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Will recession turn to depression?
Monday, February 25, 2008 6:37 AM PST
Quite a long time ago, I remember my dad talking about a depression that occurred in the early and mid-1930s.
He said things were so bad here in America that people were standing in soup lines to get a bowl of soup and a piece of bread.
I wonder if that depression started out as a recession like the recession they talk about on TV nowadays?
As bad as they are, maybe another depression would be good here in America. It might serve as a good lesson to NOT spend more than you make as income.
Larry Johnson
Lodi
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danielh wrote on Mar 1, 2008 10:26 PM:
I suggest two possibilities:
1) to not divulge the exact frequencies of their L-bands??????
2) to minimize the level of stress, so that the small boats would not result in an air strike. "
danielh wrote on Mar 1, 2008 10:24 PM:
This resulted in Kitty Hawk transmitting a situation report, which was considered a possible "last" transmission.
Very effective.
Iran could have done the same, by just turning on the fire control radars. "
danielh wrote on Mar 1, 2008 10:22 PM:
... they would engage an aircraft carrier with land-based missiles.
I believe such an attack from Iran, in the Strait of Hormuz, would result in severe damage in the US Navy, because I don't think the CG-class ships could successfully engage a simultaneous launch of over a hundred targets.
However, I think Iran would suffer some damage as well, in the American response.
As I am thinking while I am writing, I think the only reason to use boats is to minimize the threat.
"
danielh wrote on Mar 1, 2008 10:15 PM:
I agree that the Strait of Hormuz is NOT a war zone, although the state of "peace" there is based upon the use of restraint on the part of both the USA and Iran. Iran has missiles that it can launch at any time, and I would imagine that an aircraft could attack those missile batteries within 3 minutes if not sooner, and a US Navy ship could launch missiles against them as well, attacking them within 30 seconds.
"
danielh wrote on Mar 1, 2008 10:13 PM:
I agree that the captain will be held accountable if he gives orders to open fire.
"
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 7:53 PM:
I'll tell you what, let's split the difference and say that 'This is all irrelevant to the 'possible' contention that the vessels were American.' "
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 7:44 PM:
But we followed the rules. "
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 7:39 PM:
Do you really believe that? Certainly once a battle is initiated, the rules are fairly straight-forward. However, the rules that apply prior to the first shot are much more defined. The Strait of Hormuz is not currently designated a war zone, is that not true? As such, the ships would not have been on General Quarters until the need arose. I believe it was the captain who had the responsibility to make the call as to when to open fire based upon the authority he was given. "
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 7:32 PM:
Justified, yes. But just as you suggest, there are others who believe that Bush is hell-bent on going to war with Iran. If this had been a set-up to further that goal, then there should/would have been an order sent down through the chain requiring an attack.
The fact that they did not fire, seems to me that they exhibited restraint, not that they were part of some conspiracy to start a war. "
danielh wrote on Mar 1, 2008 7:31 PM:
"
danielh wrote on Mar 1, 2008 7:29 PM:
The US Navy does not want to accidentally attack someone who has peaceful intent, or who is not attacking.
In the case of the fast-attack vessels, if they are within range to impact the ships, within a period of time that is too quick for the gunner to respond, then the ship should open fire. "
danielh wrote on Mar 1, 2008 7:25 PM:
Peaceful fishing vessels can be suicide attack vessels, or you can strike a mine. Irrelevant to the situation.
The boats were within 1/2 mile of the USS vessels. If Iranian, America would have been justified to shoot them. "
danielh wrote on Mar 1, 2008 7:19 PM:
danielh wrote on Mar 1, 2008 7:19 PM:
Captain was popping antacids. I saw him on the bridge when he came out of the Combat Info Center.
DanielH - One last series of questions -
Deal.
Being enlisted, I was not trained in official protocol, but I was observant.
Of course, a threatening intercept course is sufficient to open fire. Radio warnings give opportune for possible targets to establish peaceful intent.
"
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 3:21 PM:
Were you on the bridge when the fast-boats were taunting the ships?
