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Let us admit our mistake: It is time to pull out of Iraq


Saturday, January 20, 2007 5:57 AM PST

In our judgment, it's time to bring our young men and women home from Iraq.

In the early going, this newspaper supported the war. As goals shifted and events clarified the administration's naive assumptions, we have become more skeptical. The facts are clarifying now. Let's examine them and our nation's goals in Iraq:

• We went into Iraq to take away Saddam Hussein's weapons of mass destruction. Nearly everyone, including President George W. Bush, now agrees we made a mistake. The chemical weapons and nuclear program were gone sometime before we started the war.

• We went into Iraq to overthrow Saddam, a terrible despot and mass murderer. He was hanged late last month. Mission accomplished.

• We are in Iraq to fight terrorism. This is a bit confusing.

There are terrorists in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Egypt, Sudan, the Arab emirates, Afghanistan, Indonesia and elsewhere. There may even be a few here at home.

When Osama bin Laden, the mastermind of the 9/11 attack, fled the coalition that invaded his sanctuary in Afghanistan, he didn't flee to Iraq. He fled to the lawless mountain regions of the Afghanistan-Pakistan border.

Before the Iraq War, there may have been a few terrorists there, but not many. The violence in Iraq now suggests it may be overrun by terrorists. President Bush said last week Iraq may become a haven for terrorists if we leave.

But is that so? And if it is, will they be a bigger threat than terrorists in other parts of the world?

Our being in Iraq attracts and breeds terrorists. On balance, we doubt the situation could be worse after we leave. And if a bigger terrorism threat pops up somewhere else — or if Iran or North Korea develop nuclear weapons — we will regret that our armed forces are tied up in Iraq.

• Perhaps we are in Iraq to stabilize our oil supply. Many assume this is our "real reason" and condemn the immorality of killing for energy.

We don't think oil drove America to war. Of course, our economy would be harmed by a spike in the price of petroleum. But oil flows in a world market and has such tremendous value that it seems unlikely that after we leave any Iraqi leadership would just leave it in the ground. Iraqi oil will go somewhere and we will get whatever share of the market we can afford. We don't need military intervention to make that happen — at this point.

• President Bush predicts there will be "a bloodbath" if we leave Iraq. So one of our goals now is to quell fighting in the streets. But then again, a tremendous number of people are dying now. This is another area where the facts aren't clear; the estimates of violent deaths range wildly. Some say the war and associated violence has killed only 10,000; one study says 600,000. The U.N. said this week 36,000 Iraqi civilians were killed in 2006. A figure of 50,000 to 100,000 killed since 2002 seems likely.

If we leave, the killing might stop — or at least slow. Or the large Shia majority will move to suppress the Kurdish and Sunni minorities. The fighting will be protracted if these minority groups or outsiders want it to be protracted, but America won't be the cause.

• We went into Iraq to create a democracy in the Middle East. Some see this as a strategic advantage for us; others see it as an act of benevolence; a few think this is a righteous extension of our values. We question whether a democracy can be imposed by American military might.

Yes, thanks to our intervention there has been an election.

When given the chance to vote, Shias voted for Shiite leaders, Sunnis voted for Sunnis and Kurds voted for the Kurdish. Now their ancient struggle is being waged in the halls of government and in the streets as well. The U.S. Army is having a devil of a time creating a united government, an integrated army and effective law enforcement.

What is the evidence our army can create the cultural shift to unite and democratize Iraq?

Iraq, the nation, was created by the British empire in the 19th century. As in Africa, tribal lines were ignored. Iraq has no democratic history, and today no mass of Iraqis longs to adopt our values of individual and religious freedom, the rule of law, and equality for minorities.

Our democracy came into being because we rose up against an oppressive government. Iraqis didn't rise up against Saddam. If there is a rally now to end the violent fray, it is being frustrated by sectarian politics and fears.

In addition, we have to ask, is it the job of our army to create their democracy or protect ours? Do we give others liberty by extending our military might or by living according to the ideals of democracy and legal restraint? Fewer and fewer Americans seem happy with the example we're setting.

Of course, there's our duty to support the troops. But does that mean we have to support the war? If the war is wrong, we think it makes more sense to support our service men and women by pulling them out of harm's way. The patriotic thing is to do what's right.

For all his faults and blind spots, President Bush has showed a modicum of courage in admitting mistakes such as the WMD fiasco. We urge President Bush to take the next step and admit he has overreached in Iraq.

When we leave, the threat of terrorism and massively destructive weapons will still be out there in the world. The challenges in Afghanistan and the violent stand-off between Palestinians and Israelis will remain.

We need to position our forces for the next struggle that will inevitably confront us. It is now clear that the war in Iraq is a misuse of our military assets and a betrayal of America's values.

