "

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T & C wrote on Sep 4, 2008 6:53 AM:

" Shouldn't this article be titled; "Weighing the pros and cons "? "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 4, 2008 12:16 AM:

" Rhodie: Fitness should be a family attitude. Not having to park as close as possible to the store entrance so some walking can be done is a positive step. Don't cut back on "moving". Running errands is a good chance to show ones kids that it's okay to walk a little to get to where you need to go. There's too many short cuts going on these days and that's why there're so many overweight kids. They are following suit. Drive-thru dinners and taking advantage of every convenience so people do NOT have to move the body is killing them, literally. Also, I firmly believe that the crap one puts in their body makes the difference. Bad food = sick people. This means healthy meat and produce too, not just buying as cheap as we can. Really, the food that is better for you is not all that much more expensive. I think it's just an excuse people use as a crutch because it's very hard to get fit once out of shape.

So, why the turn around with you on this Super Wal-Mart issue? Don't tell me that my opinions actually had an impact on you. ;-) "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:31 PM:

" I don't mind disagreeing with any of y'all. Even when it gets heated but I do hope that at the end of it we can move on to the next issue and maybe find that we agree on that one. For me it's much more fun to find the things we have in common than the differences. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:30 PM:

" Hey Lodian how about encouraging fitness amoung kids?

I'm a head coach for one soccer team and an assistant coach for another. More than half the kids on the oldest's team are over weight and can't even do the simplest of excercises. Of course not even the "thin" kids can do a series of crunches and only two of them can do a real push up. What ever happened to the physical fitness programs in schools?

Every night I'm getting the kids out and having them do two or three excercises. Especially during sports shows, that's when they are motivated. Their favorite is a torture device my daddy used on me. A rod with a string down to a full water bottle. They have to twist the rod with their hands only up and down several times. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 7:32 PM:

" Rhodie (re: Sep 3rd post @ 2:43pm): If you would like to swap parenting tips and strategies just ask. Don't use this Wal-Mart issue as your backdrop. It's simply ridiculous. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 7:28 PM:

" Bob Loblaw wrote on Sep 3, 2008 3:38 PM:

" Rhodie needs to call Nanny 911 "

Yes, maybe she can help. ;-) "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 7:27 PM:

" Rhodie: So basically you are saying that everything else you stated earlier here and complained about, and the serious desires and needs you have for this Super Wal-Mart, are no longer an issue? That's really weird. So, what changed your mind? What happened? Did the kids grow up and leave the house overnight? Did you suddenly see the light as to how much you really don't need this new SWM? Or did you just wake up from a long nap, Rumpelstiltskin?? What is it? "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 7:21 PM:

" Observer wrote "All right Lodian and Rhodie. I'm going to separate you two."

Observer: I enjoyed a big belly laugh after reading that one! Thanks. :-) "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 3:58 PM:

" "Do you go to a restaurant after your friend told you the food was bad?"

Funny you should mention this. I just found out an ex girlfriend and her hubby bought a restraunt in my hometown to the south. They have the reputation of having the best pizza in town.

I may have to go in and harass them. "

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SportsGuru wrote on Sep 3, 2008 3:48 PM:

" Why is it that Lodi cannot wait to have a Supercenter when other towns don't want them?

If other towns don't want them, how do they continue to operate at a profit in those towns? The answer: ENOUGH people want them to keep them in operation, otherwise they would close (Economics 101).

Do you go to a restaurant after your friend told you the food was bad?

No..which illustrates my point below. Although there is a vocal group that does not want a Walmart SS, there are enough supporters to keep it in business (e.g. enough people saying the food was good) "

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SportsGuru wrote on Sep 3, 2008 3:45 PM:

" .
I cannot understand how the Supercenter will add sales tax revenue to Lodi.

In town shoppers who are TODAY going to the Walmart SS in Stockton - or Costco - will be able to keep their tax dollars in Lodi. Out of town buyers looking for one-stop shopping will be attracted to Lodi via I-5, generating more tax dollars. "

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Bob Loblaw wrote on Sep 3, 2008 3:38 PM:

" Rhodie needs to call Nanny 911 "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 2:43 PM:

" So we establish we have kids in common. Are you the one that takes them shopping with you everytime? This is to establish a frequency issue. My wife rarely takes the kids anywhere on her own, she just can't handle them. If we need to go shopping I take them or we go as a family.

You say when they are having a bad day you don't take them to Walmart. How about other stores? You're out of what you need for dinner and you kids are in a nasty mood. Do you skip the dinner or take them out?

And as a parent you must know that kids may not start with the moodiness until you get in the store. There it is not a matter of not taking them but becomes a matter of get them out as quick as you can. "

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Observer wrote on Sep 3, 2008 2:40 PM:

" All right Lodian and Rhodie. I'm going to separate you two. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 2:38 PM:

" Rhodie: I didn't answer this "question" because it seemed rhetorical and flip to me and if you were serious then frankly it's none of your business. BUT to humor you... yes, I have children. When they've had a bad day I don't drag them to Wal-Mart. I wish you would do the same. "

I wasn't trying to be flip with the question. I was just curious how much experience you have pulling three kids of various ages from the car several times a day for errands. For eight years everything I've done has been with at least one kid in tow. My choices were one to three kids with me or shop after all the kids went to sleep but then most of the stores were closed. Now, for the first time I can shop without the kids and it is a whole new world. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 2:34 PM:

" Wasn't trying to dumb it down, I was trying to establish a baseline. If you shop there once a year then you have limited exposure to what it is really like. If you shop there once a month then you have a better understanding of the store and it's situation. If you shop there once week then you confuse me. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 2:18 PM:

" Rhodie wrote "You mention the Stockton Walmart, repeatedly. How often are you going in there? If you hate it so much why do you go back?"