Do you have knowledge as to the rules of engagement in place at the time the fast-boats were taunting the ships?
Regardless of your answers, then please answer as to exactly where did these fast-boats come from?
I am former Air Force and am knowledgeable about the general workings of Air Force protocols. However, I am no longer privy to any Air Force classified orders or instructions. Naval procedures, especially with regard to attack options, are classified. I believe you are no longer active-duty. "
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 3:03 PM:
The 'difference' between the two was not their status or positions. The recent incident involved 'multiple' small boats, whereas the Cole dealt with but one.
If (in the recent account) the commander gave the command to fire, have you given thought as to the consequences of that action? The contention is that while 'ready' to fire, they were ordered to refrain until the last possible moment.
The Cole's commander was an idiot. "
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 2:57 PM:
The problem, Dannie, is that conspiracies are very, very difficult to prove; either in or out of a courtroom.
Your overreaching theories do not contain any evidence to back them up. The crux of my problem regarding your beliefs is that in order for the majority of them to be true, literally hundreds, if not thousands, of people would need to be in on each conspiracy. And they would ALL need to remain absolutely silent. While possible, nowhere near probable. "
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 2:51 PM:
Back up your conspiracy theories with evidence and proof; only then can anyone take your claims seriously. Until then, you're just blowing hot air. "
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 2:49 PM:
I like this line. I hope you don't mind if I borrow it sometime.'
Feel free to borrow it any time and due to the 100-word limit here and limitations elsewhere, you don't need to credit me for its use. I certainly don't want you accused of plagiarism. "
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 2:48 PM:
Ahhh, this is where you directed me (some time ago) to a website stating that Rush Limbaugh sided with the Clintons regarding the murder of Vince Foster.
My research revealed convincingly that Limbaugh was a staunch believer that Foster was, in fact, murdered. The public record backed him up in this regard.
Yet, since you cannot stand Limbaugh, you decided to voice your opinion that he did NOT support the contention. It was very difficult to determine just how you gleaned the 'facts' from your post. "
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 2:43 PM:
As I have always proclaimed about you, you DO NOT know what you are talking about. You see 'conspiracy' where you want to see 'conspiracy.' There is no arguing (in a sensible context) with you. You've proven nothing - just set forth your opinion. I believe your opinion is flawed. "
girard74 wrote on Mar 1, 2008 2:40 PM:
You don't 'educate.' That would imply that you are presenting issues with factual background. What you are doing is putting forth your opinion based upon your disdain for the government.
Those who feel like they are being educated by your nonsense are only fooling themselves.
You have presented nothing but rumor, innuendo and baseless nonsense. If that makes your boat float, then by all means, carry on. I can see right through your B.S. "
Leonard wrote on Mar 1, 2008 7:08 AM:
The one thing I will ALWAYS do, regardless of what you or anyone else believes or thinks - I will ALWAYS give the benefit of the doubt to my country first and foremost.
I like this line. I hope you don't mind if I borrow it sometime. "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 11:49 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 11:47 PM:
In your case, I don't understand how you can hide your virgin mind in the face of all the heinous acts that have been committed by our government, acting as agent for big bankers.
How about the death toll around the Clintons'? Noone seems to care, and someone is voting for Bill's wife without paying any mind for their past history.
America is ready to receive more punishment. "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 11:42 PM:
"
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 11:38 PM:
"
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 11:35 PM:
Now that I have explained the difference between the USS Cole in Sea and Anchor detail, and a US Navy ship in the Strait of Hormuz, do you want me to explain it again, and would you like to say that I don't know what I am talking about?
Duh.
"
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 11:33 PM:
In the Persian Gulf, anyone that comes turns on an intercept course is hostile, and they can be shot with the .50 Caliber Gun Mount. "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 11:31 PM:
Sailors have the mooring lines on heaving lines, and ready to heave ashore for people on shore to receive the mooring lines.