Lodi News-Sentinel

First published: Saturday, January 20, 2007

Reader Feedback

WY wrote on Jan 31, 2007 4:56 PM:

" Sorry.. My little person Blogged in on my 11:43 post I look kinda special there. lol...? "

WY wrote on Jan 31, 2007 4:41 PM:

" What ever ....Is that my Computer or my new set of nails...? Give me a break. Any how there you have it. What's Sam say...? peace out... "

Daniel wrote on Jan 31, 2007 2:32 PM:

" General: If a foreign national serves in the US military, they and their family ought to have a right to US citizenship. There is nothing wrong with this. It does not relinquish control of the border in any way. "

WY wrote on Jan 31, 2007 12:03 PM:

" MW... I did say Thank You.There was no mental anguish. lol.This is a whole new week and better,I might add.I have lost contact with a Soldier got shot...recovered , Lost a friend while giving him energency care in the street,and then after a year in Iraq he has PTS and his wife didn't hang around for him, taboot. Another friend just left for his 4th tour. He just left last week. I know everyone here loves the Troops. I'm sorry too. "

Wy wrote on Jan 31, 2007 11:43 AM:

" MW... Thank You. I sqaid that you did cause me mental anguish.. It just made me mad. I also soai Thank you for clairifing and not generlizing. I too free No get out of jail free for the "bad eggs" I have a friend that has just left for his 4th tour in Iraq. "

WY wrote on Jan 31, 2007 6:29 AM:

" Webmaster... I did say Thank You to MW... What's up??? You think you can let MW see my reply to him? Are these pauses, stratigic... or are you just very busy. It's hard to stay tuned :-) Could you please post my reply to MW "

OTH wrote on Jan 30, 2007 7:02 PM:

" To MW I don't know the specifics of it but they had it on the news one night as some young man was being sworn in. They said at the end of four years he would be granted his cicizenship. I wondered at the time why it wasnn't more known. He seemed to haved it pretty well together. He would do combat time in Iraq. "

Daniel wrote on Jan 30, 2007 6:48 PM:

" MW: I concur with what you wrote. I think people unknowingly support the war, in spite of their words to the contrary. "

MW wrote on Jan 30, 2007 1:18 AM:

" To Daniel: Thank you for your words. That was indeed the point I wanted to make; people like Bush and Captain America are supporting the enemy as much as the protestors by letting bad egg soldiers get away with murder. However, I can see how my words could have been confusing and how WY must have read them, and I'm sorry to anyone who might have thought I don't wholeheartedly support the troops. Its the people who sent them into this mess and the few bad eggs I don't support. "

MW wrote on Jan 30, 2007 1:16 AM:

" To OTH: I did not know that citizenship is offered to immigrants for serving in the armed forces. Perhaps this is something that should be talked about alot more. I can't imagine why there are so many people in poverty that would turn down free citizenship, a paycheck, and three meals a day to risk life and limb to try and cross the border instead. "

MW cont... wrote on Jan 30, 2007 1:08 AM:

" By giving those bad eggs a free pass, they are arguing for something that will make Iraq twenty times more deadly for our boys and girls over there. That is the point I was trying to make in my replies to Captain America. Please accept my deepest apologies for causing you undue mental anguish. Please don't think I'm not very, very grateful to him and to every other good egg in the military for doing a dirty job that no one else wants. I'm so grateful. God bless you and your brother. "

MW cont... wrote on Jan 30, 2007 1:07 AM:

" Captain America says those bad eggs should be allowed to commit war crimes because they are under a lot of stress. I think that disrespects the hell out of folks like your brother and my family who are under just as much stress, but don't allow it to turn them into monsters with rage in their hearts. People like Captain America are disrespecting our troops by saying they should not be held to higher standards than the rapists and murderers in Stockton. "

MW cont... wrote on Jan 30, 2007 1:06 AM:

" Because of people like the five men who raped and murdered that little girl, and that woman who helped torture prisoners at Abu Gharib, terrorists fighting our troops feel like they can retaliate with bigger force, and they use these kinds of things to convince others to follow them. Because of the few bad eggs, people like your brother and people like my friends and family are facing dangers they should not have to face. "

MW cont... wrote on Jan 30, 2007 1:05 AM:

" It is because I support the troops in Iraq that I said what I did. Not all or even most of the troops are murderers, rapists, or torturers; it is only a few bad eggs, and I should have made that more obvious in my replies. However, those few bad eggs are dishonoring the military, and making Iraq a more dangerous place for people that are doing their jobs in Iraq, trying to bring peace and help rebuild their country. "

MW wrote on Jan 30, 2007 1:05 AM:

" WY: First, please allow me to extend heartfelt apologies to you. While I was making those comments in reply to Captain America, I can see how they must appear if you read them without reading his drabble first, and I apologize to you for making you upset and angry. I have family and friends in the military overseas in Iraq and Afghanistan, and if I saw those words out of context, I too would be outraged. I apologize for not making my meaning clearer. "

Daniel wrote on Jan 29, 2007 5:11 PM:

" WY: I don't see any disrespect for American soldiers in what I have read. I think it exposes Bush for supporting our enemies, which is true. "

WY wrote on Jan 26, 2007 9:27 PM:

" I couldn't even hear your point becuase you made it sound like every Soldier is a rapest and a murder. And that was all that bellowed in my head! I am turning off my computer. I feel such shame hanging here tonight after what my brother has done for you. "

WY wrote on Jan 26, 2007 9:21 PM:

" It must suck to have to fight so hard for so long and have to read such disaproval by so many, in your very home town. Lodi truly does suck any more. We have Wounded Warriors that read and VETs. OMG... I frick'n hate you!!! MR.MW. Are you so stupid that you can not make you point in any other manner! You think every Soldier is Sceeming on 12 year olds!? OMG I am enraged! "

WY wrote on Jan 26, 2007 9:04 PM:

" WOW... MW You have a pretty low opinion of the Soldiers. Reading your words has brought tears to my eyes. Some of what you say might be true. You have just made me very sick to my stomach with your opinion. I can't believe that you would go on and on about such a bad thing and not say one word good about our Soldiers. This whole blog makes me very sad. Welcome home Brother... "

OTH wrote on Jan 25, 2007 10:18 PM:

" MW.....They already offer citizenship to illelegal aliens who serve time in the military. You might want to updadte your reading material. "

Yo Captain Cozmic- wrote on Jan 25, 2007 10:11 PM:

" Sing it sister, Bush is the best ever! I wish Shrub was a dictator so you, me and the rest of the lemmings could just fall in line and never have to vote or use our noodle again. We can focus on real issues like this new nascar point system or raising the pots at St Annes bingo. Keep up the good work Captain Crunch, ill see ya in church Sunday. "

Mark wrote on Jan 25, 2007 6:31 PM:

" Pull out, before we have to abort the whole misson. "

Leonard wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:27 PM:

" Personally, I would support a return to the Draft. If we, as a nation, are going to fight this war, the burden of fighting it should be born by all Americans. "

end... wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:27 PM:

" To the nations on List 2, a final thought: You might want to learn to speak Arabic. God bless America . Thank you and good night. If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you are reading it in English, thank a soldier. "

cont... wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:26 PM:

" It is time for America to focus on its own welfare and its own citizens. Some will accuse us of isolationism. I answer them by saying, "darn tootin." Nearly a century of trying to help folks live a decent life around the world has only earned us the undying enmity of just about everyone on the planet. It is time to eliminate hunger in America It is time to eliminate homelessness in America . To the nations on List 1, a final thought. Thank you guys. We owe you and we won't forget. "

cont... wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:26 PM:

" We are tired of the one-way highway. Immediately, we'll be drilling for oil in Alaska - which will take care of this country's oil needs for decades to come. If you're an environmentalist who opposes this decision, I refer you to List 2 above: pick a country and move there. They care. "

cont... wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:25 PM:

" Mexico is also on List 2 President Fox and his entire corrupt government really need an attitude a dj ustment. I will have a couple extra tank and infantry divisions sitting around. Guess where I am going to put 'em? Yep, border security. Oh, by the way, the United States is abrogating the NAFTA treaty - starting now. "

cont... wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:25 PM:

" A special note to our neighbors. Canada is on List 2. Since we are likely to be seeing a lot more of each other, you folks might want to try not pissing us off for a change. "

continued... wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:24 PM:

" I have instructed the Mayor of New York City to begin towing the many UN diplomatic vehicles located in Manhattan with more than two unpaid parking tickets to sites where those vehicles will be stripped, shredded and crushed. I don't care about whatever treaty pertains to this. You creeps have tens of thousands of unpaid tickets. Pay those tickets tomorrow or watch your precious Benzes, Beamers and limos be turned over to some of the finest chop shops in the world. I love New York "

continued... wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:23 PM:

" I am ordering the immediate severing of diplomatic relations with France , Germany , and Russia . Thanks for all your help, comrades. We are retiring from NATO as well. Bon chance, mes amis. "

continued... wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:23 PM:

" Need help with a famine ? Wrestling with an epidemic? Call France . In the future, together with Congress, I will work to redirect this money toward solving the vexing social problems we still have at home . On that note, a word to terrorist organizations. Screw with us and we will hunt you down and eliminate you and all your friends from the face of the earth. Thirsting for a gutsy country to terrorize? Try France , or maybe China . "

continued... wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:22 PM:

" Let me start by saying that effective immediately, foreign aid to those nations on List 2 ceases immediately and indefinitely. The money saved during the first year alone will pretty much pay for the costs of the Iraqi war. The American people are no longer going to pour money into third world Hellholes and watch those government leaders grow fat on corruption. "

continued wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:21 PM:

" Before me, I have two lists. One list contains the names of countries which have stood by our side during the Iraq conflict. This list is short. The United Kingdom , Spain , Bulgaria , Australia , and Poland are some of the countries listed there. The other list contains everyone not on the first list. Most of the world's nations are on that list. My press secretary will be distributing copies of both lists later this evening. "

contued.. wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:19 PM:

" This morning I gave the order for a complete removal of all American forces from Iraq This action will be complete within 30 days. It is now time to begin the reckoning. Before me, I have two lists. One list contains the names of countries which have stood by our side during the Iraq conflict. This list is short. The United Kingdom , Spain , Bulgaria , Australia , and Poland are some of the countries listed there. "

sam wrote on Jan 25, 2007 5:19 PM:

" WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO TURN ON THE TV AND HEAR ANY U.S. PRESIDENT, DEMOCRAT OR REPUBLICAN GIVE THE FOLLOWING SPEECH? My Fellow Americans: As you all know, the defeat of the Iraq regime has been completed. Since congress does not want to spend any more money on this war, our mission in Iraq is complete. "

MW wrote on Jan 25, 2007 12:36 PM:

" Maybe we could offer undocumented immigrants free citizenship if they serve for four years? It would solve two problems at once, and it worked in the World Wars and the Civil War. And that might expand our troop base enough that we could rotate our troops more often and hopefully have to deal with less fallout when they crack under stress, and instead focus on stabilizing Iraq enough to leave... as we should be focused. "

MW wrote on Jan 25, 2007 12:34 PM:

" I realize we're short on troops, which is why we have so many soldiers on their third and fourth rotations in combat zones. I feel for the soldiers, I really do. But they are representing the United States over there. Kill insurgents in combat, sure, but hunting down a fourteen-year-old, killing her family, raping her and setting her on fire is a totally different thing. That sort of thing needs to end. Stress is no excuse. "

MW wrote on Jan 25, 2007 12:32 PM:

" Captain America: I agree with you. The troops in Iraq are under a LOT of stress. That does not give them the right to murder and rape civilians. If they are under such stress that they feel the need to do that, they need to visit the psychological teams there to deal with it. And our government needs to be more accomodating of these troops, and rotate them more often. If that means expanding our armed forces, so be it. "

MW wrote on Jan 25, 2007 12:29 PM:

" But Mrs. Miller, when an American citizen disagrees with something, it IS their duty to speak up about it to their elected representatives, or in a public forum if that is ignored. If you disagree with something, it is your right and duty to speak out about it if you expect change. Dissent is American, on any subject, whether it is a liberal, a conservative, or a moderate dissenting. I never tried to say that this duty only applied to things I agree with; in fact, I was careful not to. "

Captain America wrote on Jan 25, 2007 12:17 PM:

" OTR, I guess you'll have to move out of the world. This is the world we live in, Good and evil, The evil will do horrible unspeakable things and the good will try to avoid,curtail,stop whatever they can to live in peace or as much peace as possible. Im curious, do you think that any of the gang activities here involve torture or murder? "

Mrs. Miller wrote on Jan 25, 2007 10:09 AM:

" To:MW - Quoted as saying :"It is the duty of the American people to speak up when those figures whom we have elected are using the power we gave them to do things we disagree with" Had you used the term "I" in place of the "WE" I don't think you and I would be in disagreement. When you say the American people (last I checked I am one)I do not hold YOUR same views. "

Leonard wrote on Jan 25, 2007 9:26 AM:

" Corporal: Due, in part, to my long term involvement with the USO, I also have a number of friends and acquaintences who either are serving or have served in Iraq. From what I hear, things are much worse than what we see in the media. "

OTH wrote on Jan 25, 2007 8:46 AM:

" Captain you need to put your cocktail down, you are way over the top. But just in case I have some thumb screws, some melon baller that would be good for for gounging out eyes. I don't want to live in a country that practices torture on anybody. Do you remember the Golden Rule? Could you torture someone and live with a clean conscience? "

Captain America wrote on Jan 24, 2007 5:55 PM:

" Friends, I also hope we are all educated enough to know that what we are fed on the internet or tv news is far from the whole story and I choose to ask aquaintances who have been there and seen in person what is happening, and its not what we see or hear every single day, its just not. "

Captain AMerica wrote on Jan 24, 2007 5:53 PM:

" Of course not, I believe the job the troops are doing is the most stressful anyone could endure, knowing that, I expect isolated incidents and people who "crack" or "lose it" and let there frustration out on a captive or what they believe is a threat but I know overall its not what really happens on the grand scale. "

Captain America wrote on Jan 24, 2007 5:49 PM:

" cont'd dont blame our troops for it. The people trying to kill them have been trying to kill us before we ever landed in Iraq, its who they are, they are not having a bad hair day people. Im not giving soldiers who brutalize anyone a pass, Im saying bad seeds surface every day in Lodi too does that mean we say the whole community is a bunch of degenerates? "

Captain America wrote on Jan 24, 2007 5:46 PM:

" Ok my good friends, lets agree on this, as humans, there forever will be good and evil, Im 100% positive even the best soldier/man/woman/civilian you choose, after being directly subjected to anger,hate and antagonism from any source would and could FLIP OUT and do the wrong thing by common decency standards. But, "

Captain America wrote on Jan 24, 2007 5:39 PM:

" MW, I hope the trial you propose to give these captures is the War Tribunal as Bush intended, not the version we as citizens have been granted. In my mind the captures once charged should be swiftly dealt with if they offer no assistance to our efforts, I agree with you on that. As any prosecuted criminals, they should be held accountable and punished. "

