Hayat, informant talks weighed

Discussions reveal jihad interest by Lodian, but don't prove attendance to terror camp

Hamid Hayat once told an undercover FBI informant that he "never ever considered himself an American," and was interested in holy war.

Hamid Hayat

But his descriptions of possible terror training camps were based on a video and guesses, and so far prosecutors have shown a federal jury no proof that the 23-year-old Lodi man actually attended a training camp.

In transcripts of secretly recorded conversations with informant Naseem Khan, Hayat appears to be trying to impress Khan. Yet, even after he went to Pakistan and called Khan, Hayat said he was sleeping in late and hanging out with friends — not attending a terror training camp.

Jurors in Hayat's terrorism trial spent all of Thursday reading and listening to the transcripts. Assistant U.S. Attorney Laura Ferris selected portions of the transcripts to be read aloud, and jurors followed along.

Hayat, who is charged with lying to the FBI and with providing material support to terrorists, is accused of attending training camps in 2003 and 2004. His father, whose trial is now scheduled to start Wednesday, is charged with lying to the FBI.

Earlier this week, an FBI agent acknowledged that he had no proof other than Hayat's own words that he had attended a training camp.

Khan, whom the FBI has paid about $250,000 to infiltrate Lodi's Muslim community after 2001, vanished from Lodi after the federal investigation became public last June. Dozens of FBI agents descended on Lodi, ultimately arrested Hayat and his father, and detained two Muslim religious leaders who were later deported for immigration violations.

The slim, dark-haired Khan had worked his way into the community to the point that Hayat even invited him to his wedding in Pakistan, according to the transcripts.

The two spent hours together in 2003, and Hayat showed Khan a scrapbook containing yellowed newspaper clippings showing a weapon, the leader of a group the U.S. considers a terrorist organization and people setting tires on fire. Jurors saw those photos Thursday.

In many of the conversations read aloud Thursday, Khan appeared to be leading Hayat. Khan said more than once that he wanted to go to jihad — the Arabic word for "holy war" — and Hayat said, "No, man, these days, there's no use in doing that."

Later, on March 11, 2003, Khan asked Hayat if they could go jihad. Hayat replied: "Why can't we go? It's our duty as Muslims to go and help other Muslims." In another part of a conversation, Hayat said he was ready to go to jihad, but that his mother wouldn't let him; the two had talked about the fact that the mother has final say in such matters.

Hayat appeared to be bragging at times, talking about how his grandfather was offered a high position in the Pakistani government and had written books. Another time, several pages of conversation revolved around an acquaintance of Hayat's who had allegedly trained in a terror camp.

Hayat also bragged to Khan about a very distant relative who blew up himself and six other people in Pakistan. Khan mentioned that the man must be brave and Hayat replied, "Man, if I had a gun, friend, I wouldn't be able to shoot it, and he — he blew up his own self."

At one point, Hayat said he sent money to a group that spends money on "weapons, books and everything."

Later, Khan offered to send money for Hayat and suggested ways to do so, but there was no indication that money was transferred.

When Hayat talked about being anti-American, he told Khan about a conversation he had with a friend who curses America.

"He cusses America, right? He tells me, 'My friend, don't you get offended, I'm abusing your country.' I said, 'Man this country is mine in name only, understand? My heart is in Pakistan,' I told him."

And, one time Hayat began talking about training camps in Pakistan — then acknowledged that he only knew about them because he'd watched a video.

The trial resumes Tuesday in U.S. District Judge Garland E. Burrell Jr.'s Sacramento courtroom.

Contact reporter Layla Bohm at layla@lodinews.com.

First published: Friday, February 24, 2006 5:53:50 AM