Always, a ship has a harbor pilot on board. It is expected that the harbor pilot will depart the ship when the ship moors. However, a tug boat could come alongside, or a small boat could come alongside for the harbor pilot to go down a ladder. "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 11:25 PM:
I said the Cole was in Sea and Anchor Detail, whereby the suicide boat was acting as a member of the Yemeni port authority.
Perhaps you don't know what is "Sea and Anchor Detail," and in spite of your ignorance, you choose to believe that it is not important.
The captain did not follow security protocol to assure that the Yemeni "visitors" were not suicide bombers, "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:23 PM:
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:21 PM:
In the absence of proof (real proof, not mere conjecture and baseless theory) that your so-called conspiracies exist, I will never side with those who choose to harm us-EVER.
I read and I absorb. When the NY Times prints something, I give it the appropriate attention and then search further for the truth. I may never know the truth - but I won't betray my country. "
Leonard wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:19 PM:
I firmly believe that Danni knows in his heart of hearts that the nonsense he spews is false. Unfortunately, the individual who knows these facts is so completely controlled by the delusions and compulsions that he will never rise to the surface. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:14 PM:
You REALLY believe that? If so, I cannot possibly understand how you could choose to remain in a country that would commit such heinous acts. ??? "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:12 PM:
I CAN'T compare them? Why not? You seem to be able to compare practically every other single event to one another in order to form YOUR theories. What, you've got a crystal ball sitting on your desk? You really think you're something, don't you. You've got an ego the size of Texas, and the brain the size of a pea.
You are entertaining, though. "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:12 PM:
What color was the "ignorance is bliss" pill in the Matrix? You've taken it. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:10 PM:
And just because your demented mind believes all of these conspiracies to be true, doesn't meant it IS true.
I'll take my 'virgin' mind over your 'dementia' any time.
Again, I rest my case. "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:10 PM:
The USS Cole was in Sea and Anchor detail, and the suicide bombers were thought to be members of the Yemeni Port Authority. The USS Cole stood down its defenses.
In the Strait of Hormuz 3 months ago, the ships were probably ready to open fire from the .50 caliber gun mounts.
"
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:08 PM:
You believe that we (the U.S.) are responsible for the downing of a civilian airliner. You further believe that we (the U.S.) are responsible for the four airliners, two of which brought down the WTC; one that landed in the Pentagon; and the failed one that crashed into a field in Pennsylvania - all of which killed thousands of Americans?
You REALLY believe that? If so, I cannot possibly understand how you could choose to remain in a country that would commit such heinous acts. ??? "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:08 PM:
Just because it is too incredible for your virgin mind to understand doesn't mean it isn't true. "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:07 PM:
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 8:03 PM:
Or, as you and wtf and others believe, they simply wanted to start a war.
The problem with 'theories' is that they require substantiated proof in order to survive. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:58 PM:
Which intelligence report do you believe? The one from last year where they state that their nuclear program was halted in 2003; or the most recent one that states that they are moving forward on their nuclear program?
How do you reconcile these two reports to your conspiracy theory? "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:54 PM:
How do YOU know? Was the USS Cole not 'in danger' either? Or was that ALSO a US-made conspiracy?
YOU don't know just how close they came to blowing those idiots out of the water. YOU were NOT there; yet you spew forth your nonsense as if you were at the helm. Absolutely incredible.
I ask you, with all of these conspiracies going on around you, just how secure is your home? How DO you sleep through the night? "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:51 PM:
As such, since HE believes them to be conspiracies, then the recent fast-boat incident near Iran MUST be an American-made conspiracy. I do NOT believe them to be conspiracies simply because they're senseless-without any merit.
danielH then challenges me to debate.
Debate what?!? You're convinced, absolutely CONVINCED based upon supposition, rumor and others' theories. There is no 'basis in truth' to your contentions. The only logical response from me to you, is, 'I rest my case.' "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:44 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:44 PM:
When I was in the Navy, Iran had Chinese Silkworm missiles.
It is my understanding that they now have missiles that are capable of dividing warheads in flight, creating multiple threats, each capable of sinking a ship.