MW wrote on Jan 24, 2007 11:08 AM:

" The fact of the matter is, if we want to have any legal or moral ground to argue for decent treatment for our troops and punish torture and poor treatment of our troops, WE HAVE TO SET AN EXAMPLE OF THE SAME. Otherwise, we're whining because others are treating us the same way we're treating them. That doesn't mean let terrorists go with nuclear secrets, that means giving them a quick, fair trial and imprisoning them or executing them upon a guilty verdict, rather than torturing them in a prison for four years with no trial in sight. "

MW wrote on Jan 24, 2007 11:05 AM:

" When it comes to military and diplomatic power, the U.S. is very much stronger than any other country in the world (e.g., the teenager when every other country is a child in power). If we allow our soldiers to act as they have been acting, it turns other countries against us. We started the war in Afghanistan with every country in the world at our back. Now they've all turned their backs. It's certainly not because we're being too nice. "

MW wrote on Jan 24, 2007 11:02 AM:

" Captain America: Where did I advocate americanizing terrorists or simply asking them to play nice? Terrorists need to be taken out before they harm others, no doubt. Murdering and raping civilians and tormenting children in Iraq and Afghanistan doesn't take out terrorists. It can be argued that it makes new ones. That needs to stop. "

Leonard wrote on Jan 24, 2007 10:51 AM:

" During the Irish Revolution, the IRA had a policy of purposefully trying to provoke British atrocities because they knew that for every man tortured by the British there would be 5 new recruits for the Republican cause. "

Leonard wrote on Jan 24, 2007 10:49 AM:

" Corporal America: If Malikcahi and his Iranian allies invaded America, tortured my father, raped my sister and murdered my brother while I was powerless to stop him, I would probably strap on a couple pounds of explosives if I thought I could take a couple Iranian soldiers with me. Applying your tactics (to use the word loosely) will only increase the attacks on US forces exponentially. Every man you torture has a brother a cousin or a wife who is perfectly capable of following in their footsteps. "

Captain America wrote on Jan 24, 2007 7:58 AM:

" IE: Here Mr Bad Guy,if you promise not to rob, rape or shoot me, I'll give you this gun and my wallet. Ok, here you go, now you promised. Here sign this treaty Mr. Bad Guy, you promise not to build any Nuclear Bombs now right? Ok, here's some plutonium for your electric plant, remember, you promised. Result, good people robbed and shot and bombs in the making. "

Captain America wrote on Jan 24, 2007 7:52 AM:

" The only thing terrorist understand is pain, torture and murder and you want to americanize them so they will be nice? This is exactly why its taking so long and troops are dying. Hell, your ideas dont even work here! The terrorist want to die and take as many Americans with them in the process. "

Captain America wrote on Jan 24, 2007 7:47 AM:

" MW, What the hell kind of correlation is this you draw "Would you advise a teenager to hit and kick and pinch their younger siblings and call them names because heck, the younger kids are doing it anyway? This is your comparison issue to war? A sibling rivalry? Pinching? We have to set the example of fairnes? You are OUT OF YOUR MIND! "

nylodian wrote on Jan 24, 2007 6:51 AM:

" MW and Leonard: I'm with you! If that makes me a "Leftie" so be it(although I'm right handed, lol), but it is an ignorant cop-out to assume I don't support our troops (there's Navy and Marine vets in my family), or I don't love our country because I disagree with our current president's policies. "

MW wrote on Jan 24, 2007 1:03 AM:

" Brian: I would remind you that the people most fixated on this sex scandel were the leaders of the GOP. If I remember correctly, Bill Clinton actually wanted to send in SCUD missiles to take out some terrorist camps after a couple of embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed, but Hyde, Rogan, etc. were too fixated on having live witnesses to the scandal to bother focusing on a threat to our national security. "

MW wrote on Jan 24, 2007 12:59 AM:

" Captain America: "Also, MW, I am concerned over your fixation on the sexual deviance you present." Wow, did you learn how to make ad hominem attacks on your high school debate team? I know that rapes and murders are committed in Lodi and Stockton on a regular basis, but our government isn't paying those murderers to bring peace to the cities, are they? It's a different situation as far as power goes, but the punishment should be the same for all criminals who rape and murder, whether they hide behind a uniform or not. "

MW wrote on Jan 24, 2007 12:56 AM:

" Captain America: Would you advise a teenager to hit and kick and pinch their younger siblings and call them names because heck, the younger kids are doing it anyway? Might as well not bother setting an example! Who cares if the teenager is much stronger and has more resources than his five year old sister, the girl pinched him, so she got what was coming, right? Now replace 'teen' and 'younger sister' with the U.S. and any other country in the world. "

MW wrote on Jan 24, 2007 12:55 AM:

" Captain America: "I could only pray Americans were treated the way you want to treat hostiles that we catch." I pray that too, daily, especially since I have friends and family in both Iraq and Afghanistan. But if we really want our soldiers treated with respect and our civilians treated with respect, then we need to show that we're willing to do the same, whether we're the only country who follows the Geneva Convention or not. Otherwise, why should anyone else bother. We're the example. "

