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Understanding public pay: It's complicated — but essential over the long term


Saturday, December 8, 2007 4:01 PM PST

Comments (41 comment(s))

We've drawn both boos and bouquets for publishing city compensation information, a step enabled by the state Supreme Court and its chief justice, Ronald M. George.

First, we will offer a mea culpa. We published a chart of top 20 earners last week that was miscalculated. We are publishing a fresh set of figures we believe to be accurate today along with other notes and figures we hope provide context.

Revised figures: Revisions and additions to city compensation

Honestly, we have struggled somewhat with the mountains of data submitted by public agencies. Part of our challenge is sorting through differences in how agencies maintain payroll information, and how they choose to submit it to us. We're making an honest effort here, but we'll be counting on public managers and sharp-eyed readers to help us to the extent they can — and to call it to our attention when we've stumbled a bit.

Our goals: to report this information fairly and with balance — and, most importantly, in a way that is meaningful to taxpayers.

Themes emerging

So far, some interesting themes have emerged.

For instance, total compensation is critical but sometimes misunderstood.

As employees, we sometimes just focus on base pay.

But our employers, whether it be the city of Lodi or the Lodi News-Sentinel, typically provide much more than base pay. This often includes a retirement contribution, health insurance, unemployment and workers comp insurance, and on and on.

Our sense is that total compensation is growing as health insurance benefits increase, and that total compensation in the public sector is growing particularly fast because of generous pension contributions.

A quick check of records here at the News-Sentinel shows that fringe benefits beyond our base pay runs 35 to 50 percent extra.

If the picture still isn't clear, ask your own boss how much your fringes cost.

Some compensation is clearly reasonable

We see City Manager Blair King, for instance, has wages of about $160,000 annually. For what it's worth, this strikes us as reasonable for the CEO of a staggeringly complex enterprise with 500 employees.

Some specialized skill positions, such as those in the city utility and water/wastewater departments, reflect a pretty clear supply demand relationship.

On the other hand, there are probably compensation packages that don't make that much sense. What the public should have — and the City Council should demand — are reasonable comparisons.

The city does compare its compensation packages to other governments. But this is an employment environment where union members influence the election of the bosses and a thrifty attitude at the negotiating table can be punished at the ballot box.

What we should expect is comparisons to private enterprise, too, especially on a regional basis.

Not an easy request.

There is no such thing as a private police officer (with arrest authority granted by the state), or a private city clerk who runs elections.

Some comparisons are valid

But there are ways to compare some positions.

What does a private sector secretary, maintenance worker or utility company lineman make? How many private companies offer retirement at age 50 with 90 percent of salary? What's usual and customary in the area of health insurance?

There are other gauges of the value of compensation.

How many applicants respond when there is an opening for a sewer worker, a firefighter, a police officer or a clerk? What is the rate of turnover in these jobs, and how many people go laterally to similar jobs at other cities or private companies?

It's not an easy matter to judge the value of an employee through the eyes of an employer with limited resources.

But that's what taxpayers should ask of city leaders.

The savings might affect some workers, but benefit the community as a whole. They might soften or delay the next electric or water rates increase. We might find the cash to refurbish the Grape Bowl or improve DeBenedetti Park.

As we (the press and the taxpayers) get better at using the tools handed us by the Supreme Court, the possible savings will become clearer.