If Iran really was threatening the USA, they would turnitON! "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:39 PM:
However, electronic warfare is invisible, and deniable. American people would not be impressed by electronic emissions, although they represent a substantial threat.
"
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:36 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:32 PM:
The Iranian fast-boat display fits the recipe.
"
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:28 PM:
WW-I (sinking Lusitania), WW-II (Pearl Harbor), Vietnam War (USS Turner Joy), Attack against Korean Airlines 007, and 9/11.
I don't think America was involved with the enemy with the Israeli attack against an American spy vessel, and on the Pueblo.
You wrote, "when someone makes incredible claims in a forum designed for debate."
The door is open for you to debate. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 5:23 PM:
That would define 'theory'. However, when someone makes incredible claims in a forum designed for debate, there should be some sort of support behind the theories presented.
Even Christians base their belief system on something other than air; it is usually accepted by them that the Bible is the Word of God - and that ends the argument. As such, there is usually no sense in arguing further except for the finer points.
"
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 5:18 PM:
Then what do you do with the debt? Erase it as if it never existed? What would be the consequences of that action? "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 2:36 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 2:35 PM:
I agree that the math does not add up for repaying the debt. But this is caused by the Fed. We cannot preserve the Fed for the sake of the problem that it created. "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 2:33 PM:
Eliminating the Federal Reserve would reduce debt, because the debt is caused by the Fed. Without debt, the Fed could not function. The only reason why the IRS is needed is because there needs to be a mechanism for repaying the debt.
The only way to repay the debt is to have a trade surplus. A trade surplus would cause the gold to flow toward America. A surplus might happen if American productivity could happen by elimination of the IRS.
"
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 2:33 PM:
1) Getting off of the Federal Reserve so that congress can issue the national money.
2) Ending the social security system.
3) Getting onto the gold standard.
Problems:
1) Debt.
2) Expense of war - convincing America that it is not the world police that is responsible for war every time someone does not comply with the UN.
3) There isn’t very much gold in Ft. Knox. America would be vulnerable to foreign investment, where foreign gold would buy a lot of American currency.
...cont. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 11:29 AM:
Ditto Leonard's response as well as this:
Even a belief or an opinion should be supported by evidence, even if it is scant.
But merely stating something such as, 'I believe that the fast boats [re: Iran] belonged to the U.S.' or words to that effect, have no value without at least a modicum of substantiation beyond one's sole 'belief.' "
Leonard wrote on Feb 29, 2008 11:21 AM:
" Girard: If I state that I “believe” something, it could mean that the statement is subjective, or I don’t have a footnote.
Chuckle.... a statement of "religious faith" as opposed to fact.
Danny believes in the tenets of Birchunism is the same way that a Catholic believes in the Trinity. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 10:31 AM:
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 10:30 AM:
As an example, before the Fed adjusts interest rates, analysists and talking heads then start to 'guess' as to how the market will respond.
When they are wrong (much of the time), they then start making things up, e.g., someone burped, Trump said, 'Oh no,' or things just as ridiculous in an attempt to explain why things do what they do. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 10:27 AM:
Based upon returning to the gold standard, you are correct, it would bankrupt the nation. As such, the return is impossible.
I have been very forthright in my lack of knowledge of American economics. I try to use a 'common sense' approach which does not always work.
However, when I am told that prices are affected by a stock market move based upon 'fear,' I, like you, sit and scratch my head. "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:53 AM:
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:49 AM:
I don't see any reason why the Federal Reserve would deserve to receive interest payments in a currency that is redeemable for gold.
Additionally, if the national debt exceeds the total money supply, then the US is bankrupt. Actually, the US already is bankrupt and you might have just realized this fact. "
danielh wrote on Feb 29, 2008 7:28 AM:
Therefore as a courtesy, I clearly label the statement as just my opinion. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 29, 2008 6:51 AM:
commonsense1 wrote on Feb 28, 2008 9:51 PM:
girard74 wrote on Feb 28, 2008 12:01 PM:
I wrote earlier, 'My question, however, remains the same.