Rhodie: Really! Please don't dummy down your posts. I've seen you be much more articulate and comprehensive than this shows. Please make more of an effort and don't insult me with this crap. If I posted in regards to the Stockton store 100 times does that mean I have shopped there 100 times? Come on now, Rhodie! Bring it up a notch or two. Did you shop at Wal-Mart today? That can have an effect on your brain. Be careful! LOL!

Gotta run... "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 2:13 PM:

" Wow!

I don't have time to respond to all of that now, but I shall return. :-)

Here's one for the road...

Rhodie wrote "I notice you skipped right over my question as well Lodian: Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 8:08 AM:
" Lodian, do you currently have kids? Have you ever been out when one or more of them are having a bad day?" "

Rhodie: I didn't answer this "question" because it seemed rhetorical and flip to me and if you were serious then frankly it's none of your business. BUT to humor you... yes, I have children. When they've had a bad day I don't drag them to Wal-Mart. I wish you would do the same. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:56 PM:

" I could careless about a Super Walmart there, actually would prefer a couple dozen other options. But it is coming. If you don't like it vote with your dollars and never shop there.
You mention the Stockton Walmart, repeatedly. How often are you going in there? If you hate it so much why do you go back?
There have been several store, other establishments or products I WON'T use specifically because I find commercials or behaviors objectionable.
Burger King, Jake in the Box, Axe (anything from them), any Credit card company, Wells Fargo, and Washington Mutual just to name a few. I don't fill boards with broad generalizations about them. If someone loves those places fine, but I'll spend my money else where.
And how's this for irony. You are all for a person's right to marry who ever they want but not for them to shop where they want. A lot of people in Lodi want to shop at the SuperWalmart but since you find it objectionable you try to force your opinion on them and would stop this shopping plaze from opening if you could, because YOU don't like walmart. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:46 PM:

" "And if you'd rather see all the other businesses in there that you just mentioned what will that do to your errand issues?"

It won't do much for or against me. With all the kids in school I like getting out of the house and seeing more of the town. But I do sympathize with the single )mother (or house mom) of three who has to drag all the kids to every store because YOU say she has too. Two weeks ago I was getting the grocieries and there was a mom with five kids from 5yrold to infant. Two of the kids were fighting and one was crying while she tried to pay for her food and go. What if the car need an oil change still? Perscriptions picked up? Clothes for the kids that are always growing? In your solution she would still have to drag them to several locations. Because tomorrow may be even busier or the kids in more of a mood. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:37 PM:

" If the quality of grocieries is higher will you shop at the superwalmart?

I notice you skipped right over my question as well Lodian: Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 8:08 AM:
" Lodian, do you currently have kids? Have you ever been out when one or more of them are having a bad day?" "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:35 PM:

" "What will you need to buy in one stop at a Super Wal-Mart that you cannot buy in the already existing Wal-Mart and Sunwest Plaza area?"

IS this the question you refer too?
How's this. I shopped at Food4Less for over a year. Their produce was little more than a crap shoot as to how good it was. The few times I bought ribs there it was more fat than meat, the steaks would make better soles for my shoes and the breads were usually going stale. So what I cannot get from the current shopping center is decent grocieries. In MY experience the food at Walmart was fresher than what I see at F4L. Of course I concede this is up to the managers to maintain and the buyers to keep fresh. If their quality is low I'll go back to the store I shop at now.

I also can't have oil changed there, auto repairs done there. Don't know, is there a photography studio in this Walmart? The electronics selection is tiny, I'm assuming a superwalmart would have a bigger selection of everything with more room. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:25 PM:

" Rhodie wrote "So what would you put in there?"

Not a Super wal-Mart.

And if you'd rather see all the other businesses in there that you just mentioned what will that do to your errand issues? "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:23 PM:

" Rhodie wrote "Is it a dump because it is a Walmart or because of the location?"

Wal-Mart. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:22 PM:

" Rhodie: Will you soon be answering my question? :-) "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:22 PM:

" Rhodie wrote "Except it doesn't have a full selection of grocieries."

Then walk a couple doors down. No driving necessary. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:20 PM:

" Rhodie: No offense, but the store attracts those kinds of people. Do you really think this Lodi store will only have Lodi customers? Really? Look at the store we have now... a dump. Wal-Mart doesn't take care of things. I think it used to be better years ago when Walton was around, but now most of these stores are trashy. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:13 PM:

" "we already have a Wal-Mart for your endless shopping pleasure."

Except it doesn't have a full selection of grocieries.

Lodian, do you work in the retail industry? "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:11 PM:

" "Our closest example is in Stockton. Check it out. It's a dump. The surrounding area is a mess as well."