— Lodi News-Sentinel

Reader Feedback

final - final wrote on Dec 16, 2007 12:24 AM:

" oh and olap your rant ant raves aren't going anywhere. You must see by now that you are the only audience on bolgs. Yours beliefs and visions don't add up to a ant poop hill. Get out of the pub or in the pub and be active or pack it up. "

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you're out there pal wrote on Dec 14, 2007 10:57 PM:

" Hey Oh, that sounds American, lets have a vote and exclude the people whose vote you don't like. Why don't you instead vote for different politicians if you don't like the current situation? And would you quit saying fleece fleece, its getting old, you're starting to sound like a broken record. "

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To SmarterthanSmart wrote on Dec 14, 2007 5:31 PM:

" I would be willing to put up my w-2, but I am not a city employee.......just one who is sympatheitc to their cause. "

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oh wrote on Dec 14, 2007 11:00 AM:

" We can not let the City have anymore programes!We can not have you people take on anymore!You show that you abuse what you have gotten!Quit taking advantage of your position and tax money and maybe things will change!This is not a personal attack on anyone alone!It is the whole Public employee system that is out of control!Let us have a vote on your pay with out the employees voting on their own pay!Fleece!Fleece! "

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SmarterthanSmart wrote on Dec 13, 2007 8:34 PM:

" NO points missed here? Please be my guest - lets put everything on the table. Lets open up some W2's - any police and firefighters willing to put up? All the facts are that your powerful unions won't let all the facts come out. "

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FFer wrote on Dec 13, 2007 10:10 AM:

" "to olap" The boots that AMR has on the ground for the most part do a great job. The problem in this county is the fragmented dispatching system that AMR has put into place. The county gave this responsibility to AMR before they were ready and it has cost lives, and endagered the public. Check out the website, it is not fabricated stuff, it is actual dispatch tapes and recordings. Your bashing a union that is trying to better emergency services in the county. Drop your preconcieved notions and just check it out "

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oh wrote on Dec 12, 2007 9:57 PM:

" The poor old lady next door can't pay her heat bill!But she is safe for now because of are public servents!But whats going to happen when she can't pay the rent anymore?Because the cost of living here will get to high and her income is not any bigger?The town has more crime then it had before!But she will be safe under the bridge!Because we have over paid public employees to protect her! "

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to... wrote on Dec 12, 2007 7:24 PM:

" obviously NOT SmarterthanSmart...You missed the point. Publish the pay scales, but do so in a manner (from the first article) that gives the info. CORRECTLY and explains all of the benefits etc. related to the pay. Massive benefit packages?????????It costs our family a fortune for decent benefits...out of pocket every month. Don't take your cues from LNS. KNOW ALL of the facts before you spout off. "

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check it out wrote on Dec 12, 2007 6:47 PM:

" Chuck, "No...safety is not their concern" You don't even know me and you have the odasity to put words in my mouth by saying I don't care about the oath I took to provide for public safety and am only in it for the money? You are extremely insulting, my friend. "

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just wonderin' wrote on Dec 12, 2007 6:39 PM:

" Hey Olap, if the city manager is accountable to no one, then why has the city of Stockton, our neighbors to the south, gone through so many in the last few years? Looks like they are accountable to someone. "

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olap wrote on Dec 12, 2007 2:10 PM:

" Enough - you are the reason this democracy is in the position it is in and is heading in the direction it is. See my comments below to see where you fit in the scheme of things. Keep on believing the hype, the government needs good peasants like you. "

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olap wrote on Dec 12, 2007 2:08 PM:

" obviously you have no concept of the scope and scale of large private corporations. The city manager would in no way match the responsibilities of a line division VP. I will stand by my assertion that the job duties are about equivalent. About 500 employees each. multiple department heads, etc. The difference being the city manager is accountable to no one, where as the plant manager could lose thier job over a single incident. "

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SmarterThanSmart wrote on Dec 12, 2007 12:54 PM:

" Here is the problem with public employee's - no accountability unless something goes horribly wrong, great pay, strong unions, massive benefit packages = wasting taxpayers money. Plain and Simple. Thanks LNS for bringing this to light. "

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SmarterThanSmart wrote on Dec 12, 2007 12:52 PM:

" People who keep asking the LNS for their payscale must be the same ones collecting these enormous puplic salaries. If you can't understand the difference between the public and private sectors you should forfeit a portion of your pay. If you don't like your salary reported ... DON'T WORK FOR THE GOVERNMENT. "