If the total amount of gold mined up to 2007 is $3.68 trillion and just the national debt is $3.5 trillion as of 2000, without even calculating the wealth in dollars that is distributed amongst all Americans and American corporations, how would it work?'
It's a rather simple question - one that calls for a 'real' answer. Stating that one merely 'believes' that it would balance out is not an answer. "
citizen wrote on Feb 28, 2008 9:43 AM:
danielh wrote on Feb 27, 2008 8:16 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 27, 2008 8:15 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 27, 2008 8:14 PM:
You missed it; I don't think you have the intelligence to figure out what it means; and, I don't think you are worthy of an explanation. "
danielh wrote on Feb 27, 2008 8:13 PM:
He is a retired Colonel in the USAF, and today we are pretty good friends.
"
danielh wrote on Feb 27, 2008 8:09 PM:
Nice try to plea for Leonard's help. Leonard has been working on me for 2-1/2 years, and I'm still here.
I'm more well-informed today than I was when Leonard ran into me in the comments.
Leonard has only served the purpose of educating me on what kind of negative responses I can get for my publications.
I have sparred with much more ignorant and belligert oponents than you and Leonard.
The two of you seem to be the most disinformed that Lodi has to offer.
"
danielh wrote on Feb 27, 2008 8:01 PM:
citizen wrote on Feb 27, 2008 7:30 PM:
danielH wrote on Feb 27, 2008 8:22 AM:
danielH wrote on Feb 27, 2008 8:15 AM:
'No State shall . . . make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debt.'
If a human soul answers a charge against a "defendent," in State court, and the judge charges the "defendent," to pay money?
"Your Honor, 'What form of money would you like me to use to pay the charge?' "
Do you see where this is going? "
danielh wrote on Feb 26, 2008 11:11 PM:
Your efforts to disrupt are expected.
If you want to get under my nerves, I suggest you get yourself an education and find a flaw in my presentation.
If it is your objective to disrupt my presentation, you will know that you have failed for however long it is that you see that I still publish. "
danielh wrote on Feb 26, 2008 10:57 PM:
If you have a legitimate question, you are going to have to speak loudly over the background noise.
It would also be helpful to declare your position.
Leonard also posts on Amazon to discredit references that discuss the origins of government corruption. "
danielh wrote on Feb 26, 2008 10:53 PM:
brokenl wrote on Feb 26, 2008 10:33 PM:
citizen wrote on Feb 26, 2008 8:09 PM:
citizen wrote on Feb 26, 2008 8:04 PM:
danielH wrote on Feb 26, 2008 8:02 AM:
Leonard wrote on Feb 26, 2008 7:58 AM:
" I hear a noise screaming in the background.
There are medicines you can take that will make that stop. "
danielH wrote on Feb 26, 2008 7:46 AM:
Leonard wrote on Feb 26, 2008 6:21 AM:
" Leonard: Is your name, "citizen"?
No, you can just call me "truth speaker".
I am, however, glad to see that you are finally admitting that your primary goal in posting your pustulent vomitus is simply rabble rousing. I have noticed that there is a certain kind of poster who's only goal is to attract attention. Negative or positive, it matters not as long as the light is shining on him.
If it is any comfort, I have never thought that you really believed a word of that nonsense. "
danielh wrote on Feb 26, 2008 1:20 AM:
Leonard wrote on Feb 26, 2008 1:15 AM:
" citizen: What's a "911 truther"? I can't answer your question without knowing your definition. "
A 9/11 truther is a purveyor of political filth and pornography. Known for their syphlitic sense of propriety they are generally shunned by all decent Americans.
While it has been suggested that these individuals should be prosecuted for giving aid and comfort to the enemy in a time of war, I believe that, in most cases, the scorn of their fellow men is the best reward for these treasonous individuals.
Why do you ask? "
danielh wrote on Feb 26, 2008 12:17 AM:
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:39 PM:
The Federal Reserve is one of the most important topics for them to slant in favor of the socialist cause.
"
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:37 PM:
My next letter will be a sensitive topic, and if anyone has any questions, I will be quite willing to answer questions.