Is it a dump because it is a Walmart or because of the location?
The people who shop in the stores are the ones who make it a dump. They are the ones who throw clothes ont he ground, leave empty Starbucks in the shelves and leave the carts anywhere they want. It is the customers who dump their sodas in the parking lots, pour their ash trays in the flower beds and leave trash in the carts for the next person.

I believe Lodi is different than Stockton, especially that area of Stockton. I believe Lodi people care a little more than those who shop at the Stockton Walmart.

Are all of Stockton's hardware stores like our Lowes? Are all their Safeway's like our Safeway? Are all their Food4less like ours? Is their Kmart like ours, or their OSH, or their Walgreens? How about their movie theaters, ate they like Lodi's?

Why do you believe just theis Walmart will become like Stockton's if the rest haven;t? "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:01 PM:

" For the record what would I have rather seen go into the Super Walmart spot:

A big bookstore, Borders, B&N or such.

An electronics store, Fry's, c. City or such.

A movie theater

Some family entertainment, bowling mini golf and other family activities.

A craft store, Michael's or large Jo- annes

An indoor sports complex.

A better department store like a full size Penny's or a Sears.

Home decor stores like Bed bath and Beyond.

How about a good auto repair place on this side?

A nice Winery mall would have been fun to go to when company visits.

How about you, Lodian, what you you rather see in there? It is going to be developed. It is valuable land and in the current market sitting on land like that is financially unwise if you have bills to pay. So what would you put in there? "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 12:59 PM:

" Wal_Mart's "fresh" groceries never last. The meat turns brown too soon and the fruit had mold on it when I got home. Gross! Most of the folks they have working in the store wouldn't know what rotation means if I spun them around and tried to explain it. It's really sad. And don't try asking anyone where an item is as you'll find yourself following them through 5 isles looking for it, as they have no idea where to find it either! This has been my personal experience. And, yes, I gave it more than one try. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 12:54 PM:

" Rhodie: None of the businesses you mentioned come close in comparison to the impact of a Super Wal-Mart. There's a huge difference. And again, we already have a Wal-Mart for your endless shopping pleasure. I know you don't care much for this town and how we grow. It's just all about you and your one stop shopping for crap. I am thinking outside that box. Yes, it is important NOT to allow this town to become a dump. A Super Wal-Mart becomes a dump, period. Our closest example is in Stockton. Check it out. It's a dump. The surrounding area is a mess as well. Shouldn't healthy growth in this town be somewhere on your radar or are you just passing through and couldn't care less about Lodi?

If you think this Super Wal-Mart will be coming to you for free you are sorely mistaken...or just plain ignorant.

Will you be going back to Oregon soon? LOL!
(JK)

P.S. Again, you did not answer my question. Can't you come up with anything? Just keep ignoring it. It proves my point. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 12:42 PM:

" just_me: Is it really that hard for you to walk next door to a grocery store? No big expense in travel. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 12:42 PM:

" just_me: Isn't really that hard for you to walk next door to a grocery store? No big expense in travel. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 12:40 PM:

" just_me: All of your comments have already been addressed. Please read the posts.

You said "What I think we should all be talking about instead is the fact that Lodi needs a really good bookstore, so someone write something on that so I can read all those comments."

just_me: But then you'd have to drive to another location! Isn't that against everything you just stated? Geez, the Wal-Mart nuts are coming out in droves. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 12:34 PM:

" Lodian wrote " tandc: You're right. In my experience, Wal-Mart groceries are not so great and the prices are not less than most other stores. I was very disappointed in regards to quality, freshness, selection and customer service. "
See, in MY experience the freshness and quality was as good as the expensive chains and saved me money.

Lodian wrote " Hey Rhodie: The kids are in school. Go shopping!

I did.

Lodian wrote: "I don't care where you spend your money. Why would I? The fact is that you already have the stores here in Lodi available for what you say you need."

So there should be no more fast food chains built? No more gas stations? No more auto part stores? No more pet stores? No more schools? No more medical facilities? No more hotels? No more restraunts? No more car repair shops? No more movie theaters? No more furniture shops? All these we already have. By your statement none of these and a bunch others should not be allowed in because YOU say we have enough. "

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Just_Me wrote on Sep 3, 2008 11:15 AM:

" With the cost of everything rising every little savings helps. Be it savings in the price of items or in gas by not driving around.

I think every person that is against the Super Walmart should do 1 of the following.
1 - Be a cab for all the older or handicapped people that have a hard time getting around and help them with their multiple stops.
2 - Give out gas cards to people who are really trying to make it month to month so that driving to the multiple locations will not hurt their budget.

This way the people so against the Super Walmart will not have to look at the bug ugly building and the people who think they need it will still be ok.

What I think we should all be talking about instead is the fact that Lodi needs a really good bookstore, so someone write something on that so I can read all those comments. "

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Just_Me wrote on Sep 3, 2008 11:14 AM:

" To me all this issue is about is, putting in the Super Walmart so that some people can have an easier time shopping or do we not let it because some people who do not care for other think it is ugly.

That is the only thing I have heard in any of these comments on this story or others.