MW wrote on Jan 24, 2007 12:52 AM:

" Mrs. Miller: The fact remains, however, that everyone who chooses to participate in our political system by voting grants it authenticity, whether or not their cadidate wins or loses. If the founding fathers had not expected everyday people to make "international decisions" they would not have made this nation a republic but a monarchy. Obviously I feel myself educated enough to make decisions which affect the world, or I wouldn't be a registered voter. The same goes for every other voter in the U.S. "

MW wrote on Jan 24, 2007 12:51 AM:

" Mrs. Miller: When did I ever say that everyone in America had voted for or against Bush? The U.S. runs on majority rule, and the majority put him in place, just as the majority censured him in the most recent election but putting the Dems in power. Did I ever say which side I was on? Maybe you shouldn't jump to conclusions based on my opinion about one issue (the current war in Iraq). "

Brian wrote on Jan 23, 2007 7:18 PM:

" He said everything she wished she could say but then again if she said those things she would then agree with him and that would show just how much the Democratic leadership hasn't had a clue because it's always been the Republicans with all the ideas. "

Brian wrote on Jan 23, 2007 7:17 PM:

" You really show your true colors Dan by calling Bush an America hater even though it's always been the Republicans that have a vested interest in the safety and security of America. I see Bush on TV leaving the chambers and how many people love the man. I got a kick out of Nancy Pelosi chomping at the bit while he spoke. "

Brian wrote on Jan 23, 2007 7:12 PM:

" Dan, Don't try to put words in my mouth. The fact that there were many warnings in 8/01 further proves more how the Clinton administration didn't pay attention to the terror threats and did everything they could to cover up the threats because the Democrats were on a roll with him being President for two terms. Even Clinton has admitted he didn't do enough. Now that Bush has taken the bull by the horns all we get is criticism from the left. "

sam wrote on Jan 23, 2007 5:30 PM:

" Leonard, I agree with you. Bush makes us all look so incompetent, the same way Vietnam made us look. I VOTED for him. I actually believed him. I am so sorry I did. We need new leadership. NOT another Cinton though, please. "

sam wrote on Jan 23, 2007 5:22 PM:

" MW, great comments. "

Dan wrote on Jan 23, 2007 10:37 AM:

" Brian, what sense are you trying to make? That we should invade Iraq (which had NOTHING to do with 9/11) because you believe Clinton caused the attacks of 9/11/01 because Bush was on vacation and slept through all the warnings during the month of 8/01? Whatever Clinton did ot didn't do almost ten years ago is not cause for invading Iraq by Bush and his band of America Haters. "

Leonard wrote on Jan 23, 2007 10:00 AM:

" During the 1990's the terrorists may have been emboldened by their BELIEF that they could stand up to the military might of the US and get away with it. Now, thanks to pResident Bush's monumental incompetence, the terrorists KNOW that they can take the US on and not only survive but actually emerge stronger. Bush's blunders in Iraq have been a dream come true for Osama bin Laden and his immitators. "

Dan wrote on Jan 23, 2007 5:20 AM:

" quote Corporal Amemia: "Ours is the only country that even winks at the Geneva Convention...snip...We should absolutely TORTURE verified captures in WHATEVER way we have to." Do you even realize the idiocy you post? "

Leonared wrote on Jan 23, 2007 2:26 AM:

" Hey Captain America: I'm glad you are down with torturing prisoners because I just sent in a anonymous tip that you are a terrorist. I don't know why I think that, its just a gut feeling and I may be wrong but I may be right. I guess we will know the truth after you've spent a couple months down at Gitmo with a car battery hooked up to your testicles. "

Brian wrote on Jan 22, 2007 9:56 PM:

" They knew that the leadership was busy with sexual scandals instead of building our military, building our intelligence, increasing America's defense and staying on the lookout for anyone wishing our country harm. "

Brian wrote on Jan 22, 2007 9:56 PM:

" So what signal did the United States send to the Islamic terrorists during eight years of the Clinton administration? For eight years the United States military defense budget was depleted. For eight years the US government was a social development center of political correctness, political corruption and arrogance while the Chinese stole our military secrets. The United States was in the middle of a slumber party while the Islamists were organizing, training, recruiting and infiltrating our country and counting on our blindness, carelessness and ignorance. "

I think 70% of America is "We" Mrs Miller! wrote on Jan 22, 2007 9:18 PM:

" Sadley our President was only a C average student that made it into Yale on the legacy program thanks to Daddy. Nobody is claiming that International decisions about National security are simple Mrs Miller but with all due respect when our President and his Admin tell all of us that Iraq has direct connections to 9/11 and are making WMD to use on us some day, they better be damn sure of it b/4 they send our kids and 400 billion dollors into harms way. "

Captain America wrote on Jan 22, 2007 6:52 PM:

" Also, MW, I am concerned over your fixation on the sexual deviance you present. Get help! There is as much brutality in Lodi and Stockton in just the same methods you describe. Is that Bush's fault too? "

Captain America wrote on Jan 22, 2007 6:48 PM:

" cont'd To get the absolute most from them we can. If we fail to do so, we lose, but thats what you want anyway, Cuhm by yah right? I am truly scared for you lefties, so much hate for America and so little rational common sense. "

Captain America wrote on Jan 22, 2007 6:45 PM:

" Hey MW, Put away the laptop and close your You tube account, go outside and play on the swing for awhile. You need to change your source of information. War is not nice and cuddly,Ours is the only country that even winks at the Geneva Convention, I could only pray Americans were treated the way you want to treat hostiles that we catch. We should absolutely TORTURE verified captures in WHATEVER way we have to. "

Leonard wrote on Jan 22, 2007 6:36 PM:

" Mr Miller: Is President Bush wise enough to run this country's foreign policy? This is a man who has failed at every job he has ever been given. His failure as President of the United States is merely the latest in a string of disgraceful fiascoes. I may not necessarily agree that we should pull out of Iraq but I cannot deny the necessity of removing this incompetent disaster of a President from power just as soon as impeachment proceedings can be convened. "

Mrs. Miller wrote on Jan 22, 2007 3:54 PM:

" MW: I think you might think twice before you encompass the nation with your WE statement. I for one do not agree with you! "

Mrs. Miller wrote on Jan 22, 2007 3:54 PM:

" MW: have you ever held a public office? Are you educated enought to make international decisions? Are you wise enough to second guess our commander in Chief and give him the direction that will lead the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA to a path of Peace & Harmony in the world? Do you truly have the scope of the enormity and the authority of the situation in Iraq that you can tell a teenager that WE disagree with the President? "

Carl B. wrote on Jan 21, 2007 4:06 PM:

" On Tuesday Jan 23, the Senate Committee on Foreign Relations will hold a hearing to investigate "oil and reconstruction strategy in Iraq." This offers a critical opportunity to demand a cessation of all U.S. government and corporate influence over Iraqis as to the future of their oil. Maybe the LNS can tune into C-span that day and report the next day, What a concept! "

Carl B. wrote on Jan 21, 2007 3:51 PM:

" The Bush admin and U.S. oil companies (among others) are quite simply (and obscenely)taking advantage of an occupied, war-ravaged and internally divided nation to get control over as much oil as possible, and on the best possible terms. They are holding our troops-and the Iraqi people-hostage in order to get it.But, the removal of the Production Sharing Agreements (PSA)makes clear that the extensive (although unreported) popular opposition and organizing in Iraq, the U.S. Britain and elswhere against PSAs has succeeded, at least for now. "

MW wrote on Jan 21, 2007 3:40 PM:

" To Captain America: Also, since when do American soldiers need to taunt thirsty child beggers with water in a desert to be effective fighters? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9A_vxIOB-I I call B.S. on this comment. American soldiers can be effective fighters without being brutes who rape, torture, murder, pillage, and taunt the people they're supposed to be bringing freedom and democracy to. "

MW wrote on Jan 21, 2007 3:38 PM:

" To Captain America: Since when do soldiers need to be able to murder civilians (as in a recent court martial case) to be effective fighters? Since when do soldiers need to rape 14-year-old girls, set them on fire and kill their families to be effective fighters? Since when do U.S. hired mercenaries need to rape Iraqi women at roadside checkpoints to be effective fighters? Since when do American soldiers need to sexually assault prisoners and menace them with dogs to be effective fighters? "

MW wrote on Jan 21, 2007 3:35 PM:

" To Lodi Student: There is a place and time to respect authority, but the United States is a republic. We voted to put those leaders into place. Their authority comes from the American people, and their actions are the responsibility of the American people. It is the duty of the American people to speak up when those figures whom we have elected are using the power we gave them to do things we disagree with. "

Carl B. to LNS.. wrote on Jan 21, 2007 3:33 PM:

" The Bush admin and its oil company cohorts have worked toward the passage of a new oil law for Iraq that would turn its natoinalized oil system over to private foreign corporate control.On Thursday, Jan 18, this dream came one step closer to reaity when an Iraqi negotiating committee of "national and regional leaders" approved a new hydrocarbon law.The committee chair,Deputy Prime Minister Barham Salih,told Reuters that the draft will go to the Iraqi cabinet next week and, if approved, to the parliament immediately thereafter. "

Carl B. wrote on Jan 21, 2007 3:17 PM:

" Also here is a window into how Republican Senators voted on an amendment to change the emergency supplemental to provide an additional $213 million in funding for armored humvees. 39 total "NAYs" with 38 of those votes coming from Republicans. Who supports the troops?? "

Carl B. wrote on Jan 21, 2007 2:49 PM:

" Democracy is not a spectator sport Bush-Davidians. put down the weiner Savage, Sean Insanity,and Rush Limpdongs and try some real info from folks that have served and are serving now! The web address for Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America, http://www.iava.org/index.php "