Although I have experience with Leonard, I don’t know if anyone ever has seen him blow all of his circuit breakers at the same time. "
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:05 PM:
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:01 PM:
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 10:59 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 10:55 PM:
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 10:53 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 10:52 PM:
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 10:49 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 10:48 PM:
I realize that the Fed chairman is approved by congress every 13 years, but this is completely a theatrical display. The Fed doesn’t need approval for anything it does.
Likewise, President Clinton accepted the resignation of the FDA delegate, who resigned from his staff, but this person’s role was entirely non-governmental.
"
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 10:36 PM:
You are asking what to do with all the investors who hold T-bills. These need to be paid, and without further inflating the dollar by expanding the money supply without backing it by additional gold.
If the dollar were placed on the gold standard, and the Federal Reserve abolished, I believe the economy would improve so well, that it would be conceivable for the government to generate revenue through taxes to repay the T-bills.
"
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 10:24 PM:
If I invested the same money myself throughout my life, I think I could have made the money grow at least double what the government can offer in return for the same investment.
"
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 9:51 PM:
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 9:41 PM:
'Ron Paul offered to young people to opt out of the SS system.'
While this sounds like a great idea, it is premised upon the idea that these same young people will have the necessary fiscal discipline to save for their own retirements. While Social Security is usually not enough for most people to retire 'comfortably' on, it does provide a sort of safety net for those who either did not save, or were unable to save for reasons not of their own making.
Eliminating Social Security is not the answer; restructuring it in a responsible way is. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 9:23 PM:
My question, however, remains the same.
If the total amount of gold mined up to 2007 is $3.68 trillion and just the national debt is $3.5 trillion as of 2000, without even calculating the wealth in dollars that is distributed amongst all Americans and American corporations, how would it work?
Would Daddy Warbucks then be able to just snap his fingers and balance the books to the satisfaction of all? Or am I just asking a stupid question; or one that no one has an answer for? "
sam wrote on Feb 25, 2008 8:28 PM:
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 6:12 PM:
wtf wrote on Feb 25, 2008 5:46 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 4:32 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 4:31 PM:
There is nothing wrong with international exchange of currency. If our currency is strong, traders will just have to convert into our currency if they want to trade with us. No problem.
When treaties establish international tribunals and a board of governors that encroach upon the sovereignty of its member nations, this is bad. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 4:21 PM:
To do so would ultimately make someone who is a U.S. billionaire one day turn into a mere millionaire the next. While that "might" work within the strict confines of the US, it would never be acceptable within the international exchange of currencies.
I imagine that the only thing that comes close is when the Euro became a common currency. "
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 4:20 PM:
The story of the Fed is best documented in wtf's reference, "Creature from Jekyll Island," by G. Edward Griffin. "
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 4:19 PM:
7) Although the Fed was created by the excuse to stabilize the economy, it is used to fleece the serfs in boom-bust cycles.
8) Bankers who were behind the Fed or in partnership with it were behind the stock market crash, which the Fed was supposed to prevent. An elitist tours was given to entertain visitors with the spectacle of the crash.
9) J.P. Morgan notified 17 elite investors, including Joseph Kennedy, to get out of the stock market, 6 weeks before the crash. "
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 4:16 PM:
4) Leonard has no opinion on the Fed; therefore, it must be important.
5) The campaign of the 10th president was against the banking charter. Although Jackson won, the banking charter returned anyway, some 15 years later.
6) The national deficit was launched skyward in the same year as the creation of the Fed. In the same year, the IRS was created to satisfy the debt-based monitary system that the Fed is. "
wtf wrote on Feb 25, 2008 4:16 PM:
Since the Constitution authorizes congress to mint money; part of the reason for inflation is that when the government turned it over to a private entity i.e., the Fed, they then had to *pay* the Fed to print the money that congress could do free of charge. More detail on this in "Creature". "
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 4:12 PM:
I assure you that it is understandable not to know.