From reading all these posts some people want it for convenience and others don't want is because their poor little eyes can't take the sight. "

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just_me wrote on Sep 3, 2008 11:11 AM:

" Just to start I wanted to say that I haven't commented on here before, I have only read some comments on some stories. I do believe this story has played itself to death already. I just have one thing to say to Lodian and she may get upset but I believe she really needs to read closer to what she is commenting about and she needs to stop taking stabs at Rhodie just to make herself feel better. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:49 AM:

" Hey Rhodie: The kids are in school. Go shopping!

Also, you really need to remember that you are not in Oregon anymore. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:43 AM:

" Rhodie wrote "Sorry, you're right you didn't say "calories' you said "energy". Of course biological energy comes from calories but you are right, you didn't say calories."

WOW! Pick your battles. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:34 AM:

" tandc: You're right. In my experience, Wal-Mart groceries are not so great and the prices are not less than most other stores. I was very disappointed in regards to quality, freshness, selection and customer service. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:29 AM:

" Rhodie wrote "You never answered my ? What is it about people having another choice on where to spend their hard earned money that offends you so?"

Rhodie: Again your assumptions are great. I have said nothing of the sort in regards to caring about where you spend your money. That's just a defensive assertion on your part. I don't care where you spend your money. Why would I? The fact is that you already have the stores here in Lodi available for what you say you need. It's your choice to either shop there or not. Just because you choose not to shop at our already existing Wal-Mart doesn't mean we in Lodi need to build you a new Super Wal-Mart. WHY DO WE NEED A NEW WAL-MART?

You haven't answered my question yet. What will you need to buy in one stop at a Super Wal-Mart that you cannot buy in the already existing Wal-Mart and Sunwest Plaza area (no extra driving really-necessary)?

If you don't like the convenience of a grocery store by the existing Wal-Mart then that's your choice not to shop there. Don't ask the city of Lodi to build-you-a-new-store-due-to-your-desire-to-save-a-few-steps. "

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taNDC wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:27 AM:

" If superWalmart wants to help the economies of the towns it locates itself in, they should use at least 40% local vendors, not all Chinese. "

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taNDC wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:24 AM:

" Rhodie, Walmart will get their meats and produce from the same sources Food4Less does, the poor southern states.
Walmart refused to have fresh meats in their stores because they didn't want to be forced to be associated with the meatcutters' union and have to pay a fair wage. If you wait longer than leaving their parking lot to eat their meats and produce, it'll be rotten by the time you get home. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:04 AM:

" Rhodie wrote "Lodian, do you currently have kids? Have you ever been out when one or more of them are having a bad day? Every parent has and it is not only annoying to us but to the poor people around us who have to listen to the crying or fighting."

Rhodie: PLEASE, when your kids become unruly in the store TAKE THEM HOME! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 9:01 AM:

" Rhodie: I get the impression from your posts that you are really challenged by your children while shopping. Most mothers know what this juggling act is like. That's why I suggested online shopping. It sounds like you are quite unfamiliar with online shopping as most of us know that you wouldn't buy milk online. Educate yourself with online shopping and you might enjoy it. I've done it for years and it has worked out great for our family. This may help alleviate some of that stress you seem to be having as you run errands with all the kids in tow.

I really don't see how a new Super Wal-Mart replacing our current Wal-Mart, and the stores next door to it, will help you with your challenges. To me, it's not worth the trade off in what we will get when this monstrosity is in full swing. It will not be safer for your family. It will not be a more pleasant shopping experience. It will be huge so your concern with keeping an eye on your kids will not be reduced. In fact, in my experience, shopping at Super Wal-Mart with children in tow is quite stressful. "

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Robb wrote on Sep 3, 2008 8:27 AM:

" we shall all pray that they build it... "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 8:08 AM:

" Lodian, do you currently have kids? Have you ever been out when one or more of them are having a bad day? Every parent has and it is not only annoying to us but to the poor people around us who have to listen to the crying or fighting. How about losing track of your kids in a store? Ever done that? I haven't yet. It is one of my biggest fears as a parent. So when I am shopping with all three it is constantly making sure they are with me, getting them to behave which they do 90% of the time and trying to navigate through other consumers. I alleviate most of the stress by shopping in off times when it is easier to track everything but some trips can't be avoided.

You never answered my ? What is it about people having another choice on where to spend their hard earned money that offends you so? "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 3, 2008 8:03 AM:

" "FYI, Food for Less groceries are just like Wal-Mart groceries."

How do you know, the SuperWalmart isn't even built yet? The one I shopped at had high quality stuff at a better price. You say they are the same but my EXPERIENCE tells me grocieries are better at Walmrt than Food4less.

I wonder which I will trust more.

As for shopping on-line, milk tends to get a little moldy when ordered on line. Clothes are something we like to try on before buying. But movies, music and books we look on-line first. Unless it is an impulse we want to get kind of thing.

Lodian wrote: 9:57 pm "Your kids can burn off energy as they walk a few doors down with you."

Sorry, you're right you didn't say "calories' you said "energy". Of course biological energy comes from calories but you are right, you didn't say calories. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 1:17 AM:

" P.S. Try shopping online to reduce your errands and your stress. Kids do not need to be dragged along with you when you shop online. I'm sure they will appreciate it. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 12:59 AM:

" Rhodie: I think you have bigger issues in your life if making two stops for errands sends you into a tail spin, as you seem to be saying.