Richard McIntyre wrote on Jan 21, 2007 11:08 AM:

" Hey everybody, I found a cool little video on youtube.com. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IXIrqYjrvs. It's the so-called enemy, Saddam Hussein, shaking hands with Donald Rumsfeld and carrying on a long conversation. Two peas in a pod, if you ask me. "

dumbfounded wrote on Jan 21, 2007 5:33 AM:

" Lyndon Johnson figured out how he and his friends could get richer on the Viet Nam war. I suspect George Jr. has done the same. We just don't have the benefit of history to tell us so yet. Whatever the "good" reason is for out continued stay in Iraq, it isn't good enough. Bring the troops home. "

Daniel wrote on Jan 20, 2007 11:32 PM:

" The president exposed his objective when he complained that if the USA doesn't invade Iraq, then the UN would become an irrelevant debating society. His objective is to empower the UN although it will make the American congress into an irrelevant debating society. The government installed is a UN puppet regime, and troops are for enforcing it. "

Brian wrote on Jan 20, 2007 4:16 PM:

" There's many in the military who would just love to take the author out to the woodshed and slap him around a little bit. Danny Bonaduci would be right there with them to lend a hand. "

Brian wrote on Jan 20, 2007 4:10 PM:

" I see you're right in touch with Iran's plans to take over power in Iraq once we leave. Oh, it is our job to protect our democracy. That's why we're there. Looks like the liberals are going to cut the funding if we leave Iraq and we'll have mass slaughtering of innocent lives much like when the funding was cut when we left Vietnam. I'll give the liberals credit for being consistent, though. "

Brian wrote on Jan 20, 2007 4:06 PM:

" LNS, You say our armed forces are so tied up in Iraq that if there were another conflict there wouldn't be enough armed forces left to go into this conflict? That's ridiculious. They want some form of democracy over there. I see you're busy parrotting the liberal medai sources in saying that most Iraqis don't want to adopt our values of individual and religious freedom. You might as well raise that white flag right now like Wolf Blitzer and his croanies do. "

Carl B. to LNS "Time to pull out of Iraq" wrote on Jan 20, 2007 2:54 PM:

" Ya think......? "

loubranch wrote on Jan 20, 2007 11:56 AM:

" The News-Sentinel is to be commended for now advocating a pull-out from that hell we call Iraq. You correctly pointed out that the tyrant Saddam Hussein is dead and gone. Sacrificing more of our troops and our dollars will serve no useful purpose. It is now the responsibility of the Iraqi government and its people to handle their own affairs. That is unlikely to happen but we have done our part and to lose one more life would be a tragedy. Enough is enough!! "

wtf wrote on Jan 20, 2007 11:44 AM:

" The LNS sounds like it's on the right track; however, whitewashing Bush's fiasco is not and I have to take exception to the LNS comment, "We don't think oil drove America to war." http://www.nzherald.co.nz/category/story.cfm?c_id=37&objectid=10418086&ref=emailfriend Plus there should be more investigation into what really drove the U.S. into this mess and who *really* benefits from this - the American people sure aren't. http://www.thenation.com/doc/20041004/dreyfuss I agree with what Dan said; he's right on point. "

Richard McIntyre wrote on Jan 20, 2007 10:54 AM:

" Our so-called "democratic" government is more like a "hypocritic" government yet we continue to push this idea of democracy on other nations, by force I might add, all the while having failed to implement a pure democratic government of our own. If one stops accepting what's on the surface and trluy investigates the matter, getting beyond silly (deceptive) slogans and terms, one will quickly conclude that the word hypocrisy is a better fit than democracy. "

Lodi Student wrote on Jan 20, 2007 10:37 AM:

" What happened to respecting authority? Bush has reasons to do what he is doing and we as the public may have no right to know what those reasons are. How does that make us look, to assume that we have all the facts? I'm just as scared as anyone else about the 21,500 new troops in Iraq, especially considering the fact that my brother is 19 years old and ripe for any draft that may occur, but Bush is our president, and we owe it to the office, if not to the man himself, to respect these decisions. "

Dan wrote on Jan 20, 2007 9:27 AM:

" quote: "...President Bush has showed a modicum of courage in admitting mistakes such as the WMD fiasco." WHAT??! You mean when he playfully searched under the sofa and behind the drapes in the Oval Office? Or when he magnanimously shouldered the blame with his ridiculous "When mistakes were made..." speech? Bush has showed "a modicum" of courage only with the lives and money of others. "

To LNS wrote on Jan 20, 2007 6:59 AM:

" I agree with you. It's time to pull out and that is starting NOW. Enough is enough. "

Captain America wrote on Jan 20, 2007 6:36 AM:

" Marty, Put down your crack pipe and send the other editors out to do some real work. The only mistakes made have been the Political Correctness limitations put on the troops ie:prisoner kindness, restricted engagemnet etc. They are restricted form being effective fighters! I'd love to see the country made into a parking lot to begin a new, but not until Pelosi and the Dem's take up residence there. "

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