Perhaps the following items will get you interested:
1) They prefer to keep us uninformed. For that reason, they'll never be honest on the 6:00 news or in school textbooks.
2) Henry Ford I said that if the citizens ever learn how much of a banking scandal there is, there'll be a revolution before sunrise tomorrow morning.
3) Banking funds all war. Bankers fund both sides so that they will be a winner no matter who wins. "
wtf wrote on Feb 25, 2008 4:11 PM:
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2187rank.html
"
wtf wrote on Feb 25, 2008 4:00 PM:
It does; from what I understand the pumped up paper currency figures are due to inflation, or what we are about to enter (as did Germany) hyper-inflation. If the dollar were backed by gold, the cost of things would go down.
It would also be nice if the practice of usury (charging interest) were stopped.
A good book to read is "The Creature From Jekyll Island" by G. Edward Griffin. "
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:59 PM:
In the book, "On the Horns of the Beast," William Still, it exposes four historical economies that were on an honest banking system. These were Venice, Italy, Carthage, N. Africa, Constantinopole, and Hamburg. The Bank of Hamburg was the most recent bank which fell when Napoleon B. raided the silver vault. "
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:54 PM:
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:51 PM:
citizen wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:45 PM:
scout wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:40 PM:
citizen wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:39 PM:
nylodian wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:28 PM:
nylodian wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:26 PM:
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:12 PM:
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:09 PM:
It makes a good political sound-bite, but in reality it simply makes no sense. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 3:06 PM:
Slate.com states that the national debt was $3.5 trillion in 2000. With the current value of the WORLD'S TOTAL gold at $3.68 trillion, how could it be balanced? "
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:42 PM:
You said that he was surprised that a govt could have thought of it.
Well, it is 100% private. Not one speck of government in it anywhere.
As for the distinction between the private sector and the public sector. I'll agree that this is the crux of the problem. "
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:38 PM:
Otherwise, the attachment to gold would completely halt inflation and completely stabilize the economy. "
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:36 PM:
The Fed chairman has no accountability with congress and the president, whatsoever. This person is merely a figurehead.
Probably, campaign spokesperson would be a more appropriate title.
If congress did not approve this person's appointment, the Fed could appoint this nominee anyway. "
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:33 PM:
If you recall in the comic, Daddy Warbucks would snap his finger to materialize anything he needed. That is the mechanism for creation of money in the Federal Reserve.
Instead of a snap of a finger, the Federal Reserve monitizes our signatures by a ratio of 10:1. This means that if a bank can produce promissory notes for $10,000 and present them to the FederalReserve, they will be reimbursed $100,000. "
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:33 PM:
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:29 PM:
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:23 PM:
0) Repeal the Federal Reserve Act.
1) Calculate the amount of US Dollars in circulation.
2) Inventory the gold in Fort Knox.
3) Calculate Dollars / amount of gold.
4) Set the value of gold at that amount, and re-attach the currency to the gold. (This involves revoking whaterver law was established in the Johnson era, which detached the currency from the gold).
5) Rescind FDR's executive order which made it illegal for Americans to barter in gold and silver. "
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:20 PM:
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:18 PM:
" Leonard: It is not my goal in life to convince you of anything. If you look at my posts, only one has your name on it. I was being very patient, and I was taking a risk.
Why don't you e-mail someone and ask them to ask me a question under their userID?
Well Danny, I am not in the business of believing unsupported nonsense. If you can't back up your statements with evidence and reasoning, don't expect anyone to take you seriously. "
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:15 PM:
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:14 PM:
Why don't you e-mail someone and ask them to ask me a question under their userID? "
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:14 PM:
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 2:10 PM:
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 1:37 PM:
That is not even to mention the fact that once the country has been finally pacified, it will need to be rebuilt and that process will be very expensive, even without the cost of doing business with Administration leaches like Halliburton. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 1:25 PM:
Our presence there would be to have the same effect as after WWII; to insure stability. That would not only be positive for the region, but it would be in our best interest as well. "
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 1:18 PM:
You have, however, made some bold accusations and, for me to be convinced, you are going to have to back them up with strong evidence and powerful arguments.