FYI, Food for Less groceries are just like Wal-Mart groceries.

So, we all have to endure a big dumpy monstrosity with more people adding to jamming up the roadway, parking their RV's and camping overnight enjoying the dump that will become of the Super Center parking lot just because you have trouble walking a few doors down to get groceries??? Sorry, Rhodie, it just doesn't wash. Oh, and again... you didn't answer the question. Can you?

The grocery complaint and the car service issue don't wash. So, what do you have left?

Again, we already have a Wal-Mart. Your issue seems to boil down to wanting to buy groceries and Wal-Mart stuff (clothes? vacuum? TV? unmentionables? LOL!) in the same store. Sorry, that's not a good enough reason for Lodi to add such a dumpy joint to our town. It's just not needed and creates more trouble and use of resources than it's worth. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 12:33 AM:

" Rhodie wrote "And no, they haven't recommended this Walmart for automotive. But then again how could they? It's not even built yet. They also haven't recommended the hotel on the moon."

Rhodie: Usually I forgive comprehension problems on these blogs due to the nature of the such a forum, but please try harder to read what I actually wrote to you.

I said "So, will all those people that recommended the mechanic in Galt also recommend Wal-Mart for your vehicle needs? I really doubt it. So, you can take that one off your list of three stops to be redirected to Wal-Mart." "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 3, 2008 12:25 AM:

" Rhodie wrote "As for the kids buring off calories, since we bike everywhere they burn off plenty of calories."

Rhodie: I never said anything about your kids burning off calories. That came from you. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 2, 2008 11:25 PM:

" "Along the way to do your grocery shopping you can even stop at the AIM mail store, Radio Shack and even JC Penney if you so desire. You seem to forget that we already have a Wal-Mart."

Is that what the big store is that says "Walmart" across the front of it is. I've been wondering. You seem to think it is already a Superwalmart with a full line of groceries for us to choose from.
AIM mail, never been in there.
Radio shack, all their electronics are over priced. Don't go there unless I'm looking for wiring or stereo parts.
JCPenny's, you're joking right? That pathetic little store? What is it, Penny's Lite. Maybe they can move over to the old Walmart's location and become a real store.
You forgot about the over priced pizza place in there.

What is it about people having another choice on where to spend their hard earned money that offends you so? It sounds like you're afraid you'll be forced to shop there. I don't think that will happen. If you want to spend more at Raley's, I'm sure they will let you. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 2, 2008 11:15 PM:

" And do I expect the new Walmart's parking lot to be safer, not really. Same people will be driving there, but I will only have to go in and out of one store then and not three which makes it three times safer.

And no, they haven't recommended this Walmart for automotive. But then again how could they? It's not even built yet. They also haven't recommended the hotel on the moon.

I've been in the Stockton SuperWalmart a couple of times. Usually when I'm down there and need something I know they carry. I much prefer to spend my money in Lodi. Aside from not knowing where things were in that store I had no problems there. Have you been to the SuperWalmart in Springfield Or? Same population, same type businesses around and similar larger city closer by. Most people from Eugene would drive the extra couple miles to shop at our Walmart because their two supercenters were dingy and dark. Are you saying that our Safeway here is like all the Safeways in Stockton? "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 2, 2008 11:06 PM:

" Lodian wrote "Then you can walk on over to Food for Less and do your grocery shopping. Your kids can burn off energy as they walk a few doors down with you."

Use to shop at Food4less, got tired of low grade meats, veggies that are soft and fruits that mold withing a couple days. Most packaged fruits from Food4less I looked at had mold before I even bought them. I never found a meat besides ground beef there I liked. Their fork lift drivers are maniacs. And their breads were usually stale. So I don't shop there any more.

As for the kids buring off calories, since we bike everywhere they burn off plenty of calories.

And the kids almost getting run over is when I am walking with them which means yes I almost get run over too. In fact the only reason they haven't been ran over is because I keep them reigned in in case drivers back up without looking. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 10:02 PM:

" Rhodie: One more thing... if you think a SUPER WAL-MART will have a safer parking lot for your children in tow you are sorely mistaken. Do you really think there will be a safety difference? I think the opposite. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 10:00 PM:

" Rhodie: Do you shop at the Stockton Super Wal-Mart? "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 9:57 PM:

" Rhodie: You jumped in here, but you haven't answered the question. Let's try it this way. Okay, you can stop at the CURRENT Wal-Mart (ya know, the one we already have in Lodi) and buy your merchandise. Then you can walk on over to Food for Less and do your grocery shopping. Your kids can burn off energy as they walk a few doors down with you. Along the way to do your grocery shopping you can even stop at the AIM mail store, Radio Shack and even JC Penney if you so desire. You seem to forget that we already have a Wal-Mart. What are you really missing? Well, besides the severe need for a babysitter. LOL!

Oh, and the other poster (Inquisitor) said he/she had 12 stops that would be avoided if we had a Super Wal-Mart. I'd really like to know what 12 stops would be eliminated by a Super Wal-Mart. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 9:50 PM:

" Rhodie wrote "I expect convienence of NOT having to drive all over town to run my errands. Especially in the summer months when I have three kids with me and every stop entails pulling them out of the car racing them through a parking lot where drivers may or may not be watching (they've already almost been hit more times in the year here than in ten years in Oregon), find a cart get what we need contain them in check out then play dodge car again."