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insider wrote on Dec 12, 2007 11:49 AM:

" let's disclose those gifts and gimmes that're legally taken by those in a superior position. such as dinners, vacations, weekend getaways, cars, cash, and that's not to mention those other under the table thank you gifts for favors unknown. to numerous to mention. just part of the game. Unethical, but not always illegal. they know where to draw the line. that's why the $99 check contribution fee with no name nor company having to be released. our own councilpeople get thousands of these alone. "

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Chuck wrote on Dec 12, 2007 11:35 AM:

" To:check it out .. NO.. Safety is NOT their concern.. "

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Cogito wrote on Dec 12, 2007 8:56 AM:

" Re: "Public pay", Yeah, what he said. "

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Enough wrote on Dec 11, 2007 7:19 PM:

" oh and olap you need to pack it in and head somewhere where you think there is a better democracy to live your meaningful little lifes. Sorry grumpy old men get a life and enjoy your golden years. "

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To Olap & oh wrote on Dec 11, 2007 3:36 PM:

" You compared a mid level job at Gen. Mills to the City Mgr. Let's do better than that. Let's take the VP & Plant Mgr of GM for a comparison. Do you think running a single mfg. plant is less involved than running a city? How much is the City Mgr. worth? How about a police and fire chief. This should be a simple question for 2 guys as well informed as you claim to be. "

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olap wrote on Dec 11, 2007 9:32 AM:

" No, not the same person. I know it is hard for a lot of people to understand those that don't like to see there tax money wasted. But the world is full of "useful idiots", especially in so called democracies. "

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just wonderin' wrote on Dec 10, 2007 6:23 PM:

" Is Olap and Oh the same person? "

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check it out wrote on Dec 10, 2007 1:46 PM:

" Olap, if AMR is here or not it will not cost one firefighter his job. If you read the site, their concern is for the publics safety. "

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Pubic pay is more like it wrote on Dec 10, 2007 12:59 PM:

" The difference between government and private industry is that private industry has to make a profit to stay in business and to do that, they need to be competant with quality products and services. Government only needs to show up & collect taxes. They're rude, self-minded, negligent & corrupt. Government worked years ago because people were consciencious with a concern for fellowman. Now it is all about self and who gives a damn so long as I get my check! "

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oh wrote on Dec 10, 2007 11:31 AM:

" These people that work for the public are a joke!They realy think they deserve this kind of pay!If they want the truth?There company is bankrupt!We need to find a new company!And need to start over fresh!Not add to the one that is Bankrupt!You want to compare to the private business then there you have it!Poor management!Fleece!Fleece! "

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olap wrote on Dec 10, 2007 10:20 AM:

" Gee a website by the firefighter unions. HMMM, if AMR was doing the best job in the world it would still be spun negatively. This is the purpose of the union to keep jobs at all costs. Did I ever say that AMR was perfect, no. Where is the comparison to how it was before. Not there. These types of incidents occurred then, but there was no way to address them. At least AMR has incentive to improve. Where is that for the FD or PD? "

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Hope wrote on Dec 9, 2007 9:01 PM:

" All people desire a life with their dreams come true, and a just government. All governments need public input to function properly, this article reminds us of one more thing that can go wrong in government! "

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JustTheFacts wrote on Dec 9, 2007 5:59 PM:

" It's easy enough to see what City employees earn in vacation, administrative and sick leave. Look at the City website for job descriptions. "

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check it out wrote on Dec 9, 2007 5:45 PM:

" Olap, in regards to your first post, your example of AMR as a private alternative for public safety is in my opinion a poor example. The job they have done in dispatching for the county is deplorable. Check out www.amatterofpublicsafety.com you may change your mind. "

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Lodi citizen wrote on Dec 9, 2007 11:12 AM:

" LNS, you call this an "I'm Sorry" piece? Interesting choice of words, that specifically don't include ones like 'mistake', 'error', 'inaccuracies', 'incomplete'. I guess the golden rule applies here, "He who has the gold makes the rules". I heard you started working on this info 3 months ago-a lot of good a bunch of time to research and write did! "

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Olap wrote on Dec 9, 2007 8:21 AM:

" And as far as benefits are concerned. Most of corporate america has done away with 'defined benefit' plans, because they were bankrupting industries. See auto, steel, airlines, etc. So the plant manager with have no where near the benefits being offered the city manager. "

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Olap wrote on Dec 9, 2007 8:18 AM:

" The plant manager at General mills is only a mid level manager at general mills. There are 1000's of people at the company that are equivilant or higher than this position. The pay range for the position is probably around 130K - 170K with the average being about 140K. I know it is hard to fathom, but that is a big company that uses competitive pay scales, not made up pay scales. "

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What, to LNS wrote on Dec 8, 2007 10:48 PM:

" This concept about comparing to others areas is ridiculous. Pay should not be based on this type of formula when citizens pay the bills. Pay someone on merit, savings they can bring to the table, vision... Yes, they are paid too much. Taxation without representation; it is time for a Lodi Lake Tea Party. Vote in new people with ethics. "

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Subscriber's concern... wrote on Dec 8, 2007 10:44 PM:

" The LNS does control a lot of info. Yes, they did influence the entire legal matter with stories, stories and more stories. Did I say Stories? Such influence shifted the responsibility of clean-up from LNS (polluter)to local resident (citizen that pays utilities). The entire arrangement with the CC is disturbing. "

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To Olap wrote on Dec 8, 2007 9:46 AM:

" If you think the plant manager at Genral Mills is making 140K you are dreaming. He makes alot more than that. "

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T & C wrote on Dec 8, 2007 9:27 AM:

" subscriber, if you haven't noticed, the price of the Lodi news has just gone up. Their advertising is way down, as must be their revenues. If it weren't for the Lodi business sector needing ads, this little Podunk paper would compare to the National Enquirer. Marty and Rich, you're doing a helluva job! "

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To LNS wrote on Dec 8, 2007 9:23 AM:

" King makes 160K. Many think thats too much. Compare his salary to his counterparts in Tracy, Manteca, Stockton, Roseville, Folsom and othe cities. You will find he is making far less. That is the issue. "

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Insider wrote on Dec 8, 2007 8:40 AM:

" Amen Subsciber "

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olap wrote on Dec 8, 2007 8:22 AM:

" And if prisons are any indicator, private prison can be run for 50% of what public prison in CA cost. There are ways to get at the numbers, government is just too lazy to do, and it is too easy to raise taxes to pay for benefits. How many days of vacation do government workers get? Last I heard CHP was getting 8 wks per year, find that in the private sector? "

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olap wrote on Dec 8, 2007 8:20 AM:

" The plant manager at General mills would be a good example. The compensation level there is probably about 140K, unless you have been with the company since the dawn of time. If you do poorly you are removed pronto quick or the plant is shut down. Don't see that too often in government. As far as positions with no private equivliant. Maybe it is time to get one. AMR has come in and is doing an equvialant job for less "

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olap wrote on Dec 8, 2007 8:16 AM:

" Nice suck up to mr. King. For what it is worth, his job does not compare to private sector work. There is no profit motive and there is ZERO accountability or responsibilty. Private sector companies can not threaten to remove vital services, unless they recieve more money, ect. King's job at best is the equivilant of a midlevel manager at a large corp. "

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Subscriber wrote on Dec 8, 2007 7:56 AM:

" Marty-- How about publishing the Sentinel's compensation schedule, especially yours. What you make influences what I pay for your paper and advertising therein. What's more, your influence in local politics affects every citizen. For example, the sweetheart deal you received on the pollution matter was likely a dividend for helping our local officials get elected. You and your paper are in no position to look down anyone's nose at other people's pay. "

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