I stand ready to be convinced if you can make a persuasive case.
-LP "
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 1:12 PM:
Manipulations of the interest rates by the Fed is generally thought to be one of the key tools employed to avoid recessions. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 1:09 PM:
If an attempt were to take place to return our economy to the gold standard, how, exactly would that be accomplished. The $3.68 trillion of gold is world-wide. What is the dollar amount of our paper currency in circulation now? I would submit the 'value' of paper currency currently exceeds our current supply of gold. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 1:01 PM:
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 1:00 PM:
We general public (lower and middle class citizens) do not have sufficient influence over our leaders to cause a solution, unless we have a substantial revolution (of public opinion), through extensive campaign and publication. For as long as people don’t understand the exact nature of the Federal Reserve, it’s not going to happen.
Ron Paul offered to young people to opt out of the SS system. "
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 12:59 PM:
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 12:51 PM:
This is very interesting to me; I think further research is necessary to discover/uncover the crux of the issue. "
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 12:50 PM:
" I have read estimates that put the cost of imprisoning, educating, paying for health care, etc. of illegal aliens to be over 338 billion dollars a year. I think that's a significant amount
I think you misplaced a decimal point there. The cost most often cited by reputable anti immigration sources is $27 billion a year. The accuracy of that figure has been widely challenged by pro immigrant groups but it is a good place to start. "
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 12:44 PM:
" Leonard: I am being very patient with you. Article I, Section 8 gives congress the duty and responsibility to "coin the money."
The Fed is private.
So, you are arguing that Congress is somehow barred from contracting that work out? "
wtf wrote on Feb 25, 2008 12:31 PM:
Rank Order - Current account balance
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2187rank.html
"
wtf wrote on Feb 25, 2008 12:30 PM:
Recessions, Depressions, Inflation, etc. are manipulated by the Fed, and many Americans are living beyond their means. Unfortunately, with the housing bubble, rising heating, food, gas costs, etc. some people put these items on their credit card and then are saddled with interest payments on top of the high prices.
“Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes her laws.” Mayer Amschel Rothschild "
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 12:26 PM:
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 12:01 PM:
The Fed is private. "
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 12:00 PM:
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:58 AM:
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:45 AM:
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:26 AM:
DANIELH wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:24 AM:
For however long that the Federal Reserve is granted cartel approval to issue the national currency, America will be in danger of another depression.
FDR’s confiscation of the gold was a sham. Gold has the effect of stabilizing the economy, not vice versa.
The Fed (having foreign shareholders) is not constitutionally authorized to participate in govt in any way. In fact, congress delegated its duty and responsibility granted under Article I, Section 8 of the constitution.
In the late 1960’s (Johnson or Nixon), the currency was removed from the gold standard. This is another sham. "
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:18 AM:
Bush at least tried to put forth a possible solution to the problem in 2005 and he was spat on by both parties for his efforts. "
Lodian wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:18 AM:
"
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:16 AM:
Leonard wrote on Feb 25, 2008 11:14 AM:
"
Lodian wrote on Feb 25, 2008 10:24 AM:
WELL SAID!
Gee, I'd love to go to the employer and say, "Hey, Boss, I spent too much money last year so I need you to give me a HUGE bonus!...I'll try not to screw up next time"
LOL! Sure, that would work.
"
Lodian wrote on Feb 25, 2008 10:21 AM:
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 9:38 AM:
nylodian wrote on Feb 25, 2008 8:06 AM:
Cogito wrote on Feb 25, 2008 7:52 AM:
danielh wrote on Feb 25, 2008 7:33 AM:
girard74 wrote on Feb 25, 2008 7:02 AM:
A 'depression' will never happen again. Most importantly, the actual word 'depression' has been stricken from the economic dictionary. There's not much difference between a recession and a depression.
As for the stock market crashing as it did in '29, 'circuit breakers' have been installed on Wall Street that will automatically slow or halt trading if a certain downward threshold is reached. It's all artificial anyway. "
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