Rhodie: OMG! You have bigger problems than reducing your errands. Get those kids in line, will ya? Geez! :-) "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 9:47 PM:

" Rhodie wrote "I'll keep going to Pepboys until i find a mechanic in town that has a decent rep., but from what I have heard there is none."

Rhodie: So, will all those people that recommended the mechanic in Galt also recommend Wal-Mart for your vehicle needs? I really doubt it. So, you can take that one off your list of three stops to be redirected to Wal-Mart. Next... "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 2, 2008 9:25 PM:

" Neo wrote on Sep 2, 2008 6:22 PM:
" So Rhodie, you`re trying to say that people are dieing in the streets because there`s no Supertrashcan in Lodi? Are you retarded? "

Trying to figure out how you came to this conclusion? Maybe I am retarded, after all I think a store that allows you to do all your shopping under one roof makes sense. I must be retarded, I think saving money is a good thing. Even more proof I'm retarded is I think market competition is good. Perhaps the best evidence of my deminished mental capacity is the fact that I'm willing to trust MY experiences with Walmart and shop there for my groceries again, which answers Tand C's ? of what's wrong with the current. There is only limited grociery selection. The one I'm use to shopping had great meats, fresh veggies that were far better than what I find here in the lower price stores. Deli was cheaper, cheese was cheaper, we could even get fresh lobster and the cereal is chearper. I saved 20-30$ PER shopping trip at WM over the Food4less type store. Money talks. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 2, 2008 9:16 PM:

" tandC wrote on Sep 2, 2008 4:35 PM:

" Rhodie, if you use PepBoys for your automotive needs, especially any work or tires in their automotive bays, you are either a female that knows nothing about cars, or a male who knows even less."

Since I moved down here I've been asking people I meet about where a good mechanic is in town and they all tell me the same thing, go to Galt. This survey ranges from young couples to old men who have lived here since the 60's and one guy who's past time is to rebuild cars himself. So I'll keep going to Pepboys until i find a mechanic in town that has a decent rep., but from what I have heard there is none. "

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TANDC wrote on Sep 2, 2008 8:47 PM:

" In my opinion, I really don't think Walmart is really serious about a supercenter in that area of Lodi, but something closer with easy access on and off Hwy. 99. There'll be one in Galt within the next 5 years right off of 99 and I think this is going to be where a new one will be in Lodi. It should be near the area that's saturated with car dealerships at least to hide those hideous, endless rows of big trucks and SUV's. "

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TANDC wrote on Sep 2, 2008 8:42 PM:

" Neo, I'll bet the old scheming ex-mayor is sweating bullets that corner lot for super Walmart goes through pretty soon. The value of that land has dropped immensely already and is sinking further daily. Maybe owner greed, again, is the big holdup. "

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Neo wrote on Sep 2, 2008 6:22 PM:

" So Rhodie, you`re trying to say that people are dieing in the streets because there`s no Supertrashcan in Lodi? Are you retarded? "

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Neo wrote on Sep 2, 2008 6:20 PM:

" Rhodie; the owners of that property KNEW well in advance they would have an EXTREMELY difficult time getting a 227,000 sq. ft. Supercenter built there yet they kept at it! I have absolutely NO sympathy for these idiots! Yes you Mr. Snider! Get over yourself! "

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tandC wrote on Sep 2, 2008 4:41 PM:

" Rhodie and T & C, what's wrong with the Walmart you have now? And that empty grass field should have water trucks keeping it damp to keep the dust down and keep it mowed. There were crops there once upon a time and, if nothing else, should have an 8 foot block wall to hide its ugliness to tourists coming into town from I-5. That's not a sight I'd like to see if coming to Lodi for a looksee. "

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tandC wrote on Sep 2, 2008 4:35 PM:

" Rhodie, if you use PepBoys for your automotive needs, especially any work or tires in their automotive bays, you are either a female that knows nothing about cars, or a male who knows even less. They hire a bunch of uncertified backyard mechanics and every two months there's a big turnover in auto "specialists", due to working on piecework conditions and commissions on every or any service they can sell you whether you need it or not. Walmart would love you in their auto bays, with their $10hour auto "techs". Good luck! "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 2, 2008 4:02 PM:

" But those of you who don't like Wal-mart are right, the Elderly should be forced to beg for their medication. College and high schools students shouldn't have jobs to learn what the real world is like. Those on budgets should be forced to pay higher prices and people who have limited mobility should be forced to struggle at three different stores because YOU don't want to shop there.

Would you prefer the dead grass field be left a dead grass field? "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 2, 2008 3:58 PM:

" All this just to do it at two other parking lots. Now, for all you who have no sympathy for parents, imagine trying to do your shopping if you had to use an electric cart. You are saying that they should have to search for this necessity at every store they go to because YOU don't want to shop at Walmart?

Before I had a super Walmart to shop at I had five stores I went to on a routine basis. After it was built I did 99% of my shopping at the one store.

As for the part time, minimum wage aspect. Walmart pays above minimum wage. They start you above minimum wage and then raises from there keep you above. It won't pay for a four bedroom house and all the fancy toys your neighbor has but it will give high schoolers some work experience, pay for the extras for a college student and help some elderly people pay for the extras their medicare doesn't. This isn't even counting the dozens of managers or the employees at the other stores and what they will make. "

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Rhodie wrote on Sep 2, 2008 3:51 PM:

" "Please share with us what 12 stores you stop at right now that you will no longer need to patronize when the Wal-Mart Super Center opens? I can't wait to hear this answer as I am anxious to know what treasures this new Wal-Malt will have that the old Wal-Mart, and surrounding stores close by, will not carry. Do tell"

Let me jump on this one. I'll just use three stores I use right now. Target, Pepboys and S-mart. Your saying that driving all over town is better than having what these three stores offer? I don't expect new and amazing merchandise from the new Walmart, I expect convienence of NOT having to drive all over town to run my errands. Especially in the summer months when I have three kids with me and every stop entails pulling them out of the car racing them through a parking lot where drivers may or may not be watching (they've already almost been hit more times in the year here than in ten years in Oregon), find a cart get what we need contain them in check out then play dodge car again. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 3:17 PM:

" Inquisitor wrote "I'd like to remind you that some people don't have the luxury of being able to drive around town, visiting a dozen different establishments in order to satisfy their shopping lists. For some, it's a necessity to have one-stop shopping."

Inquisitor: This statement always intrigues me and no one ever answers the question I put forth. Let me try again with you "Inquisitor".
Please share with us what 12 stores you stop at right now that you will no longer need to patronize when the Wal-Mart Super Center opens? I can't wait to hear this answer as I am anxious to know what treasures this new Wal-Malt will have that the old Wal-Mart, and surrounding stores close by, will not carry. Do tell! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 3:14 PM:

" oldguy: WEll said @ 2:18pm. "

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oldguy wrote on Sep 2, 2008 2:22 PM:

" /Was it a coincidence this article came out right have Pat Patrick's plea for more jobs. Patrick likes Wal Mart because it creates jobs. The kind of jobs Patrick likes--lots of minimum wage and part time jobs. You do not build an economy on Wal Mart. Wal Mart destroys a local economy. I hope this vote goes 5-0 against, but I've been on wacky tabacky to think the three amigos will vote against this. They swoon whenever Patrick speaks. "

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Observer wrote on Sep 2, 2008 2:21 PM:

" I guess when you don't have anything else to write about you can always write about Walmart to generate some interest. Give it up! "

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Inquisitor wrote on Sep 2, 2008 2:20 PM:

" I'd like to remind you that some people don't have the luxury of being able to drive around town, visiting a dozen different establishments in order to satisfy their shopping lists. For some, it's a necessity to have one-stop shopping. "

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oldguy wrote on Sep 2, 2008 2:18 PM:

" to: Bob Loblaw. We did not vote on Wal mart. I voted no on the proposition because I did not feel keeping retail under !25,000 sq. ft. is realistic. That would eliminate car dealerships and maybe even Costco and certainly WAl Mart. Please do not continue to say the voters have spoken. They have not spoken on Wal Mart. "

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trista wrote on Sep 2, 2008 1:52 PM:

" Theres a documentary (comcast users can look 'on demand' its under the 'free movies' category)its called "Wal-Mart, the high cost of low prices." Very interesting stuff on many different topics concerning Wal-Mart; all the businesses that have to close of course, most stores average around 100 million a year and they wont buy american made products-it showed statistics for what they pay- which is like 18-20 cants for an item that costs $40 dollars then they still get all kinds of tax breaks. It talks about how badly the conditions are at their factories in China- the way employees are treated and forced to pay for rent in a dorm built in the factory whether they live there or not...the multiple lawsuits filed against them for violating enviromental laws (contaminating a city's drinking water for their pesticide storage procedures) Well theres a lot more to it but you get the idea. "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 1:35 PM:

" Shop at Target. :-) "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 1:34 PM:

" T & C wrote "You portray the IDEA that Super Wal-Mart with be the only store on that parcel!"

T & C: I said nothing of the sort. Stop making things up. Can you not speak on this issue without lying to make your point? "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 1:32 PM:

" T & C: I have nothing to do with any union issues. My opinion is just that a Super Wal-Mart is dumpy and ends up looking like trash in most locations. Just look at the Stockton Super Wal-Mart. This is something I will not enjoy seeing in my town. For some reason these places usually end up being such a nuisance. "

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T & C wrote on Sep 2, 2008 12:55 PM:

" Well Lodian... I have a NEWS FLASH for you and all employees of unions and friends of UNION MEMBERS! You portray the IDEA that Super Wal-Mart with be the only store on that parcel! Anyone else has common sense to know that many other shops will also be on that property, each serving a small customer base nitch! It is absolutely funny to watch the DESPERATION of UNION MEMBERS trying to maintain their GRIP on our grocery money! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 2, 2008 12:51 PM:

" Well KenH... I love your sneaking this "Pro Condemn Wal-Mart smear slant! If all else fails..."Try to scare the customer!" Sorry, I do NOT buy your scenerio for a moment! I shop at Wal-Mart 7 days a week. I love wal mart, and as a disabled vet, I have a higher quality of life! High priced grocery chains offer me little and would take all my money! "

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T & C wrote on Sep 2, 2008 12:44 PM:

" This STUPID PRO AND CON issue.... has gotten "OLD" very fast! tHE VOTERS "voted" APPROVAL OF THE sUPER wAL-mART, "End of Etory!" The only reason it keeps re-surfacing is because the GROCERY UNION CHAINS... hate "Free enterprise, and the customers RIGHT to price check what they are buying item for item! They want to maintain HIGH PRICED groceries because it supports their UNION WAGES & Lifestyle! Get over it UNIONS... America is based on a free enterprise system. If you hate Wal-Mart don't shop there, and toss away your money! I will stretch my dollars at Super Wal-Mart, and get value for my money! "

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Lodian wrote on Sep 2, 2008 11:42 AM:

" It's unfortunate that it looks like we will have to see a monstrosity, like the Stockton Super Wal-Mart, in Lodi. If this store is just like the one is Stockton (and why wouldn't it be the same?) I bet most will wish it were never built in our town. "

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Cogito wrote on Sep 2, 2008 9:54 AM:

" You know El Rushbo, there are a few things Stockton has that are worth emulating. They have much more art and cultural happenings, more upscale shopping and dining, more sports and entertainment, and a world class university, just to name a few. "

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El Rushbo wrote on Sep 2, 2008 9:28 AM:

" I`ve said it before and I`ll say it again, Supercenters are PERFECT... for Stockton!! This thing would only further the Stocktonization of Lodi. Just say no to ghettos, just say no to Wal-Mart. "

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Bob Loblaw wrote on Sep 2, 2008 9:18 AM:

" I had the same reaction Cogito. The arguments presented are tired and have been hashed out ad nauseum. The voters have spoken and it's time to move forward. "

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Cogito wrote on Sep 2, 2008 8:59 AM:

" My favorite line is "My problem with the Supercenter is that anything you can get there, you can already get at other stores in Lodi". WHAAAT? So you don't think anyone should be able to open a new pizza restaurant? Since there are already over a dozen of them. Hardware store? Bar? Chinese food? Puhleeze. Can you tell me what things Target and Safeway sell that you couldn't already get somewhere else in Lodi? I really can't tell if this is a serious article or not. There are so many indefensible points of view here. But I know it will have it's fans. "

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taNdc wrote on Sep 2, 2008 8:40 AM:

" Doesn't Gillespie want more commercial? Maybe a couple of those 250,000 sf wine warehouses and tasting rooms? The possibilities are endless. "

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taNdc wrote on Sep 2, 2008 8:39 AM:

" I think Reynolds Ranch would be a great location for superWalmart! "

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taNdc wrote on Sep 2, 2008 8:38 AM:

" John, you hit the nail on the head.I think it's more about the landowner and sale of that land more than it's about Walmart.
Why does Lodi need a new Walmart when the old Walmart is doing just fine and will contribute just as much revenue as a new superstore?
It's our city council, manager and the players in the land deal that are pushing this project so hard.What are the citizens of Lodi going to pay up front on this shenanigan so the wealthy can pocket our money again?There will be freebies and giveaways to lure them here and I know that's why Walmart is holding out for the best deal possible?
Will they get free water,electric and sewer?The water supply has been there for two years and just waiting to sneak Walmart in.
The city council pretends we voted for that superstore and not one of them has spoken up about what that vote really was for.
The scheme to either let Walmart abandon or demolish that existing store is a crock. The promise was to have it 100% leased so their faithful shoppers wouldn't abandon the other businesses and leave it empty. "

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ccinlodi wrote on Sep 2, 2008 8:04 AM:

" Location location location! why put a high volume sales retail operation in a) a location that cannot handle the traffic; b) does not have attractive and easy access for people outside of our town of 30,000 souls; c) has competition surrounding it with easier street access and better shopping atmosphere? I think over on the edge of town out by I-5 would be better - maybe we should have annexed that property first and then gone in search of the retail superstore... "

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KenH wrote on Sep 2, 2008 5:02 AM:

" Mervyns, Target, K-Mart, and other stores do not pull this type of behavior, with clothing racks, nor does even Costco Wholesale. Also more stores such as Target are doing the bulk packed items, to truly save people money on house hold necessities, since the price of said items are expensive, not to mention the cost of fuel.

Sorry but if I were on the City Council, I would vote No on a Super Wal-Mart, its just a bigger store, with the same small store problems. "

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KenH wrote on Sep 2, 2008 4:59 AM:

" To be honest, I was one of the ones who greatly believed in allowing a Super Wal-Mart center in Lodi, in fact I was so dedicated, I read the paper and listened to the news reports about both sides of the arguments, all fair points on both sides...

...however, take a look in Wal-Mart nowadays. Originally you could get the best bang for your buck there, as in a good amount of what the product was being sold...however, Wal-Mart stopped selling larger and bulkier products for a low price and replaced them with smaller packages for a high price.

This past week, a huge clearance sale on clothing was taking place, I have dubbed it the "OMG, someone call the Americans with Disabilities Act, this isn't ADA compliant sale!" Clothing racks blocking the tiled walk way between the men's and women's dept.

If there was an emergency, such as a fire, that little blocking of the direct path the front doors would have made it a helluva time to exit the building. . .especially for someone with a wheel-chair. "

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